I’ve happily received my new power meter from Power2max to pair up with a set of Rotor 3dF cranks, and decided to take it all down to the LBS since I didn’t have a vice that would be strong enough to brace against the lockring tool that p2max sent.
Now, the LBS has run into problems with being unable to remove the lockring with any reasonable amount of force, and contacted Rotor on my behalf. Rotor’s response was essentially ‘we designed this to not be removed outside of the factory, if you do remove it with the p2max locking tool, you’ll void your warranty etc.’ Has anyone successfully removed a 110bcd spider from 3DF cranks that were shipped in the last few months, and if so, can you offer any advice / discuss whether or not it may have caused any damage to the lockring?
I’d really like to keep buying from both companies, and while I understand that Rotor wants to focus on promoting their own Power meter, their deliver timeframes simply won’t work for me (or i’d have gone that route in the first place).
If it’s the same interface as the 3D, I was told to apply some heat, e.g. with a hairdryer, to free up the threadlock that they apply when they assemble it in the factory. Not too much heat, the advice was that a little heat goes a long way. It still needed a LOT of force, I bought a new set of spanners to have one big enough to fit the lockring tool. I clamped the crank arm in a vice and used the big spanner on the lockring tool. The threadlock that they use sets very hard and solid, it’s essentially glued in place with it. You’ll then want to remove the remnants of the threadlock before re-assembling. All this advice is at your own risk, don’t blame me if you break it! I’ve disassembled two of them now and not caused any damage to either of them removing the lockring as far as I’ve been able to tell.
The other way you can cause damage is when putting the lockring back on. It can take a lot of force to push the spider down onto the crank arm, and if it’s sitting too high, there won’t be enough threads engaged and you can strip the threads off the lockring. So try to seat the spider as far down as you can to maximise the number of threads engaged before significant force is being borne by them, and then it’s best to press down as hard as you can on the lockring tool while tightening it to reduce the force on the threads as much as possible.
The hairdryer trick definitely worked great. The LBS guys overheated things a bit and caused it all to snug up, but after it cooled slightly, we were able to get the ring off with no major problems or any damage!
Hi Steve, A friend of mine just put an order through for a power2max and I’ll likely be helping him install it on his Rotor 3D crank. The advice that you’ve give so far has seems pretty clear and straightforward.
How did you hold the crank steady while you removed the lock ring? I’m trying to wrap my head around how I’m going to do this, and I would imagine that I have to put the crank in a vice to do (without the chainrings on). Did you clamp the crank arms or the spider in the vice?
Any other pearls of wisdom on the installation would be appreciated too.
I have removed and reinstalled several spiders on my Rotor cranks. I will say that I clamped the crank arm in a padded vise, AND I used the lockring tool that ONLY Rotor sells. Yes, Rotor sells that splined tool that is to be used on their lockrings. However, they only sell this tool to “authorized dealers”. With the proper tool, I didn’t need to apply any heat. However, since there was Loctite on the lockring, I would always suggest applying some heat first.
How did you hold the crank steady while you removed the lock ring? I’m trying to wrap my head around how I’m going to do this, and I would imagine that I have to put the crank in a vice to do (without the chainrings on). Did you clamp the crank arms or the spider in the vice?
I’ve always clamped the crank arm in a vice, with the axle pointing upwards. You need the axle something like 20 degrees away from vertical, so that the crank arm slopes down into the vice, as the P2Max spider surrounds the end of the crank arm. Clamped like that, there is no way the P2Max can move relative to the vice while you’re trying to remove the lockring, so your only problem then is stopping the whole workbench from moving.
Thanks to both of you guys for posting your suggestions. Steve, I’m glad I asked because I probably would have made things a lot harder by not mounting the axle pointing upwards. …But it makes perfect sense to me now.
Just a couple more things that I want to be clear on…
Is this a typical right hand threaded lock-ring? (i.e., Clockwise ‘righty-tighty’, and counter-clockwise ‘lefty-loosey’)? I assume that this would be the case, but assumptions can create problems.
Are you guys using any specific kind of thread locker glue when you re-attach the power2max spider?
It is indeed a standard right handed threaded lock-ring.
I’ve seen a few people with P2max meters swearing by both using various brands of threadlock, and others who move the meter regularly using none at all. So I’d say it’s a fairly open category there.
When we removed my spider, we just put the lockring tool in the vice at a completely vertical angle (i.e. crank arms were horizontal) and had one person lean down on the crank so it wouldn’t slip and I just pulled straight towards myself in an anticlockwise motion.
I think the big thing is that a lot of LBS employees would likely be a bit squeamish about the amount of force needed to remove the spider without heating it first. It can be done, but since heat breaks up the threadlock so effectively, theres just no reason to go that route.
Is the 3DF lock ring the same as the standard 3D? Rotor has a red lock ring removal tool that you can buy from them. I did a couple spider swaps with that tool. I put the tool in a vise, set the crank on top of the tool…and used a rubber mallet for a bit of persuasion.
Reviving this thread to say thanks for the help. Heating the spider on the lock ring side made this come off smoothly whereas before I couldn’t even get the thing to budge.
Reviving this thread to say thanks for the help. Heating the spider on the lock ring side made this come off smoothly whereas before I couldn’t even get the thing to budge.
Hair dryer, medium setting, try it for about 15 seconds, then if it hasn’t worked, try another 15, etc. You want to heat the lockring without too much heat transferring to the spider (and thus swelling the threads even tighter). If you get it too hot, let it cool down a bit and try again.
Just thought I’d add my experience. I installed my Power2Max type S power meter today on my existing Rotor 3DF cranks. I don’t have the tools at my home, but was able to get access to an auto shop to get the job done. I mounted the lock ring tool into a bench vice, used a heat gun on low setting for about 30-60 seconds on the lock ring. The locking compound from the factory is a type of glue that will get gummy when heated up. I still wasn’t able to manually loosen the lock nut, but gave it a few hard taps with a rubber mallet and that worked immediately. This whole process took some trial and error with several rounds of pulling/tugging on the crank arm, then adding heat, then finally adding the mallet into the formula. After I got the lock ring off I heated up the parts again and wiped the glue off and installed my Power2Max. I first tightened the lock ring by hand, then installed it into the vice and tugged on the crank arm, then gave it a few quick taps with the mallet to finish it off. I didn’t use any loctite on the installation as the fit is quite snug and I didn’t feel that it was needed.
I wouldn’t have been able to do it without the heat gun or the bench vice.
So I hate to be “that guy”, but I just followed these steps (thanks btw!.. and I have been a long time lurker of these forums… super helpful).
but with heat and a lot of force using a bench vise, tugging and pushing, and a mallet. No go for me. My lock ring didn’t budge, and my Power2max tool broke a tooth. I sent a message to P2M, but depending on my situation, I may have a new, type S on the market.
So I think I’ve made some headway, but not sure. I took the lock ring off with the help of a second person, and persistent use of a mallet. But the spider is still on the crank and I don’t know how to take that off. So before I try anything I shouldn’t, I thought I’d post here.
thanks!
EDIT: It’s all that crazy amount of threadlock on the rotor cranks. I was able to step on the spider arms and lift the crank. Almost there
