On my long slow runs, it seems that I shorten my stride alot to slow my pace down. Is that normal or should I have the same stride on all my runs? I’m not sure how to slow down keeping the same (longer) stride. Thanks for the help
im not sure where your fitness is at, but a lot of people do their long runs too slow.
i dont think an overly long stride is a good thing. id shoot for a stride rate of 174-178 steps per minute instead of trying to over stride.
i expect someone is going to say “studies have shown athletes tend to pick the most efficient cadence and stride length” but i feel faster/more efficient when im running at a constant cadence.
for easy paced runs (E pace)- i run at 175-176 spm
for threshold (T pace)- 180-182 steps per minute
you keep cadence the same, so slower runs have shorter strides.
Running speed is mainly a function of stride length X stride rate. Generally, your cadence (stride rate) should stay approximately the same no matter what speed you are running (for me, I find it does go up a bit as speed goes up). So that means that when you want to run slower, you need to shorten your stride length. The way to do this properly is to reduce how hard you “push off”/“push forward”). Remember that you don’t really want to push up - you want to focus on forward motion.
I think optimal cadence is generally thought to be >~180spm.
Pretty decent thread here:
http://forum.slowtwitch.com/Slowtwitch_Forums_C1/Triathlon_Forum_F1/Offseason_Run_Training_-_Advice_P2532361
Great question ! BarryP where are you?
Running speed is mainly a function of stride length X stride rate. Generally, your cadence (stride rate) should stay approximately the same no matter what speed you are running (for me, I find it does go up a bit as speed goes up). So that means that when you want to run slower, you need to shorten your stride length. The way to do this properly is to reduce how hard you “push off”/“push forward”). Remember that you don’t really want to push up - you want to focus on forward motion.
I think optimal cadence is generally thought to be >~180spm.
Pretty decent thread here:
http://forum.slowtwitch.com/...ng_-_Advice_P2532361
Watch this as i was so concerned about my run cadence and instead of pushing forward, i pushed up more but i did have a high cadence = sore shins/Tibialis anterior which i thought at first was about my choice of foot wear. i was over striding aside from bouncing up more than moving forward which i have corrected.
On my long slow runs, it seems that I shorten my stride alot to slow my pace down. Is that normal or should I have the same stride on all my runs? I’m not sure how to slow down keeping the same (longer) stride. Thanks for the help
That’s exactly what you are supposed to do. Never try to artifically lenghten a stride. There are some drills that are done to make strides more powerful and can result in lengthening the stride, but the lenghtening is to make you run faster, not to run the same speed with a longer stride.
And I disagree strongly with SeasonsOfChange. I think most people run too quickly on their long endurance runs. Do not try to run faster. Your priority should be to run further but only at the rate of advancement that your body can tolerate.
You were already told that a shorter stride is good when running slower. It’s the stride length that determines speed moreso than the stride tempo.
x2
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most runners i know run at less than 75% of their functional threshold pace for their long runs.
im a strong advocate for 80% of their ftp mixed some tempo on their long runs.
Barry is right on about overstriding. I ran track in HS and got in the habit of overstriding for all my runs. I ran fast but now I am paying the price. If I run over 30 min the knees start to really ache. Keep the strides short, that way you can keep running the longer stuff. Hope this helps
Paul
On my long slow runs, it seems that I shorten my stride alot to slow my pace down. Is that normal or should I have the same stride on all my runs? I’m not sure how to slow down keeping the same (longer) stride. Thanks for the help
That’s exactly what you are supposed to do. Never try to artifically lenghten a stride. There are some drills that are done to make strides more powerful and can result in lengthening the stride, but the lenghtening is to make you run faster, not to run the same speed with a longer stride.
And those drills are?
most runners i know run at less than 75% of their functional threshold pace for their long runs.
im a strong advocate for 80% of their ftp mixed some tempo on their long runs.
FTP? Definitely never heard that term used for running.
In order of priority, what are the goals of a long training run (in your opinion)?
<25% of weekly mileage
80% of threshold pace or E pace
if you have some good run training under your belt you can add some tempo 2x20 at 90-95 pct of your threshold pace
i dont believe a long run is that necessary to be a successful runner. i push for high mileage and if a longer run is necessary to fit in the miles i do that. i havent seen evidence stating that a overly long run is physiologically beneficial to running fast.
SeasonsChange is correct, however I see where everyone else is coming from. It has been my experience that most people do their long runs too fast, but I have heard stories of IM athletes (not the good ones) who’ll slog through 3 hour runs at granny pace. Those guys are definitely running too slow.
Long runs need to be done at the “correct” pace.
www.mcmillanrunning.com Use the pace calculator.
I think it all depends on the goals. For marathon racing, I can’t see NOT doing a regular long run at a generally slower (i.e., below target race) pace. But I also would argue that the pace of that long run should vary week-to-week and include some long easy runs (to train the body to efficiently burn fat as fuel) and faster runs with some race paces mixed in (for specificity and to provide some mental toughness).
I also think the quality of the long run should vary by training phase. There are significant later benefits that can accrue from logging several long easy runs during a base phase (e.g., mitochondrial and cardio-vascular adaptations).
Yeah, I agree most people actually do their long run, and most runs for that matter, too fast (not too slow). Most people also do their fast runs too slow. This is the problem: if most of your runs are too fast, then you’re not recovered enough to do the fast runs properly. If your easy runs are truly easy, then you should be ready and motivated for the tough stuff.
I do agree though, that a true long run is a bit overrated - BUT, this assumes you are doing pretty high mileage with longish runs mid week.
Most serious runners and coaches would probably agree that your stide rate should be pretty constant for most paces, with the exception of shorter race distances - mile, 3k, 5k. I know my default stride rate for training and longer race distances is approx. 185 to 190, but it will be in the 195 range for a 5k race.
I’ve seen studies showing world class 5,000 metre runners well over 200 stride rates at race pace. They’re freaks though!
Most serious runners and coaches would probably agree that your stide rate should be pretty constant for most paces…
Desert Dude has shown us some studies that say that stride rate does decrease as pace is slowed, but not nearly as much as stride length.
ie, someone who runs 7 minute pace at 180 might run 10 minute pace at 165.
Yeah, for sure. Any pace run in the “normal operating zone” would likely yield a pretty similar stride rate. Runs that are significantly slower or faster would have likely have significantly lower/higher stride rates. I know this is true for me anyway.
“ie, someone who runs 7 minute pace at 180 might run 10 minute pace at 165.”
Personally, I’m not sure if I could lower my normal stride rate 15 steps, though maybe I’ve never paid attention at paces that much slower. I’ll do a little test on myself on my next recovery run - you’ve made me curious.