If our experience with the new SRAM Rival component kit is any indication of how SRAM will compare to Shimano in the marketplace, then their may be a mushroom cloud over Shimano headquarters.
SRAM’s Rival nukes Shimano.
Our first kit is the mid price point Rival and it is excellent in nearly every way save a couple.
First, dislikes: The lever can’t decide if it shoud be big or small. With Dura-Ace STI 7800 series the lever is so big you can put your hand anywhere. With Campagnolo Ergopower there really is one sweet spot. With Rival I just haven’t found it, but I like it more than Dura-Ace’s dual control lever and just a trifle less than Campag’s Ergo.
The outward canting ergonomics of the shifters feel and work very nicely. Why didn’t the rice guys and the pasta eaters get this right the first time around? Shifting is easier and so is braking. The controls are solid. The “shift logic” of the SRAM Rival is the best part. It is absolutely intuitive.
The brakes are a new standard. Only Campagnolo’s exotic new Record brake is likely to rival these, but at much more money.
The rear derailleur harkens back to some CNC’ed billet thing a guy made somewhere and that is nice if you like that sort of thing (I don’t). It does work as good as anything out there.
Given the torrent of brand cynicism that sometimes swirls around Shimano I would say SRAM will go from zero to hero with these new component kits. They are a valid competitor to at least Shimano, and possibly all Campagnolo south of Chorus.
Thanks Tom - I’m very interested in their Force components (mainly the shifter levers and rear derailleur and 11-26! rear cog). Looking forward to your opinion on this when you get your hands on it!
I have a number of miles on both as well. The Rival has a quite hard action on the front der. I do agree that the rear was okay, and oddly easier to shift than what I had thought it would be being as I am so used to Ergo levers. Plus, the fact that in the drops you can hold the shift lever back and shift either way is pretty neat.
The cranks leaves ALLOT to be desired. The brakes though they feel confident enough are lacking the finish of even Ultegra, let alone DA or Record.
The Force group was a bit improved on the Front Der but still requires more effort than my Record Ergo levers. I also did not notice the level of trim that I get from Record and recall from DA. I am thinking possibly this is due to the super tight wrap of the shift cable in the lever. Force crank again seemed to leave something out…not sure what. On the Orbea I was on I could provoke chain rub on a whim (and could not on the same frame with Ultegra 10).
I think it is great that there is another option. I am sure you know that SRAM has contracts with just 3 OEM’s and any other OEM will need to purchase groupsets from the three, or off shore (who decided that and did the bullet hole in his foot heal?) I would however not buy their groupset first year out…possibly even second.
No idea, but when were got busy today we were taking about wiring it up with a set of DA 7800 series bar-end shifters…
If you do…blind folded you wont know if you are on Record, Dura Ace, SRAM or Superbe Pro
Seems that being as SRAM said that you can use Shimano 10 wheels, the Shimano bar ends will work fine on the SRAM. I promise that the Shimano on the friction setting will work very well with SRAM. The thing is…the glory of the SRAM is the levers, I really doubt that there is any perfomance gain from SRAM with bar end shifters over Ultegra, Dura Ace, Chorus or Record. Seems the SRAM has no weight advantage to any of the listed groupsets, but has a current disadvantage as you cant go into any shop out there and get parts. The other issue may be that with wheelsets you may already own if it is not 100% Shimano compatible or 100% Campy compatible.
If we’re looking at weight for a tri package then sram is likely at a disadvantage to ShimaNO. Rival shifters are supposed to be ~180g lighter than Ultegra. The rival gruppo is supposed to be a little lighter overall and losing that massive advantage in shifter weight would most likely make it heavier. Maybe if they design a cheap and light barcon there will be an advantage in having Sram for tris but in the current situation of having to run friction shifting on a relatively unsupported product that is also heavier it just doesnt stack up.
Should be a good option for road bikes in a year or two when it has proven itself.
Possible, but unlikely. SRAM mtn derailleurs are not compatible with Shimano levers, even though they both use the same cassette. The actuation ratio is different.
Just so happens that I’ve got a VERY good contact at SRAM… so thought I’d share some information:
Rumor has it that bar-end shifters will be released at some point, but I have no idea when that’ll happen.
In the meantime, Shimano/Campy barends will almost certainly not work with SRAM der’s in index mode, but I’m not sure if that applies in friction mode also. It depends if the amount of cable pull from small to large cog is similar for SRAM and Shimano or Campy - your guess is as good as mine on that. If someone tries it, post the results here, as i’m curious.
SRAM Force/Rival shifters are compatible ONLY with SRAM Force/Rival derailleurs. The SRAM MTB derailleurs won’t work (it’s a slightly differen actuation ratio), and neither will Shimano.
The SRAM shifters/derailleurs were designed to work with Shimano rear cassette spacing as well as SRAM, and wheelsets should be interchangeable. Not sure if this holds true with Campy wheelsets or not.
That said, the SRAM road stuff works best as a complete system i.e. including SRAM cassette, crankset (chainrings most importantly) and chain. Just like how D/A works best as a complete D/A group… so no surprises there.
I agree with your post but for the “crankset”. That is the one thing that is equal as the front chainrings spacing is close enough to not matter. You can run SRAM with Campy, Shimano, FSA, ZIPP or any other crank you would like. My time on the SRAM crank told me that I dont want an SRAM crank…and the rumor is that even SRAM does not like their BB system.
I don’t think you’ll see a conventional set of bar end shifters from SRAM. They tend to do their own thing rather than copy a century old remote downtube shifter.
“Maybe I’m just plain stupid, but I cannot get SRAM chains to work with the 11:th cog on any shimano cassette… Maybe another thread”
Get a SRAM 11 speed lockring, and it’ll work fine…the chain is bottoming out on the S/O lockring–sometimes even their 11 speed lockring. The OD of the SRAM is a little smaller, and it works fine with S/O cassettes.
As far as Tom’s review of the SRAM stuff, it to me is the definition of hyperbole. I’d hazard a guess I’ve ridden it more than almost anyone on this forum, and in race conditions. It’s fine stuff–but it’s not putting Shimano out of business anytime soon. At the end of the day, it’s just a shifter.
“As far as Tom’s review of the SRAM stuff, it to me is the definition of hyperbole. I’d hazard a guess I’ve ridden it more than almost anyone on this forum, and in race conditions. It’s fine stuff–but it’s not putting Shimano out of business anytime soon. At the end of the day, it’s just a shifter.”
Bingo.
I spent some time on both groups today, and frankly, it was total flat-line for me on the excitement meter. Works well, has it’s own set of issues/problems, about the same as Campy/Shimano. Blah. Nothing revolutionary here, doesn’t do anything the other guy’s stuff doesn’t.
So, hey - some “cons…”
the “little tiny girl” in the shop couldn’t work it at all - shift lever throw was just too long to operate.
My finger got stuck between the 2 levers when I “heel-toed” the shift/brake functions. Unlike Campy and Shimano, the shift lever pivots independantly of the brake lever, so if you try to shift and brake at the same time, the brake lever drops down below the shift lever, and stops it from moving until you release the brake. I didn’t like this at all.
No barcons yet.
The rep had no idea if the brake cable pull was disc brake compatible.
The cranks aren’t exactly mind-blowing. Pretty much aluminum Ultegra level, or carbon Ultegra level, take your pick.