I wouldn’t say unhealthy or unsustainable to be world champ, more that the depth of field now is so deep that’s it’s very, very difficult to repeat. You have a lot of winners but the podium composition is very very similar- Kat, LCB, Laura, KB, Lange all have 3 or more WC podiums. 2 podium in the last few years for Magnus, Chelsea, and Gustav.
It’s more that being a great athlete gets you in contention to win and on the podium/top 5, but its harder than ever to finish off a W, and even harder to defend that W in the future. When you don’t win, it’s easier to find areas to work on to improve, whether training, execution, tech, etc. Same as in others sports, there’s a reason that Dynasties are so rare even for team with a lot of talent and money.
I am more suggesting how Ironman worlds championship rookie seems to do so well .
because ignorance is bliss on the first attempt. At a significant cost.
I have rules for Ironman newbies
First Ironman physical fitness is ok , mental fortitude is an all time high.
Second Ironman physical fitness is best , mental fortitude is ok.
Third Ironman physical fitness is the same or slightly lower, but a new bike and shit so you think it will be better , but mental fortitude is looking for an easy way out.
3 year peak and good bye to the long distance sport .
I agree that careers might be shorter in the future from the higher demands of training at a younger age, and from how scientific/measured all-encompassing training has become. You’re seeing the same thing in pro cycling in that regards where Pogi, Remco, Jonas, etc. will likely have shorter careers than the old school likes of Valverde, Contador, Cancellara.
But 3 years flameouts aren’t exactly what we’re seeing in either sport. Pogi has hinted at retiring at some point but he’s dominated in historical fashion for 5 years. WVA might be over his peak but he ws anabsolute force from 2018-2024, MVdP has had some injuries but come classics time there’s no reason to thin k he won’t be the one to beat at MSR and PR. In triathlon, 1he Norwegians, especially KB, have been winning competing in and winning international races for a decade. KB has been 3 WC podiums in 4 years- does anyone think he won’t be continue to win races and be a favorite in Kona next year? Same with LCB and Kat next year, several WC podiums but they will absolutely be favorites.
Do I think we’ll see a lot of the current generation still racing competitively at 40? That I would agree is probably less likely even than in the past, both from physical and mental fatigue. But the window to be world class is a lot more than 3 years, probably more like 6-10 depending on athlete, sport, circumstances.
The 3 year was newbie age grouper. But now are pro’s overreaching like first timers and can’t recover / go into that well again.
KB is a good example, he won St. George . then got beat in Kona ( gustav ) and then blow in kona and then beat in Nice ( stones) . by two guys he beats daily in training but they had that late push survival, and possible he couldn’t take his body there anymore deep in the race.
I don’t think that was a lack of being able to push himself though in either case. In Kona 2022, I remember in a few interviews with Olav he had said that Gustav was running a little better in the last couple weeks leading in. Nice, likewise I don’t think a motivation issue, probably a combo of coming in a little overcooked having to bail on the workout 1 week out, and he mentioned missing a bottle on the run. Which considering he was 1’ behind Casper until his hamstring seized up with 1km to go, seemed nutritional and managing effort on the day more than anything. You can hear in interviews how much he really, really wants to win Kona and I don’t doubt he’ll be a favorite next year and push himself quite far to get there.
I’ll agree that having a serious injury or heat incident, or getting older/havings kids often limits how far athletes can push themselves. Again with the cycling parallels, sprinters especially aren’t willing to take the same risks with age and especially with kids and a family. Or in triathlon, Emma Pallant-Brown or Johnny Brownlee with severe heat injuries. But I don’t think any of the current crop of favorites in the men or the women are there yet (maybe excluding Laura and Patrick who are older and have climbed the top of the mountain, and Pro Tri News mentioned how down Patrick was after Nice this year).
while yes that’s what I mean the World win takes the last 5% out of you , in the training build up and race finish strength. hence you start trying harder and cramp vs the guys you are always waiting for at the end of each interval. It’s a full body deep fatigue and then a mental struggle and then overreaching and mentality under performing due to risk / reward body signals.
You will not see it in the first hour or 4 hours it comes in late as the body has safety build in and you can’t keep testing it or it weakens and goes safer.
I still disagree with Mark. Pro triathletes are public figures and as such forgo a level of privacy in regards to things that occur in their professional career.
Didn’t they mention certain countries have different levels of privacy laws, so for those countries where sharing HIPAA type of regulations can be an actual crime it can get a little wonky right?
I’m wilded out as an ncaa coach that I can’t even tell the parents of players on my team info about them (even if I wanted too) since they are legal adults and therefore HIPAA protected.
Their whole claim that this should never have been made public is bananas. Mark is wrong as you point out and @Kyleglass91 saying they want to be like SportsCenter and only report on the facts as if that exact show hasn’t led off with a Shams/Woj/Shefter report about someone getting popped for doping. Give me a fucking break.
They mentioned the possibility of a WADA appeal. I actually think WADA have <43 days because their 21 days doesn’t start till any other party could’ve appealed, and they’re allowed 21 days ‘first’.
The IRONMAN AD rules say:
13.6 Time for Filing Appeals 13.6.1 Appeals to CASThe time to file an appeal to CAS shall be twenty-one (21) days from the date of receipt of the decision by the appealing party.
WADA Code 13.2.3.5 Appeal Deadline for WADA The filing deadline for an appeal filed by WADA shall be the later of: (a) Twenty-one (21) days after the last day on which any other party having a right to appeal could have appealed,
And pretty sure this is ‘practice’ because these delays/timelines were reflected in the CAS Arbitral Award for Thibus (linked in the other thread).
ITA have made this determination wrt Simmonds’ ADRV on behalf of IRONMAN so the only parties (other than WADA) with appeal rights are SSI (NADO) and World Tri (WADA Code 13.2.3.1). Given that CAS have recently rejected an appeal by WADA after the kissing French fencer was deemed ‘no fault or negligence’ by the FIE (immediately before a home Olympics btw), I would be surprised if WADA re-litigates essentially the same point.
Ref the “Imo appeal” I think you may have misheard or more likely one of the 4 mispoke: she ‘appealed’ to the ITA Hearing panel admitting the ADRV and explaining why she bore no fault or negligence.
Y’all. Move on from the Imogen case. I’m now going to clean up this thread. We tried to have a civil discussion there and failed, and it’s not going well here, either.
Gonna put the same thing that I did over there here in the event people want to keep diving into the poisoned well:
1.) You can say that Imogen had an ADRV;
2.) You can say that Imogen was found to have no fault for said ADRV;
3.) The standard of proof for her to be found for no fault is “by a balance of probability,” meaning that the ITA had to accept that her explanation was the most probable explanation for the result of the test, given the totality of circumstances, which ultimately means:
4.) You can’t call her a doper, nor are we going to relitigate the findings of the ITA.
Can we please get back to our regularly scheduled Jack Kelly v Talbot Cox fighting?