gang, over the weekend i ran 9:30’s for a training run of 5 miles. it was hot (why i can’t get my butt out the door before noon is beyond me) and i had to walk a little. my goal is to run 8:30’s in a 10K race, and ultimately, train 8:30 minute miles (to run a sub 8 pace).
i just started running again about 5 weeks ago, and am doing running 2 times a week, in which I’ll increase to 3 times a week soon. the 3 times a week “formula” will look like this over the next 6 months: one 3 mile run, steady pace (hills included) one 3 mile run, small tempo set within the 3 miles (some small hills, but will try to keep most of it flat) one long run starting with 6 miles and building on this run, hopefully up to 13-15 miles. (hilly)in general, how long will it take to get to this 8:30 race pace and eventually training pace? or, is that a stupid question and impossible to know? HA!
I can’t tell how fast you will progress, but I suggest moving to 3 runs as soon as possible, with the 3rd run being a 20 min or so easy run. Next add a 4th run of 20 minutes easy and slowly increase the length of one of the short easy runs to build mileage.
I am a big fan of Hal Higdon. Check out the training programs on the left side. Maybe one of the half-mary plan would be what you are looking for. Pretty general, but he provides a good outline for people like you and me.
so basically, you suggest 4 runs a week. this is what i did for marathons, and it worked out well, with 3 (steady/hilly), 3-6 (tempo), 3 (fast intervals) and long run.
this week i’ll do the 3 3 milers this week, and next week do 4 3 milers and the week after that build on one. that’s good–not too much volume, but enough to create a change in the pace.
plus, i’ll go get a book–probably hal or somebody like that. all of the books i had were given to goodwill some time ago when i had given up on running again. it will be fun to get new ones for many reasons
KC,
If you want to run 8:30s in a 10K, your first goal should be to do it in a 5K. I would say that to show improvement the easiest way would be to work up to running a minimum of 5 days a week. At this point, I don’t think the tempo run is going to help much.
I don’t think anybody will be able to tell you how long it will take to do the 8:30s though with only the info we have here.
In general, your general aerobic pace (the one where you can still talk while running) is 1.5-2 minutes slower than your 10k pace, so to have 8:30 be your “training pace” will take a while.
wow, i’m nervous to do 5 runs a week (with this recovering knee) i didn’t even do that for marathons and still ran 8:00-8:30 for upwards of 15 miles. i’ll have to think about that–but i can see how the extra volume will make a difference. maybe i could do it in the water.
our of curiosity, why do you think tempo won’t do anything?
yasso 800s are a great way to increase speed at a predictable level. if you’re not familiar, search on the runners world site for yasso 800 or bart yasso.
you weren’t specific about your tempo workout; it will help i’m sure, but you might want a little more volume and another day of speed depending on how demanding your tempo run is.
I think you need to mention that you are getting back into running AFTER a knee in jury that is not completely fixed YET So these guys don’t have you running 4-5 times a week right off the bat. IMO, you don’t need to worry about speed right now, that will likely increase your risk of injuries. i would build the base comfortably, without skipping the steps. Once you can run 3-4 times a week,30-40 min , pain free, then start thinking about speeding up. i would do speed work on the bike and in the pool right now. But that’s my opinion as a doctor…
oups… we posted at the same time… running in the pool is a great idea… talk to matt about increasing the speed and seee hwat he says… he knows a lot more about your progress right now. plus you have worked hard to be able to run right now, don’t be too risky:-)
yes that’s right the knee is still in progress, but running is good. still struggling with sitting at the desk a little bit, and kick sets bring on pain.
so here’s the plan:
this week 3 3 3
next week: 3 3 3 2-3, depending on knee situation
week thereafter 3 3 3 3
one month out 3 3 3 4-5 and build slowly on this one up to 13 or 15 (no more than 10% build a week)
the goal will be to run consistently, without pain, and slowly build (instead of being concerned about time. if i get faster i get faster, it won’t be the primary focus). how’s that look?
It looks good as long as your knee holds up… You may be able to increase it to 5-6 but you won’t know until you see how it goes… run it by matt… seriously
Ditto…except for the Dr. part. From a non-doc point of view I have to fully agree with Marisol. Take your time with this one KC. If you exacerbate your injury you might get discouraged and/or sustain others. When I run on an injury I almost always end up tweaking something else too! Take care.
thanks. i don’t want to blow it. i have to remember to focus long term instead of getting antsy to go faster. and you all know how patient i am (sarcastic, of course). HAHA!!
Without knowing the specifics of your knee injury, I’d recommend cross training to build up the strength around the knee and strength to run faster, as long as this is pain free.
I’ve always found the stairclimbers to be good for that, and I’ve had my share of injuries.
Running 3 days a week and under 15 miles, I would say that the tempo runs would stress the system more than you would want and, if I were you, would rather add another day of running.
I think the general rule of thumb is that your long run shouldn’t be more than about %25 of your weekly volume. Maybe do the
halhigdon novice 1/2 mary program suggested above?
Im no coach but I would guess you would need to run more than 3 times a week, maybe 4 or 5 times and include one long run a week (8-12 miles?). Oh and listen to Marisol!
Slowman Dan wrote an article about improving run times about a year ago and the gist of it was if you want to get faster you need to increase volume and frequency. Im guessing the article is still on the site.
Since you are recovering from a knee injury, I would not run more than 3 times a week for a while, like maybe two or three months. Maybe more. Especially because you ride a bike to get some additional aerobic work in. My doctorate is not in medicine, but I did have a MD do some work on my knee after a rugby injury a while back. Before surgery, no marathons or triathlons while I have run 7 marathons and 7 triathlons since then and am currently training for my 8th marathon. The last couple weeks have been the first time that I have run 5 times a week since college. Getting from the surgery to what I can do now was mostly a matter of patience and consistency over time. You want to use your knees for another 50 years or more, don’t you? So, don’t rush things and be careful.
I also would not worry too much about how fast you are going. If you can run 9:30s in training now, you can probably run pretty close to 8:30s in a 10 KM really soon if not already. Last summer I never went faster than 8 minute miles in training unless I went to the track (which I did maybe once a month), and I ran 7:25s off the bike at an Olympic tri. If you consistently run three times a week for a couple months, you will probably be able to run 8s in a 10KM.
