(READ THIS AS IF I AM YELLING AT YOU) I am getting pissed off!
I have been reading so many threads that mention sore and injured shoulders from swimming.
Swimming yardage correctly does not make your shoulders sore. Wearing paddles does not make your shoulders sore.
Swimming with improper technique DOES make your shoulders sore. Using a wide swinging arm recover will make your shoulders sore. Using paddles which focus on your fingers instead of palm might make your shoulders sore.
Learn how to recover your arms close to your body. Keep your fingers close to the water. Release the back of your stroke and you will not get injured! Ease into the catch of your stroke and you will protect your shoulders.
Modern swimming technique is all designed so that your shoulders will last through mega yardage workouts. You will be exhausted before you injure your shoulders if you learn how to swim properly.
WHoa there big fella, take a deep breath. If you do any sport with proper technique you will not get injured. I would bet 95% of the people on this site do not have a swimming background and therefore will get injured using paddles. The person who began the paddle and fin stated he had prior shoulder trouble which sounds to me he has mechanical faults in his stroke. I would never reccomend paddles without seeing the person swim first. Paddles can be a great aid but they can also be a great destroyer also.
It’s not my shoulders that get sore, it’s my forearms on the top side. I think that’s where the finger muscles that keep your fingers closed, next to each other, are. We’ll, I don’t start feeling it until about 1500 yds straight and pushing.
By no means an expert here, but just from a statistical standpoint isn’t a blanket statement like “do “X” and “Y” will not happen” a bit falicious?
Seems to me that with all the differences from one person to another that the exact same technique will indeed cause issues with one and not another.
I know I’ve seen people run, bike and swim forever using technique’s that would land me on injured reserve list after one workout. However they seem to do just fine and even excell.
While you can hurt your shoulder with poor technique, you can certainly get overuse shoulder injuries from increasing your swimming yardage too quickly. Telling people that are novice swimmers that this cannot happen is incredibly irresponsible on your part.
That makes sense to me. When my shoulder starts to hurt, it is that motion from lifting it from your site to a 90 degree angle that hurts the most. It is the same motion for a wide arm swing. When my shoulder is hurting, it actually feels better when I use the paddles. It must make me focus better on my arm motion.
Doug, I had my 1500 down to 25 minutes in the pool and got in done in 31 minutes at Wildflower. I only started swimming in February 2-3 times a week and I really believe I made the most progress after your essay on “the flip.” Best cyber coaching ever. Thanks.
“Swimming with improper technique DOES make your shoulders sore. Using a wide swinging arm recover will make your shoulders sore. Using paddles which focus on your fingers instead of palm might make your shoulders sore.” “Swimming yardage correctly does not make your shoulders sore”
Doug I LMFAO at your post! Not to burst your bubble b/c I agree with you 100% but your on the wrong board to be saying this. This board is all about the latest aero wheels, aero frames and that goofy aero helmet. It’s about people trying to choose between 120 and 130 psi in their race tires or brand X or brand Y tyre just to knock off another 4 secs. It’s not about saving 3, 5, 7 or 10+ mins or more on even a 1.5K swim. Goodness that would be the worst way to invest $200-400 (please re-read that sentence w/extra sarcasm). People don’t want to know or believe that the best bang for thier buck is in investing $200-300 in a stroke coach.
BTW next time your in PHX let me know. I need a good pair of eyes to look at my left hand as I briefly lose water after the catch as I begin to pull back.
I agree though that swimming w/good technique is less taxing, easier on the body and much faster than swimming w/poor technique and will yield bigger time savings than all the aero goodies that the overwhelming majority of triathletes can currently buy.
Stay on this board long enough and you’ll really be pissed off about people swimming poorly and doing it well.
A wide arm recovery places a tremendous stress on you shoulders. Think of a lever. Your shoulder is the fulcrum, the shorter the lever the smaller the moment of force. The closer you can keep your hand to your body the less stress on your shoulder and the straighter your line of recovery. A swinging arm is a ballistic movement and will cause your hips to go lateral.
After seeing competitive swimmers for 50 years I have noticed certain patterns evolving. Just about everyone from my generation of swimming has gotten shoulder problems. We were told to finish our strokes and whip our arms backward. The new generation of swimmers will not have these same problems. The informtion is out there. Yes, there are general principles and everyone is different. Some world champions still have a straight arm recovery but they are few and far between.
If we learn how to recover our arms we lessen the chance for injury and increase the longevity of the sport.
Knowledge is power. Along with learning how to swim correctly comes an appropriate training schedlule. If someone is going to take the time to learn how to swim, which takes a considerable amount of time they will build their yardage accordingly.
Doug I LMFAO at your post! Not to burst your bubble b/c I agree with you 100% but your on the wrong board to be saying this. This board is all about the latest aero wheels, aero frames and that goofy aero helmet. It’s about people trying to choose between 120 and 130 psi in their race tires or brand X or brand Y tyre just to knock off another 4 secs. It’s not about saving 3, 5, 7 or 10+ mins or more on even a 1.5K swim. Goodness that would be the worst way to invest $200-400 (please re-read that sentence w/extra sarcasm). People don’t want to know or believe that the best bang for thier buck is in investing $200-300 in a stroke coach.
DD, I think you are likely referring to me (among many others here), and I object! Show me all the local great stroke coaches I can go see for any price (let alone a mere $200-$300). When I started swimming late last year, other than TI, I had a bitch of a time finding ANYONE to get lessons from. After LOTS of searching and asking around, I eventually saw a former Oly silver medalist who teaches for a living. Sadly, even though I’m sure she’s an awesome instructor, those technique changes are what set off my impingement problems, and sent me directly to physical therapy. My point is that 1) great ones are hard to find, and 2) even those great ones might not work for you.
Doug, I’m still waiting for a good work excuse to be in NYC. And when I am, I’m coming to see you! And if I don’t get out to NYC, hopefully I’ll be able to handle the yardage that would make Curacao (sp?) worthwhile next winter (even if it means surgery before then so I can do it!).
Couldn’t agree with you more. So many people with swimming flaws, so little time. However, these poor bastards pay good money for lessons and the your training tips and free postings are not helping.
Let’s preach the S-Pull and TI techniques until the entire board is suffering and demanding the right to pay $250/hr for lessons. I’m sure I can find the pool time for them.
Leave the rest of the gear heads to my orthopedic buds who will make enough money repairing shoulders to pay for a third house in St. Thomas VI. Make that a 4th house since the’ve been fixing swimmers for the past 6 years.
Like my surgeon bud says: " The bigger the hand paddle, the bigger the house". IMO, hand paddles should be avoided for training until you can swim pain free and impecable technique.
I am the fin/paddle guy you are referring to. I have a STRONG swimming background (including years of competitive swimming), and I consider my technique to be pretty good. The stroke issues I had came from two things - 1) aggravation of a non-swimming related injury, which lead to over-compensation problems to protect the injury, and 2) over-training. The prior shoulder problem was due to a torn rotator cuff that I chose to not have surgically repaired, and rather tried rehab techniques to strengthen to surrounding muscles & ligaments. I didn’t want to deal with the eventual arthritic problems that it would eventually cause.
I was asking the question about the paddles & fins as I have not been using training aids at all the last couple years and did not use them much in the past either. Back then, it was just big yardage and lots of pool time. I don’t have the time to train as well as I’d like, so I want to up the quality of the workout.
