Having raced tris for a while now, I’m still slightly confused about the distinction between pro and age-group designation. I obviously understand the root of it, but I guess I’m confused as to how much of an “amateur” an age-grouper really is.
So if anyone can help me clarify:
Can an age-grouper be sponsored?
Can an age-grouper be a pro or race for money one day and then be an age-grouper the next?
It seems from certain examples I’ve seen that the answer to both is yes which would seem to contradict my idea that an age-grouper is a pure amateur (similar to an NCAA athlete).
There is are specific distinctions between pro and age-group that the various National Federations have, but there is a big gray area in the middle. Some points:
There are only a few triathletes who truely make a living from the sport of triathlon in the truest sense of being a professional. Many/most have other jobs and/or spousal or family support. Nothing wrong with any of this, but the bottom line is that there is not a very big pool of money in the sport.
There are age-group athletes that are perhaps better taken care of by “sponsors” and in some cases they also have good paying jobs, so in some regards they are better off than the pros!
The line get’s really blurry once you take a few steps back from the top 5 to 10 places, where top age-groupers are competitive with the 3rd tier pros so who really is what in this area?
When I was racing I fell directly into that grey area. I was good enough to get some decent sponsorship ( most of my training/racing equipment for no cost), free entries into some races and in some cases was able to win prize money. But it was not a huge amount of money - several thousand dollars/year. Consquently, I kept working full time through that time period, because I had to! No regrets, that’s just the way it was.
Yes. The NCAA is (supposedly) protecting the idea of the “student-athlete.” There is no such restrictive (and hypocritical) body in triathlon, especially since most age-groupers aren’t students.
Yes and no. Only pros are allowed to race for prize money in races that offer a total prize purse of over $5000. So an age-grouper could never win $10,000 in prize money, but a pro could. At races where there is no prize money or less than $5000, then EVERYONE is an “age-grouper” for that race, BUT pros cannot collect age-group awards, ONLY overall.
There is no sanctioning body that would restrict an age-group athlete from being a paid athlete with a salary for racing (unless you are a collegiate triathlete, in which case the NCAA would bar you).
The main reason you don’t see a clear distinction is because, to a large extent, there isn’t one. For the vast majority of “pros,” triathlon doesn’t pay the bills. Triathlon is a much closer to golf than to a sport like baseball, except there isn’t really an equivalent of the PGA in terms of money and profile. Being a pro triathlete is closer to being on the Nike Tour. Most pros are probably going to be fastest athletes at a race. But not always, just as there are plenty of really, really good golfers who could be on the Nike Tour, but don’t want to, and instead just kick butt on their local courses on the weekends, since they make more money having a real job and playing a few times a week than they could make if they quit their job, played every day, and increased their handicap a couple of points.
Lets see, you are an NCAA amateur even though you go to a private college for five years and waive the $35 k annual tuition, room, board, books , tutors, and they give you five years to get thru. But a “pro” if you play minor league base ball and make $1000 per month and live in a trailer with three other pros.
Then we always complained that the Eastern block athletes were in the Army and were really pros, but our armed services all have running teams.
I think we ought to line everyone up and race. I really don’t care what their background and financial status is, just how fast they go.
PS - I only used the NCAA example for comparison’s sake. Not saying age-groupers should be barred from accepting prize and sponsorship money. The grey area can definitely be a bit confusing is all…
It’s really quite simple. If you race Pro, you are racing for prize money. If race AG, you are not. (Of course sanctioning bodies like USAT, GTG, etc, define what qualifies an athlete as a Pro).
I don’t know where the idea comes from that AG = Amateur in triathlon. Many AGers earn income (or try to) in triathlon related businesses. Bike shops, race equipment, nutrition products, coaching and on. Some AGs have lucrative sponsorship.
Likewise the term “pro” doesn’t mean you earn an income from racing. Many “pro” triathletes make very little profit beyond limited sponsorship. I doubt there are no more than a handful that “make a living” on Triathlon. I am sure there are a number of AGs who make more money fro the sport than Pros.
I think the idea that AG = amateur comes from how most other professional sports work. Again though, I have no problem with that. Every sport is different and this one chooses to allow a grey area which frankly is good. The more support for top athletes (Pro or AG) the better.
What you may not realize since you are not new to triathlon anymore (I’m making an educated guess since I don’t know who you are) is that this grey area can be confusing. I frankly was not aware that AG’s were not pure amateurs. Now I know.
There really is no gray area. You are either carrying a pro card, or you are not (AG). There is no other designation or implication to the rules.
Any “gray area” only exists in the minds of the people who confuse AG with the term Amateur. “Amateur” is not used in regulating the sport of triathlon.
Yes, I have been around triathlon scene for a while.
If you race as an AGer you cannot win prize money for the races. If you race as a pro, you can win money.
If you get your pro card, you race as a pro until the end of the year. The next year you can get an AGer license if you want. Although you can change and become a pro in the middle of the year (assuming you qualify).
There is no grey area. All the rules are called out on the governing bodies website.
NCAA is pretty lame. You can be a pro cyclist, but still race NCAA cycling races. Yet in basketball you cannot do that. Odd.
I think there is a huge grey area - those athletes who work in the industry, as either vendor reps, “field marketing” personnel or coaches have a huge advantage over athletes who work outside the industry yet they race on the same level.
The former are paid to participate in their sport: think, test, analyze, travel and attend races and even train. Where as the latter spend the majority of their time outside the industry and squeeze in 20 hours (including reading and maintenance) compared to 60 hours of their fellow amateurs.
The sport of sailboat racing recognized this several years ago, as it is similarly a low-prize money affair. They created a separate category of sailors who make their living “in the industry” (building boats, sewing sails, instructors, etc.), but are not “paid” to race, per se. This was in response to the need to level the playing field and now there are three categoies in sailboat racing: pro, industry and amateur and this has certainly helped the weekend warrior feel that things are more even.
We definitely need more brackets and distinctions in Tri.
Pro, AG’er (of all sexes and age groups), Clyde/Athena, AquaBike, AquaRun, shortened courses, Steve Larsen, yada, yada, yada.
“Look honey, I won the medal for being the fastest guy named Mike who was born in April, is between 5’9” and 5’11", and is at least 39 years old but still has all his hair."
PRO ='s you qualified for a Pro Card. End of story.
PS - you CAN win $ at some (smaller) races even if you are not a Pro.
This isn’t a gray area. AG does not equal amateur. Pros have a pro card. AGs do not. It is really simple. If you are good enough to qualify for a pro card, then you have that option to compete as a pro. No one is obliged to be a pro.
In cycling, there are top amateurs who make a better living as a top amateur than they would as a mediocre pro. Guess where they make their careers? (they actually aren’t called amateurs anymore, just Elites. Elite 1 is the top level, then Elite 2, etc)
Perhaps it is confusing since the Elite triathletes are called Pro? maybe the name should be changed to reflect the fact that for many / most Pro triathletes, their profession is not triathlons? They actually make their living doing something else.
In most competitive sports you’re considered amateur if you’re not a pro which is where the mistaken correlation of AG and amateur comes from. My wife and I have been in competitive triathlon for 3+ years and the “gray area” didn’t become black and white until I finally posted this question and got answers from you and others.
I think there is a huge grey area - those athletes who work in the industry, as either vendor reps, “field marketing” personnel or coaches have a huge advantage over athletes who work outside the industry yet they race on the same level.
An equal argument can be made by those in the industry who are so intensely tied up with sales, expos, coaching, etc they don’t get an equal chance to rest/relax before a big race.
As far as making up new “divisions” one of the qualities I like in any competition is the idea that an award means something. I’d hate Tri to become one of the “everyone gets a prize” sports. Don’t call me an elitist, I have never won a prize in Triathlon.
NCAA is pretty lame. You can be a pro cyclist, but still race NCAA cycling races. Yet in basketball you cannot do that. Odd.
What you meant to say was you can race collegiate cycling races as a pro. There is no such thing as NCAA cycling races. There are collegiate conferences, races, and even a national championship but none of these are sanctioned by the NCAA. The teams that compete do so as clubs and even though most get funding from the school, it is from the student body, not the athletic department.
It would be nice though to see cycling and triathlon become “real” NCAA sports. I mean if lacrosse, field hockey, and wrestling are all NCAA sports, shouldnt triathlon and cycling be?
I have said it for years, line em up and lets race. I would much rather finish 15th overall than 2nd in the 35-39 age group. I like the old ways where you raced scratch or over 40.
I have said it for years, line em up and lets race. I would much rather finish 15th overall than 2nd in the 35-39 age group. I like the old ways where you raced scratch or over 40.
Although I cant speak about “the old ways” I couldnt agree more. When people ask me how I did at a race, I always give overall place. The whole AG thing is a little out of hand.
You are probably right, I was being general for purposes of clarity. I’m not a USAT law specialist, yet. I guess others stated it better. You either hold a “pro” card or you are AG. Amateur designation or source if your income has nothing to do with it.
