I don’t know if I am right, but from the fins in the seatstays and the chainstays, I believe it might be a “Planet X/Velovie” type frame. You can also spot that the cable routing is external. Can anyone confirm this?
You’re right, there were a couple of other threads on this,
After finishing a scant 23 seconds behind Contador, how much time would Cadel have managed to save in 110k of time trialing if he only had a H3 or Zipp 808 up front instead of that “slow” Campy Bora 
I guess he should have rebadged more than the frame!
Cadel Evans with his Bora wheels finished 1 minute and 27 seconds faster than Contador in the time trial. The overall lead after 19 stages was 23 seconds.
Am I missing something on this post? Where else could he have saved any time?
With faster wheels in the time trial he could possibly have gained the 23 seconds in addition to the 1:27 that he beat Contador by. He beat him soundly in the first time trial as well. If you look at the Nytro website, it indicates that a H3/808 type wheel on the front is faster than a 404/Alps type wheel (the same depth as the Bora) by 18 seconds over 40k. If this is actually true, then over 110k of time trials using the same trispoke as Contador should yield approx 49 seconds of improvement …if the race was contested in a wind tunnel
After finishing a scant 23 seconds behind Contador, how much time would Cadel have managed to save in 110k of time trialing if he only had a H3 or Zipp 808 up front instead of that “slow” Campy Bora I guess he should have rebadged more than the frame!
Cadel Evans with his Bora wheels finished 1 minute and 27 seconds faster than Contador in the time trial. The overall lead after 19 stages was 23 seconds.
Am I missing something on this post? Where else could he have saved any time?
Heck, all he had to do was at least “level” out his forearms and he most likely would’ve cut the margin in half…
Heck, all he had to do was at least “level” out his forearms and he most likely would’ve cut the margin in half…
Winning position:
Second place:
How many seconds did Evans lose for not using shoe aero covers?
We had a great conversation about this today. Looking at the data compiled on the TTX vs. sloping top tube China frame pictured in addition to wheel and potential positional data there is plenty of evidence to show that 23 seconds were available by equipment choices. Of course Cadel’s power output vs. front area can’t be seen from the photos.
Levi’s back-breaking work for Contador in the mtns trying to shake the Chicken probably didn’t help him find those 8 seconds either, nor did his time penalty.
-SD
We had a great conversation about this today. Looking at the data compiled on the TTX vs. sloping top tube China frame pictured in addition to wheel and potential positional data there is plenty of evidence to show that 23 seconds were available by equipment choices. Of course Cadel’s power output vs. front area can’t be seen from the photos.
Levi’s back-breaking work for Contador in the mtns trying to shake the Chicken probably didn’t help him find those 8 seconds either, nor did his time penalty.
-SD
you sound like al trouthead…levi didn’t do one f%#king ounce of work for contador. he sat his conservative ass behind popo or evans. contador was the worker, levi was just the observer from the rear.
Funny, I thought I saw him jersey stuffed full of bottles riding through the cars.
I’m not saying he buried himself Chris Horner style, but it appeared that he left 8 seconds in the mtns.
I’m sorry I missed Al’s coverage and I certainly could have been ill-informed. I’m just a casual observer with no real insight.
How many seconds did Evans lose for not using shoe aero covers?
Yowza! I can’t believe I didn’t notice that! Well, according to the chart here:
http://sheldonbrown.com/...ero/aerodynamics.htm
Lycra booties are worth ~13 seconds over 40K. If we extrapolate that out to 55.5K, that would be 18 seconds. Then again, Cadel is moving faster than the estimate assumes, so the time savings won’t be as great. I conservative estimate would be to just take half the gain, which would be ~10 seconds.
Sheesh…looks like almost half of that 23 second gap could have been closed with just a couple of small pieces of lycra…wow.
We had a great conversation about this today. Looking at the data compiled on the TTX vs. sloping top tube China frame pictured in addition to wheel and potential positional data there is plenty of evidence to show that 23 seconds were available by equipment choices. Of course Cadel’s power output vs. front area can’t be seen from the photos.
Levi’s back-breaking work for Contador in the mtns trying to shake the Chicken probably didn’t help him find those 8 seconds either, nor did his time penalty.
-SD
Dave,
What’s the CdA difference between the TTX and the “China frame”? I’m not looking for absolute numbers, just the difference.
How many seconds did Evans lose for not using shoe aero covers?
Yowza! I can’t believe I didn’t notice that! Well, according to the chart here:
http://sheldonbrown.com/...ero/aerodynamics.htm
Lycra booties are worth ~13 seconds over 40K. If we extrapolate that out to 55.5K, that would be 18 seconds. Then again, Cadel is moving faster than the estimate assumes, so the time savings won’t be as great. I conservative estimate would be to just take half the gain, which would be ~10 seconds.
Sheesh…looks like almost half of that 23 second gap could have been closed with just a couple of small pieces of lycra…wow.
The latest round of MIT testing done by one of the track clubs (posted here somewhere…) found shoe covers slower… My guess is that it was tunnel noise, and they weren’t actually slower, but I don’t think they would be 10 seconds… I’ve always found that to be one of the harder ones to really swallow.
How many seconds did Evans lose for not using shoe aero covers?
Yowza! I can’t believe I didn’t notice that! Well, according to the chart here:
http://sheldonbrown.com/...ero/aerodynamics.htm
Lycra booties are worth ~13 seconds over 40K. If we extrapolate that out to 55.5K, that would be 18 seconds. Then again, Cadel is moving faster than the estimate assumes, so the time savings won’t be as great. I conservative estimate would be to just take half the gain, which would be ~10 seconds.
Sheesh…looks like almost half of that 23 second gap could have been closed with just a couple of small pieces of lycra…wow.
The latest round of MIT testing done by one of the track clubs (posted here somewhere…) found shoe covers slower… My guess is that it was tunnel noise, and they weren’t actually slower, but I don’t think they would be 10 seconds… I’ve always found that to be one of the harder ones to really swallow.
Well…who are you going to believe, the MIT boys, or Chet Kyle? 
MIT’s computers are newer than Chet’s… Besides, what I like about you Tom is that you don’t necessarily believe ANYONE! Let’s call it 5sec, deal?
How many seconds did Evans lose for not using shoe aero covers?
Yowza! I can’t believe I didn’t notice that! Well, according to the chart here:
http://sheldonbrown.com/...ero/aerodynamics.htm
Lycra booties are worth ~13 seconds over 40K. If we extrapolate that out to 55.5K, that would be 18 seconds. Then again, Cadel is moving faster than the estimate assumes, so the time savings won’t be as great. I conservative estimate would be to just take half the gain, which would be ~10 seconds.
Sheesh…looks like almost half of that 23 second gap could have been closed with just a couple of small pieces of lycra…wow.
The latest round of MIT testing done by one of the track clubs (posted here somewhere…) found shoe covers slower… My guess is that it was tunnel noise, and they weren’t actually slower, but I don’t think they would be 10 seconds… I’ve always found that to be one of the harder ones to really swallow.
Discovery is in the wind tunnel alot. Wouldn’t they come to the same conclusion as the MIT boys?
MIT’s computers are newer than Chet’s… Besides, what I like about you Tom is that you don’t necessarily believe ANYONE! Let’s call it 5sec, deal?
That’s right…like a co-worker of mine used to say “Show me the DATA!”
Hmmm…my estimate was for plain lycra. Let’s say he should have used rubberized booties and call it 7 seconds. Deal?
Who knows… nobody ever has been able to replicate the claims that USPS/Disco made re: the Nike Spinsuit. Maybe the guys just feel shoe covers are faster. Or, then again, it is likely that they are a bit faster, and probably not slower, so why not where them. However, I also remember Lance wearing gloves during some of his TT’s, something that has generally been abandoned lately. Tunnel testing is hard, especially for something where you have to be pedaling. Gloves are easier to test because you can test a static position, so the balance is not subject to the same oscillating load as when a rider is pedaling. Testing shoe covers in a static position is not nearly as useful as testing them while pedaling. I would argue that static tests on shoe covers are basically meaningless. But I am not sure that they’d make enough difference to really have it show up while pedaling at 90rpm. That is the problem. I am not sure it is possible, currently, to accurately test something that makes such a small difference that must also be tested in motion. That’s my $0.02 anyway, from my experience with windtunnels (though I have not been for cycling). It’s one of those things where it seems reasonable that they should be faster, so why not wear them. If I was Evans, I certainly would have, but I don’t buy that he lost 10 seconds from not doing so…
MIT’s computers are newer than Chet’s… Besides, what I like about you Tom is that you don’t necessarily believe ANYONE! Let’s call it 5sec, deal?
That’s right…like a co-worker of mine used to say “Show me the DATA!”
Hmmm…my estimate was for plain lycra. Let’s say he should have used rubberized booties and call it 7 seconds. Deal?
6.667sec. That’s my final offer!
Don’t you mean that due to Cadel moving aster the time savings would be greater - not less?
no, I think less is correct, moving faster would give him less time to take the savings from.
5% of 1 hour is less time than say 5% of 1 hour and 10 minutes.
So going faster saves you less time.
I’m no math whiz, but that’s how I understand it to work.
-SD