So there are a few ‘AI’ training platforms out there now. Anyone got some updated feedback of what they are like? I have used Traineroad for sometime and am very impressed with how it has the self detecting FTP and constantly adapts your plan etc, but am curious on alternatives.
I used PKRS for my first race of the year. Paid for the coach version. Did pretty well at the race. It really bumps down your workouts based on how you’re feeling. It will strip the intensity or cancel workouts if you report that you’re tired. It seemed really polarized, mostly Z2 and Z5.
there was this thread recently
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Thanks, I’m interested to see if anyone has tried the alternatives also.
These automated training programs seem like a no brainier. After all most coaches would have a similar generic type outline, with the variables being heart rate, power, speed, frequency and general athlete feedback of fatigue etc.
On a Sunday what are the things that a coach looks at to determine what the plan for the week is, shouldn’t be too hard to automate this aspect?
The problem is that none of these applications have the data necessary to do anything interesting/differentiated/better compared to a coach or even just some program you buy off TraingPeaks.
Good coaches use more than just the data to make decisions. The data might show X, but you might be feeling Y. Also, every athlete has different habits, traits, etc. For example, I worked with a coach for a while who eventually discovered thatanytime we crossed over a -30 TSB, I’d get sick. Would an AI platform show that? Possibly. But having human discretion is still a valuable part of the equation, IMO.
Good coaches use more than just the data to make decisions. The data might show X, but you might be feeling Y. Also, every athlete has different habits, traits, etc. For example, I worked with a coach for a while who eventually discovered thatanytime we crossed over a -30 TSB, I’d get sick. Would an AI platform show that? Possibly. But having human discretion is still a valuable part of the equation, IMO.
The way you’re feeling is still data and at some point there will be a platform that is capable of taking that into consideration. There’s plenty of blind spots in AI generated training plans but your example is not one of them.
The problem is that none of these applications have the data necessary to do anything interesting/differentiated/better compared to a coach or even just some program you buy off TraingPeaks.
But the plans off Training Peaks aren’t adaptive are they? Where as I know with Traineroad it is constantly changing my plan based on what Im doing. I assume the others like Athletica AI etc are also.
As for coaches from what I can gather the overwhelming majority don’t offer a regular one on one weekly consultation without a premium price. Even then what are they getting from the convo other than a gauge for fatigue?
Nothing against coaches and I trust there is some nuance that automation can’t take into account, but for the overwhelming majority how do they plan for their athletes? They wouldnt be reinventing the wheel every week, they would have a general structure and then modify it slightly based on if the athlete is completing all the sessions and or their hr and pace etc-all aspects that can surely ( and have been…?) automated?
Good coaches use more than just the data to make decisions. The data might show X, but you might be feeling Y. Also, every athlete has different habits, traits, etc. For example, I worked with a coach for a while who eventually discovered thatanytime we crossed over a -30 TSB, I’d get sick. Would an AI platform show that? Possibly. But having human discretion is still a valuable part of the equation, IMO.
All these AI programs ask how you are feeling and adjust for reported levels of fatigue.
It would be interesting though if it could pick up trends like your example where every time you crossed over -30 you missed sessions and therefore automatically took this into account moving forward. Again if it doesn’t currently Im sure its something that they will be able to in the not to distant future.
Definitely interested in people’s experiences with these various programs. I’m happy with my 80/20 plan that I use via training peaks, but I think starting next year I’d be inclined to use one of these AI run programs as I progress in my fitness.
Good coaches use more than just the data to make decisions. The data might show X, but you might be feeling Y. Also, every athlete has different habits, traits, etc. For example, I worked with a coach for a while who eventually discovered thatanytime we crossed over a -30 TSB, I’d get sick. Would an AI platform show that? Possibly. But having human discretion is still a valuable part of the equation, IMO.
All these AI programs ask how you are feeling and adjust for reported levels of fatigue.
It would be interesting though if it could pick up trends like your example where every time you crossed over -30 you missed sessions and therefore automatically took this into account moving forward. Again if it doesn’t currently Im sure its something that they will be able to in the not to distant future.
an AI can take into account anything that can be measured, even if only subjectively, which is to say pretty much everything, it just depends how well programmed it is in much the same way that a really good coach will collect and incorporate lots of things into the planning, while a lesser (or cheaper) coaching plan will be more of a standard routine. the question is whether a given coaching service, be it AI or human, does in fact take into account all the relevant metrics. there is a bit of a difference in that AI at some level has to be programmed to understand relationships between factors such as TSB and compliance, whereas a human with true inteligence can work these out upon seeing them
another factor that many coaching services of either sort do not really take into account is the specific demands of a particular goal event and how that compares to the athletes strengths and weaknesses.
where i find AI tends to struggle most is with scheduling around complicated availability constraints and the overheads of training sessions eg travel to pool, showering etc
AI can’t draw faces or fingers very well either, so when it’s looking at you, it usually thinks your glocose/maltodextrin ratio is off and that you could probably use more reach in your position.
Definitely interested in people’s experiences with these various programs. I’m happy with my 80/20 plan that I use via training peaks, but I think starting next year I’d be inclined to use one of these AI run programs as I progress in my fitness.
After a couple of seasons using the 80/20 plans from the book for 1 year of sprints and 1 year of olympics I’m gonna give Athletica a go for Oceanside 70.3 next year. I’ll let you know how it goes.
Good coaches use more than just the data to make decisions. The data might show X, but you might be feeling Y. Also, every athlete has different habits, traits, etc. For example, I worked with a coach for a while who eventually discovered thatanytime we crossed over a -30 TSB, I’d get sick. Would an AI platform show that? Possibly. But having human discretion is still a valuable part of the equation, IMO.
All these AI programs ask how you are feeling and adjust for reported levels of fatigue.
Before adaptive training, I found TR on the verge of being too difficult sometimes but made big strides. With adaptive training and honest answers at each “how did that feel” and “why,” I find TR perfect. For the cost, I don’t see much benefit to getting a coach. The only coach I’d want is a swim coach because that isn’t purely an effort-based sport.
Yep I agree trainerroad had been great, but feel it neglects the run and swim aspects. It provides constant feedback on your cycling progress, but run and swim are nothing more than neglected poor red headed cousins…
So if there is a platform that is what TR is for cycling but across all three disciplines well shut up and take my money!!
While with adaptive training you’re less likely to overdo it (excessive volume of intensity is something that TR used to be “famous†for among triathletes), the general training prescription where they insist on having a number of moderate to hard workouts per week (on the bike alone, plus running and swimming) goes against what I’ve heard from experts.
Two half-assed, undercooked “threshold†or “VO2max†sessions in a week (undercooked because adaptive training dialed them down) are not what I’m looking for.
What I’m looking for is one solid session.
As a matter of fact, the biggest gains I made the year that I left TR and implemented a much easier cycling plan. The gains were in running off the bike as well as cycling.
How long ago was this?
Yep I agree trainerroad had been great, but feel it neglects the run and swim aspects. It provides constant feedback on your cycling progress, but run and swim are nothing more than neglected poor red headed cousins…
So if there is a platform that is what TR is for cycling but across all three disciplines well shut up and take my money!!
I guess the tricky thing here is that indoor riding with a power meter is such an isolated/controlled thing making it easy to adjust etc. Power is just such a good tool and does not work in the same way for running.
Yep I agree trainerroad had been great, but feel it neglects the run and swim aspects. It provides constant feedback on your cycling progress, but run and swim are nothing more than neglected poor red headed cousins…
So if there is a platform that is what TR is for cycling but across all three disciplines well shut up and take my money!!
I guess the tricky thing here is that indoor riding with a power meter is such an isolated/controlled thing making it easy to adjust etc. Power is just such a good tool and does not work in the same way for running.
What does a coach look at when evaluating run performance, speed for a given heart rate, tracked over time? Ai should be able to evaluate the same in a more accurate manner?
How long ago was this?
Must’ve been 3 or 4 years… I stayed subscribed after that, for a while, but was only doing custom workouts.