I am in the market for a new pair of running shoes and in an ideal world I’d find a pair of training shoes I love that have an identical fit to the brand’s carbon plated/pebax foam race day shoes. Now I know an identical fit is highly unlikely, but can you all help me put together a list of each brands super shoe and closest fitting training shoe? I do not want to train in carbon plated/pebax foam shoes as anecdotal evidence seems to suggest an increased injury risk.
i think the injury risk comes from the popularily available/used Nike shoes, because they have the most severe drop. Nothing to do with the pebax/plate.
Bondi X isn’t Hoka’s race day shoe. Either the Carbon X3 or Carbon Rockets are faster. The Carbon X series would be more similar to classic Hoka training shoes whereas the Rockets are a bit more of a lightweight classic racing shoe.
I am a big fan of the recent Puma shoes. If you are staying away from the deviate nitro 2 for training you might try the recently released Freedom. I was a long time Nike runner and with all the new tech have been experimenting using the other brans you list and found Puma to be a great no nonsense platform for my style of running.
I like the cushion of the Rincon for training, but it’s still very light. There’s no point training in heavy shoes. At the same time people doing a lot of training in super light carbon plated shoes are nuts. There’s not even cushion for them to be used like that. Short speed sessions on the track maybe but that’s about it.
Big fan of the new Saucony lineup, although haven’t yet used the third versions. Been go to training shoes (speed and pro) of versions 1 and 2. Race day shoes are Next% or MetaSpeed. Recently got a cheap version 1 of Alphaflys, but haven’t raced in them yet.
I race in vaporfly 2s- almost never wear them except for racing
Train in and do 99% of mileage in Nike infinity react 3. Fit is very similar. But honestly these are not ‘fast’ shoes and they feel a bit clunky for tempo stuff or repeats. But keep me injury free.
Is it better to have a line of shoes that are similar in fit, characteristics, etc to your race show or better to have variety? Stay within a shoe family/line?
I race in the Saucony Endorphin Pro, but I do find the differences among models to be confusing. This is the best summary I’ve found. AFAIK, the Speed has the same PWRRUN-PB (Pebax) as the Pro and has a nylon plate rather than the carbon plate of the Pro. If you’re trying to avoid Pebax and plates, you need the Endorphin Shift, which is ‘plain’ PWRRUN (same as other non-Endorphin Saucony shoes such as the Kinvara) and no plate. I think!
i cant demonstrate with 100% certainity but across all brand, i see injury increase with athletes using super shoes and i m trying very hard to get minimal use of them in training with my squad of atheltes. I see the same attitude towards them from many others coaches. Definitly not a Nike only observation from my point of view. But more research and data is needed for sure.
i cant demonstrate with 100% certainity but across all brand, i see injury increase with athletes using super shoes and i m trying very hard to get minimal use of them in training with my squad of atheltes. I see the same attitude towards them from many others coaches. Definitly not a Nike only observation from my point of view. But more research and data is needed for sure.
I do wonder if this problem of injury with the super shoes would be mitigated if the athlete trained in what they race in. So yes, pricey shoes for training, and same pricey shoes for racing.
I’ve haed problems with some super shoes in ‘racing-only’ mode, and suffered minor but seriously annoying muscle strains without even doing anything crazy with them before race day, and now plan to only use them if I can both train and race in the same model shoe signficantly before race day.
i should have mention that i m all for the use in races and see it as a non issue injury wise as it s a short amount of time using them. But my issue is athletes are getting addicted to those shoes like cocaine and get very defensive when you ask them to not run in them during speed workout/intervals etc.
So in the cases i mention…we see issue with there use in training and talking to some of the ITU elite squad…a few coach try to reduce there use to only 10% of the speed workout etc. some exposure to them is important but as to be very limited.
but we are all learning from those… it s a new product that is changing the game and we need to gather more data…
As with another poster I am a big fan of the Puma’s.
They are almost impossible to wear out, as a trainer
Some of the other shoes have limited lifespans as trainers.
(I will also race in mine).
i should have mention that i m all for the use in races and see it as a non issue injury wise as it s a short amount of time using them. But my issue is athletes are getting addicted to those shoes like cocaine and get very defensive when you ask them to not run in them during speed workout/intervals etc.
So in the cases i mention…we see issue with there use in training and talking to some of the ITU elite squad…a few coach try to reduce there use to only 10% of the speed workout etc. some exposure to them is important but as to be very limited.
but we are all learning from those… it s a new product that is changing the game and we need to gather more data…
Interesting.
For my n=1 experience though, I’ve found it a bad idea to just wear the supershoes on race day, or in the week or two leading up to race day. Both times I’ve done that, with Alphafly, and recently even more surprising Metaspeed Skys, I suffered muscle strains that I never would have gotten had I worn my normal shoes (Endorphin speed or pro) that I trained with for the months leading up to race day. I was surprised with these strains, as my training had included ample speedwork and lots of hard hill climbing and overall volume so I felt my legs should have been strong enough to take on either a race or moderately hard intervals, but have been surprised with how ‘fragile’ I’ve been with the swap. For me, it’s def important to spend a lot more time acclimating to these supershoes than to just bust them out during race day. (One of my muscle strains with a race last year was so bad I was on crutches for nearly 2 weeks - thought I’d ruptured my Achilles tendon but MRI just showed massive muscle strains - which I’ve NEVER gotten before supershoes, but granted, I’m not a spring chicken either, so that’s definitely part of it, with aging up.)
I’m likely going to go Alphafly training Alphafly racing for my next racing season and see how it goes - for me the Alphafly was a lot less damaging than the Metaspeed sky (to my surprise, as it seems most people consider the Metaspeed sky a less aggressive geometry than the alphafly.)
One thing to keep in mind is that having a carbon platted shoe doesn’t allow the ‘normal’ movement of the foot and can lead to foot injuries if that is all that you run in. If your plan is training in what you race in, maybe one run a week would suffice. There was a podacast episode on That Triathlon Show all about this topic.