What is usually the difference for open water swim times in triathlon ex 750m swim and a 500 yard swim in a pool. I know flip turns and other things like that aid the swimmer. But how do you know what kind of shape your in for open water. I swim around a 6:00 500 yard Free. What would that translate if I am a good open water swimmer? Thoughts.
Times are irrelevant in tris, as courses are not accurate, or something else is going on to affect the time. If you go 6 min for 500SCY, and are a good OW swimmer, you should be front pack in most sprints of the distance you are talking about, in the AG’s of course.
Keep hitting the pool like you do. Come race time, just hop onto the tail end of the lead group and hang on.
You have wind, waves, currents, how straight you swim, if the course has a dog leg, you can cut inside the course legally in most cases. So its’ hard to compare. I’m not so sure flip turns help you. You in reality basically coming to a stop, changing direction and using energy to accelerate again. I also find I get into a better tempo without turns, it’s more like running or cycling then. Throw in wetsuits on top of that.
Also remember open water times usually stop on land, so you have to get out of the water and run 20 yards to get your official time.
Like mentioned… don’t worry about it and just swim your pace, swim straight and try to find someone to draft off of,
Times are irrelevant in tris, as courses are not accurate, or something else is going on to affect the time. If you go 6 min for 500SCY, and are a good OW swimmer, you should be front pack in most sprints of the distance you are talking about, in the AG’s of course.
+1
My wife is a much faster pool swimmer than me but only slightly faster in open water. I know two guys who are very competitve against each other. One guy is faster in the pool every single time, the other guy faster in open water every single time. IMHO, there is little relevance between pool and open water times.
Flip turns do help…alot…if you have a good one with a tight streamline and a good breakout.
World Record for Long Course 50m free (no turns) = 20.91, Short Course 50m Free (1 turn) = 20.30. 100m Free LC (1 turn = 46.91, 100m Free SC (3 turns) = 44.94
I do agree though, not really a good way to compare pool v. open water. To many variables.
You have wind, waves, currents, how straight you swim, if the course has a dog leg, you can cut inside the course legally in most cases. So its’ hard to compare. I’m not so sure flip turns help you. You in reality basically coming to a stop, changing direction and using energy to accelerate again. I also find I get into a better tempo without turns, it’s more like running or cycling then. Throw in wetsuits on top of that.
Also remember open water times usually stop on land, so you have to get out of the water and run 20 yards to get your official time.
Like mentioned… don’t worry about it and just swim your pace, swim straight and try to find someone to draft off of,
As others have stated it’s difficult to compare for many reasons and the biggest reason may be can you swim an OW course straight buoy to buoy as it was designed? So much of that comes down to OW experience. The more you race the better you get at it assuming you are realizing your mistakes and learning.
I know people that roll on to their back and check their watch halfway through. Why? What is the point? Put your head down, get in your rhythm and go. I want to get my ass on my bike. The faster I get there without interruption the better. I tend to be pretty close in most races to pool times myself. I know a lot of guys that consistetly beat me in pool sets but they have never beat me in OW. I have been racing 11 years and a lot of them have been doing tri’s for 1 or 2 years. I chalk it up to OW experience more than anything.
Because I asked this question a while back when I was new on here and someone actually gave me a guess. (Even if it was wrong, I didn’t care. I just wanted a number)
You are a fairly comparable swimming in time to me (for the 500 at least) and on a normal course with wetsuit and no draft (I’ve never picked up how to do this successfully) I will aim to go anywhere from 21-20 min. The courses do vary widely in distance and SOOOO many other variables come into play. So really, everyone else on here is right, but I just wanted to give you some numbers, even if they dont mean much
While there are certainly variables, and individuals who skew the results of any pool to OW conversion, I don’t think it is accurate to say that you can make no generalizations - and in fact, my experience tells me that the pool tells us a lot about a person open water ability. When a course is relatively consistent, one can make some generalizations from year to year. Similarly, if someone is considerably faster in the pool, there is a high probability that they will also be faster in the OW. With folks who are close in pool speed, obviously it is hard to predict. There are exceptions that prove every rule of course, I have a friend who was only 5:08 in the 500 yard, yet he consistently beat guys i the OW who could go 4:45 in the pool.
I have begun compiling pool to OW conversions for some popular IM races, so far I only have results posted for IM Coeur d’Alene, but at least for that one you can see a pretty strong relationship:
http://www.findingfreestyle.com/im_cda_pace
Regards,
r.b.
you should be able to do 10-11min OW 750m with a wetsuit and decent conditions, is my guess. In my experience the wetsuit cancels out the turn advantage of the pool swim. Of course there are sighting issues and what Chuckie V calls the “open water mixed martial arts” aspects, but at that speed you should be clear of most of the maelstrom.
In the pool, I’ve done:
100m in 1:05
200m in 2:20
400m in 5:30
500m in 6:50
690m in 10:00
800m in 12:01
OW’s this year:
.3mi in 7:47 (8th out of 330) no wetsuit - felt terrible
1500m in 25:56 (166/800) no wetsuit - felt great
.25mi in 7:00 (8th out of 700) with wetsuit - felt decent
If you note: my last .25mi pace, albeit with wetsuit and higher placing in the race, was SLOWER than other two races.
so…who the hell knows. really hard to tell, with imperfect distances, water conditions, etc etc.
Of course there are sighting issues and … the “open water mixed martial arts” aspects, but at that speed you should be clear of most of the maelstrom.
Indeed. Core strength can get sorely tested in OW if its a rough day. Not to mention your GI tract if you swallow enough water.