all
i do not kick at all when i swim - or at least that is what i thought - i went to a swim stroke clinic and got myself filmed and there i was not kicking only i was an had this awful scissor kick which worsened as i got progressively tired
i can knock out a 1:15 half marathon and my cycling is pretty good but swimming just tires me out - there are no easy swims for me
any tips - i read the scissor kick is my bodys reaction to over gliding, to stay afloat ?
thanks
I see so many people doing that at my team’s swim practice and it always happens when they are taking a breath. Is that what happens to you?
jaretj
very much so - good observation and particularly bad when i breath to my left
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all
i do not kick at all when i swim - or at least that is what i thought - i went to a swim stroke clinic and got myself filmed and there i was not kicking only i was an had this awful scissor kick which worsened as i got progressively tired
i can knock out a 1:15 half marathon and my cycling is pretty good but swimming just tires me out - there are no easy swims for me
any tips - i read the scissor kick is my bodys reaction to over gliding, to stay afloat ?
thanks
2 words.
Kick. Board.
Crossing center can often be a big cause of a scissor kick. Your body is smart and it when someone crosses center with an extending arm the body will attempt to find balance by using the legs.
I’m not a swim coach but I used to have that problem, this is how I fixed it.
First, get a kick board and practice your kick. It should be tight as if you were inside a 1 foot tube and your feet can only go so far. Practice, practice, practice.
It doesn’t have to be that hard and you probably won’t get a lot of propulsion from it but you will develop a rhythm and the feeling of a low drag kick. Concentrate on how that feels.
Do your sets and concentrate on kicking within that tube you imagined. Do that all of the time for weeks. After maybe 6 weeks it will start comming natural to you but you will still always have to concentrate on it until it’s gone. You will probably be at a 6 beat kick by then, again it doesn’t have to be hard, it’s the rhythm you are looking for.
Hope this helps
jaretj
much appreciated, my worst fears, lots of kicking
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As an anonymous internet poster from 1,000 miles away, having never seen your stroke, I am going to disagree with everyone that is saying this is a kicking problem.
I have seen this again and again as a compensation for an overrotation problem. The problem then cascades to a massive crossover the center with the non-breathing arm, during the breath. Then the swimmer swims like a snake with hips all over the place, forcing the scissors kick.
Some swimmers get worse at this as they get tired and try to prolong the face out of water for their breath. They often have an exaggerated head movement that then forces the overrotation, which forces the crossover, which forces the scissors kick.
With some swimmers I see normal rotation combined with a lack of flexibility in the shoulder joint forcing the arm to crossover, they literally cannot keep their arm from crossing over. But the end result is the same scissors kick.
Besides the flexibility, the cure is learning how to breath without turning your head so far, especially when tired.
Last of course is fitness, or at least learning how to maintain form when tired.
Now, post a video that is completely different, so I can be wrong.
I think you make good points and without a video it’s difficult to know the root of the problem. Since he didn’t say anything about a crossover I felt the issue was leaning towards over-rotating while breathing and maybe a tight kick would help correct that.
So is his poor stroke driving the poor kick or is the poor kick driving the poor stroke it’s difficult to tell.
jaretj
With all your running, and being new to swimming, you most likely have very tight ankles and hips. That’s a big factor in your kick as it is now. Solution: use fins and kick lots to increase flexibility.
You might also have natural breaststroke feet. If you walk toes out and have trouble plantar flexing, you may have a natural breaststroke kick. Great for competing in breaststroke, but a detriment to freestyle unless you work on the kick with fins to stretch out those ligaments and tendons.
my flexibility in my ankles is shockingly bad - that i do know - i do not cross over the center line but i do tend to “over-breath” as i get tired - i start off pretty good (i am told) and then it all gets a bit messy - thanks all, much appreciated
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Now that I think about it, even if the kick is not the root cause, it may be a better recommendation for him. Things are related enough in swim that a fix to a symptom often forces a change somewhere else.
It will be far easier for him to understand and implement using a kickboard than thinking about all the stuff I just told him, with no evident downside.
So, to revise my blind, distant, anonymous advice, I still suspect other issues, but the kickboard is a good prescription for now.
X2 on the crossover and kick sets. It took almost a year to find my kick, and now I can’t live without it. Went through the whole rationalization thing; I don’t need it, tri athletes don’t kick anyway, etc. Hooey, you need it and it adds balance to your overall stroke.
I started kicking with fins and a kickboard. The kickboard helped unlock and unlimber my shoulder girdle and helped get my arms extended. The fins helped my ankle flexibility and allowed me to make some progress up and down the pool.Do a kick set every workout. Every workout. I had cramps at first, but they went away after a while. Every workout.
Try kick sets, sans kickboard, in which you’re rotating your body (along the axis that runs from the middle of your head to between you feet) through 45% and 90% (both clockwise and counterclockwise). This will help with balance generally, and also (if I read correctly) help you keep your kicking in a “tube.”
Sometimes, wayward legs get that way to help you with balance. This drill helps you propel yourself with your legs/feet, and removes any counterbalancing your arms or head or crossover (or other) strokes might do. (For example, w/ a kickboard, when you get tired, the board often sways from left to right, like the way a bike does when your pedal stroke or position gets sloppy.)
So, arms extended, tight core, kick on different “sides” and move yourself down the pool in a straight line.
And, do all those other drills, too, they sound like great advice.
Andrew Moss
In addition to the kick board, use fins. They will force you into the proper movements easier, and will also help to strengthen your ankles.
B R E A T H E
A breath is what one takes when one breathes.
There. Now back to your kicking.
Another good way to tighten up your kick is streamlined while on your back.