Reynolds 46/66 vs. zipp 404front/808 rear

Triathlon Forum
1

http://www.reynoldscycling.com/index.php?p_resource=items_wheels_item&p_itm_pk=641

http://www.zipp.com/wheels/404-firecrest---tubular/#

I’m looking to suit up with a new set of wheels. Deep dish back, shallow dish front. The Reynolds weigh significantly less but the Zipps have the ‘dimples’ like the golf balls. I like to train on the course in my racing wheels, really because I do a race about once a month so i’m too lazy to change wheels back and forth every couple of weeks. Will the carbon rim wear faster on either one of these wheels? Reynolds has a 2 year protection program, but that’s not enough. If the carbon rims wear down it’s gonna be right after 2 years. Zipp talks about the rims being stronger against wear but I’m not sure.

Anyone with reynolds carbon rims ever have any problems with the rim wearing down? Also, I’m pushing for the reynolds so I want to hear the dimples don’t do anything. Someone please tell me they won’t matter.

I’m a weight weanie but it seems almost like if a wheel is too light it could be bad, like I’m thinking about momentum physically, is this true? That is if a wheel is too light will you actually reduce momentum, or is that non sense considering the weight of the rider is what mainly contributes to momentum? I thought zipps were some of the lightest wheels around so I was surprised to see the stats on the reynolds as 1300g for the 44/66 set.

2

I Rep for Reynolds so consider that in my response, but if you are concerned about braking then the Reynolds wheels are the way to go. without going into the full sales pitch I can tell you that there is a set currently being tested in Utah right now trying to get to the wear indicator on the brake track. It’s been under braking for 5,000 miles and there is still no appreciable wear to the rim.

I’ve been on my 66’s all summer and winter and can’t see any wear on the brake track at all, and I ride them in all conditions -wet, dirt, salt, etc. The technology that is in the pads and the brake track is not just hype, they are the best braking carbon wheels I’ve ever ridden and I’ve been on pretty much everything over the past few years.

I’ll stay away from commenting on the rest of the stuff, but lighter is never a bad thing.

Cheers

3

http://www.reynoldscycling.com/index.php?p_resource=items_wheels_item&p_itm_pk=641

http://www.zipp.com/...irecrest---tubular/#

I’m looking to suit up with a new set of wheels. Deep dish back, shallow dish front. The Reynolds weigh significantly less but the Zipps have the ‘dimples’ like the golf balls. I like to train on the course in my racing wheels, really because I do a race about once a month so i’m too lazy to change wheels back and forth every couple of weeks. Will the carbon rim wear faster on either one of these wheels? Reynolds has a 2 year protection program, but that’s not enough. If the carbon rims wear down it’s gonna be right after 2 years. Zipp talks about the rims being stronger against wear but I’m not sure.

Anyone with reynolds carbon rims ever have any problems with the rim wearing down? Also, I’m pushing for the reynolds so I want to hear the dimples don’t do anything. Someone please tell me they won’t matter.

I’m a weight weanie but it seems almost like if a wheel is too light it could be bad, like I’m thinking about momentum physically, is this true? That is if a wheel is too light will you actually reduce momentum, or is that non sense considering the weight of the rider is what mainly contributes to momentum? I thought zipps were some of the lightest wheels around so I was surprised to see the stats on the reynolds as 1300g for the 44/66 set.

-Weight: Lighter wheels are better, but only on the level that a lighter bike is better. You shouldn’t have to worry about inertia, especially in a TT. Most of weight is how a wheel “feels”. Lighter wheels feel faster and more responsive (‘spin up’ faster). Heavier wheelsets (1080F pops to mind) tend to “cruise” - once you get them up to speed, they haul, but I’d rather have a lightweight wheelset.

Either way, both of these wheelsets are basically equal in weight. You’re talking a 1500-something gram wheelset for clincher. That’s “pretty light”.

It comes down to whose marketing you buy. Firecrest has the newest rim shape, which isn’t the fastest at every yaw angle, but does produce some impressive numbers at a spread of angles. Reynolds’ rims have a slightly older (toroidal?) rim shape, but it’s still fast. We’re talking percent here… as in, this wheel is 3% faster than that one.

Don’t discount Reynolds. I had a teammate put nearly 25,000 on a set of carbon clinchers before sponsorship requirements put an end to their career.

As for protection plan, I’ve never used Reynolds’ plan, but there are a LOT of people who are less than pleased with Zipps’ crash replacement policy (cost is 60% of new rim). However, Reynolds offers the RAP - if you crash your wheels, they replace it. I’ve never heard anyone use it, though.

Last thing: Zipp calls a 404 / 808 setup a 606… just so you know what people are talking about.

4

I like to train on the course in my racing wheels, really because I do a race about once a month so i’m too lazy to change wheels back and forth every couple of weeks.

dude. it literally takes 30 seconds to swap wheels.

5

I like to train on the course in my racing wheels, really because I do a race about once a month so i’m too lazy to change wheels back and forth every couple of weeks.

dude. it literally takes 30 seconds to swap wheels.

This is not true. You have to change cork brake pads to aluminum brake pads. And you have to change cassettes if you don’t have 2 cassettes. WAY LONGER than 30 seconds!

6

This is not true. You have to change cork brake pads to aluminum brake pads. And you have to change cassettes if you don’t have 2 cassettes. WAY LONGER than 30 seconds!

meh. cork pads are a marketeer’s way of getting still more $ from triathletes’ wallets. but even if you do that … 2 minutes. If buy race wheels but can’t spring for another cassette … well, that’s just silly.

7

Reynolds customer service is GARBAGE. Zipp is run by SRAM and they are fantastic.

Reynolds is not the same brand they were, everything that made their products innovative and great is gone. Their stuff is overpriced for what it is. I had a wheel split down the side and they offered “crash replacement”. It was a tubular and it split along the front rim between the spoke hole and the brake track, never seen anything like it. I used to be so happy with those wheels. I only had one one season ~1000miles on them. Everything else was in perfect shape. The wheel held together, I unknowingly finished the road race on the broken front wheel.

8

Crash replacement was $750-1000 if I remember correctly and they wanted to sell me an assault rim, which are garbage. I had a set of dv46t for what it’s worth.

Zipp crash replacement is much more reasonable and they are never going to sell you some imported second tier rim as a crash replacement.

9

FWIW My experience with Reynolds customer service was positive. I had some hub issues on Strike rear and gave Reynolds a call to help me understand the issue, how to fix it and find out any other tribal knowledge they might have. The person I talked to was very helpful and walked me through the fix. I believe the 46/66 have DT Swiss hub bits, so you should have few problems there.

So far my only pet peeve so far with Reynolds wheels is the interal nipples. Some people don’t really care, but I prefer the ease of service of external nipples.

10

Looky here:)

http://forum.slowtwitch.com/gforum.cgi?post=3754773;sb=post_latest_reply;so=ASC;forum_view=forum_view_collapsed;;page=unread#unread

…couldn’t resist!

11

what has bugged me about Reynolds is their white papers contained a lot of nonsense. Like things that an intermediate level of physics would imply, objectively, that they were either lying or ignorant in those white papers.

This makes me hesitate to believe that some of their new features really work.

12

Whichever you choose, go the whole way and get the matching set of the deeper front too. Especially if you end up going with the 808 firecrests, since by all accounts they handle similar to the previous 404 set.

13

I like the way it looks with a shallow rim for the front, hate to admit it but I care about the looks!

14

The closer comparison (as far as rim depth goes) would be the Reynolds 66 front and 81 rear. That more closely matches the Zipp wheel depths you’re referring to. I know a guy that had a bad crash and he used the Reynolds RAP program to get a wheel replaced. I think he paid $250 for it and it’s good for 2 years. Not a bad little insurance policy.

http://www.reynoldscycling.com/index.php?p_resource=support_assurance

15

I Rep for Reynolds so consider that in my response, but if you are concerned about braking then the Reynolds wheels are the way to go. without going into the full sales pitch I can tell you that there is a set currently being tested in Utah right now trying to get to the wear indicator on the brake track. It’s been under braking for 5,000 miles and there is still no appreciable wear to the rim.

I’ve been on my 66’s all summer and winter and can’t see any wear on the brake track at all, and I ride them in all conditions -wet, dirt, salt, etc. The technology that is in the pads and the brake track is not just hype, they are the best braking carbon wheels I’ve ever ridden and I’ve been on pretty much everything over the past few years.

I’ll stay away from commenting on the rest of the stuff, but lighter is never a bad thing.

Cheers

I recently confirmed my decision on the Reynolds and this alleviates my concern about carbon rim wear.

So they are manufactured in the USA? Or Germany?

16

In short, neither. Most wheels are assembled in our factory in the east.

The short long version is we buy raw carbon yarn from Japan, ship it to our US pre-preg partner who turns it into all the different versions of our carbon spec material using our epoxys (the carbon pre preg). That material is shipped to our facility in the east where it is built into wheels. the 46 and the 66 are both built on DT swiss hubs FWIW

There is a much longer version of that story, but you get the idea.

unless the conversation is about the RZR and then it is US built wheel.

17

This is not true. You have to change cork brake pads to aluminum brake pads. And you have to change cassettes if you don’t have 2 cassettes. WAY LONGER than 30 seconds!

meh. cork pads are a marketeer’s way of getting still more $ from triathletes’ wallets. but even if you do that … 2 minutes. If buy race wheels but can’t spring for another cassette … well, that’s just silly.

You can get pads that will work OK with diffrent rim types, and really riding on carbon rims everyday isnt the best look.

18

I have a set of Reynolds DV46 Carbon Clinchers and a set of Zipp 404 Tubulars (non FC). Love them both - put a lot of miles on both. Both sets are holding up extremely well. I don’t think you can go wrong with either. Brake tacks look great on both - swiss stop yellow pads.

19

I have a set of Reynolds DV46 Carbon Clinchers and a set of Zipp 404 Tubulars (non FC). Love them both - put a lot of miles on both. Both sets are holding up extremely well. I don’t think you can go wrong with either. Brake tacks look great on both - swiss stop yellow pads.

the reynolds RAP program is voided if you use yellow pads. Can only use blue pads.

20

Maybe I don’t ride (or brake) enough but how often have people actually worn out their rims due to braking? I feel like something else would wear out before the rim due to braking.