New Tacx Vortex Smart...how do I control this thing?

niccolo · December 16, 2015, 6:45am

Got my new Tacx Vortex Smart, my first trainer, based on recs here and from DCR. All set up, but the instructions provided are ridiculously lean, and I’m not seeing anything more detailed for downloading from the manufacturer website (http://www.tacx.com/products/trainers/vortex-smart). So I’m left with a bunch of rather basic questions:

How do I control the resistance of this thing? Right now I have an iPhone, no tablet, though I will likely get a tablet down the road to use with it (and be able to use specific workouts from places like Trainer Road). I’ve downloaded two apps to the iPhone, Tacx Training app and Tacx utility. They both connect to the trainer via bluetooth. But I’m not seeing any way to manually control the resistance through either, though.
Do I want to be checking/updating the firmware on this thing? If so, I presume through one of the two apps I mentioned above?
With a smart trainer, what’s the appropriate place to leave the gears? Is it ever appropriate to shift during a workout or is resistance solely based on the trainer’s braking forces?
How snugly should the trainer contact the tire? Just snug enough not to slip? Or more robustly?

Sorry for such super basic questions, and if I’m just missing the manual that answers them on the Tacx website, by all means point me in the right direction. Much appreciated!

acco · December 16, 2015, 9:58am

For a general understanding and some good comments, go here:

http://support.trainerroad.com/hc/en-us/sections/200282010-Electronic-Trainers-

and here:
http://www.dcrainmaker.com/2015/06/trainer-profile-zwifttrainerroadkinomap.html#comment-1406953
.

ms6073 · December 16, 2015, 1:53pm

In the Tacx training app, after you have paired your Vortex, you can click on the menu and select a either a Slope, Power, or Hear Rate based workout. Once the workout starts, you can control the resistance level by using the plus and minus buttons at the bottom of the app page:

The_GMAN_Retired · December 16, 2015, 2:00pm

I have the Tacx Neo smart and I cannot get the iOS version of the app to work correctly. I cannot control the power (ERG mode) with the iOS version of the Tacx app. The Android version works fine so that’s what I use.

So the OP might be having the same issue that I have.

niccolo · December 16, 2015, 7:11pm

I have the Tacx Neo smart and I cannot get the iOS version of the app to work correctly. I cannot control the power (ERG mode) with the iOS version of the Tacx app. The Android version works fine so that’s what I use.

So the OP might be having the same issue that I have.

At this point I’m not sure I’ve gotten far enough to have the issue you’re having. Using the Tacx Training app, I can select Slope, Power, and Heart Rate training options.

But I’m not sure how to access ERG mode–or is that a default in Power mode?

I don’t currently have a power meter, and I’m not totally clear on how virtual power can substitute.

Basically, I’m a total newbie here, reading what I can to try to understand my new toy.

dfroelich · December 16, 2015, 8:50pm

First off, yes, you should update the firmware of the trainer through the iOS app. Without that, you cannot do FE-C, which enables control by Zwift and GC (and others).

Above someone has a good explainer of the power and slope mode. That is a good way to control it manually through bluetooth. (firmware update not needed, but still a good idea)

As for gearing, I keep in near the center of the cassette and switch between the big and little ring for rest/intervals. The resistance unit in it is not as strong as others, so I think it helps to add your own with bigger gears.

niccolo · December 16, 2015, 10:24pm

First off, yes, you should update the firmware of the trainer through the iOS app. Without that, you cannot do FE-C, which enables control by Zwift and GC (and others).

Above someone has a good explainer of the power and slope mode. That is a good way to control it manually through bluetooth. (firmware update not needed, but still a good idea)

As for gearing, I keep in near the center of the cassette and switch between the big and little ring for rest/intervals. The resistance unit in it is not as strong as others, so I think it helps to add your own with bigger gears.

Firmware updated.

I only have Bluetooth (BT), not ANT+ FE-C, via my iPhone currently, but the Tacx apps are able to control the trainer via BT. I believe Trainer Road and some others don’t yet support control of the trainer via BT, so I think I’d have to get an ANT+ dongle if I were to use them (though I’m guessing BT support is in the pipeline). I’ve been using the Wahoo Fitness app to track workouts, I’m not certain whether I can use that, via BT, to control the trainer.

Did I miss an explainer about power and slope mode, or just the note above that they exist? I’m still not completely clear on how they work, to be honest. I don’t have a power meter, but I believe the trainer can generate a virtual power figure. So in power mode, that means I set a power target, say 150 watts, and then stay on that? Or in slope mode, I set a target slope, which just means the trainer generates a certain resistance, and then stay on that? Same for heart rate?

In order to be able to do these things, I think I need to calibrate the trainer, and both the Tacx utility and training apps have a function for that.

Really appreciate all the help!

dfroelich · December 16, 2015, 11:03pm

…

Did I miss an explainer about power and slope mode, or just the note above that they exist? I’m still not completely clear on how they work, to be honest. I don’t have a power meter, but I believe the trainer can generate a virtual power figure. So in power mode, that means I set a power target, say 150 watts, and then stay on that? Or in slope mode, I set a target slope, which just means the trainer generates a certain resistance, and then stay on that? Same for heart rate?

In order to be able to do these things, I think I need to calibrate the trainer, and both the Tacx utility and training apps have a function for that.

Really appreciate all the help!

Yes, you have it exactly correct. In power mode, it will continuously moderate the resistance in order to keep you at a given power figure. Therefore, you can spin fast and it’ll have a lower resistance load to keep you at 150W relative to mashing at 60 RPM with high resistance…but you will still be at about 150W. It is very important to calibrate the trainer as often as you please. I sometimes see a little drift, so a mid ride calibration snaps it back into place (relative to the presumed consistent power measurements from my P1 pedals).

Slope mode just gives you a set resistance level and then you use your shifting (and/or cadence) to modulate power output.

niccolo · December 17, 2015, 2:29am

Great, really appreciate all the insights!

Tri_Monkey · December 17, 2015, 5:04am

As far as the tire contact, I found that if I calibrate the Vortex Smart with the app and adjust it to the acceptable range, the wattage from the trainer end up being ~40-50W lower than my power meter. So that’s too tight. I finally got around to adjust the tension based on my power meter tonight. By the time I get both to match within a few watts, it ended up being pretty loose (all the way to the left side of the calibration scale). I haven’t try any workout yet, but I there was no tire slipping just doing a few short burst.

niccolo · December 17, 2015, 5:25am

As far as the tire contact, I found that if I calibrate the Vortex Smart with the app and adjust it to the acceptable range, the wattage from the trainer end up being ~40-50W lower than my power meter. So that’s too tight. I finally got around to adjust the tension based on my power meter tonight. By the time I get both to match within a few watts, it ended up being pretty loose (all the way to the left side of the calibration scale). I haven’t try any workout yet, but I there was no tire slipping just doing a few short burst.

Appreciate the heads up, especially since I don’t currently have a power meter.

dfroelich · December 17, 2015, 4:31pm

There are 3 installation settings that you can switch between by partially disassembling the base. You remove 2 hex screws and then can change it somehow.
I did not notice this when I put mine together, but got lucky and must have done the right one while putting it together. It is within 5-10 W of my P1 pedals on its worse day and calibrates right in the middle of that green bar.
Perhaps take it back apart and try another of those settings.

ms6073 · December 17, 2015, 7:02pm

I found that if I calibrate the Vortex Smart with the app and adjust it to the acceptable range, the wattage from the trainer end up being ~40-50W lower than my power meter.
That has been a point of confusion for quite some time and Tacx has not done much to help clarify. While logic would infer that the center of the calibration scale should be the ideal target, in simplest terms anywhere in the green range provides an acceptable calibration. Heavier and/or more powerful riders might opt for setting roller tension so that they get calibrations to the right of center of the green zone to avoid slippage. Simplest terms, those with an external powermeter will find the most accurate results by setting aside 20-30 minutes and adjusting roller tension to achieve calibration values that minimize disparity between the Vortex and external powermeter.

There are 3 installation settings that you can switch between by partially disassembling the base.
More accurately, there are 3-notches in the position block which adjust the motorbrake in order to account for differences in tire/wheel sizes between road and mountain bikes. The image below is for the Tacx Bushido but the part should be the same for the Vortex/Vortex Smart and as you can see, has a range of diameters and position 1 is most often used for road bikes although heavier and/or more powerful riders have found position 2 to be a better choice. Based on my experiences with a dedicated trainer wheel with a Continental Trainer Tire, if I mount the brake in position 1, I can adjust roller tension to get resistance within ~5-watts of my SRM but the amount of roller tension adjustment is limited as the tension is close to coming unscrewed. Alternatively when I tried position two, while I was also able to achieve good parity with SRM, during training, the brake is unable to reduce resistance below ~130 watts, which was a non-starter as that is within 30-watts of my wife’s FTP. A final word of caution - the position block is thermo plastic and the tabs are not very robust and it is very easy to fatigue the tabs which then allow the brake to slide and will cause very inaccurate calibration results as every time you release/close the brake to tension the wheel, the brake will move and alter the contact point, and will require replacement of the position block to correct.

daustin · September 7, 2016, 12:13pm

I found that if I calibrate the Vortex Smart with the app and adjust it to the acceptable range, the wattage from the trainer end up being ~40-50W lower than my power meter.
That has been a point of confusion for quite some time and Tacx has not done much to help clarify. While logic would infer that the center of the calibration scale should be the ideal target, in simplest terms anywhere in the green range provides an acceptable calibration. Heavier and/or more powerful riders might opt for setting roller tension so that they get calibrations to the right of center of the green zone to avoid slippage. Simplest terms, those with an external powermeter will find the most accurate results by setting aside 20-30 minutes and adjusting roller tension to achieve calibration values that minimize disparity between the Vortex and external powermeter.

There are 3 installation settings that you can switch between by partially disassembling the base.
More accurately, there are 3-notches in the position block which adjust the motorbrake in order to account for differences in tire/wheel sizes between road and mountain bikes. The image below is for the Tacx Bushido but the part should be the same for the Vortex/Vortex Smart and as you can see, has a range of diameters and position 1 is most often used for road bikes although heavier and/or more powerful riders have found position 2 to be a better choice. Based on my experiences with a dedicated trainer wheel with a Continental Trainer Tire, if I mount the brake in position 1, I can adjust roller tension to get resistance within ~5-watts of my SRM but the amount of roller tension adjustment is limited as the tension is close to coming unscrewed. Alternatively when I tried position two, while I was also able to achieve good parity with SRM, during training, the brake is unable to reduce resistance below ~130 watts, which was a non-starter as that is within 30-watts of my wife’s FTP. A final word of caution - the position block is thermo plastic and the tabs are not very robust and it is very easy to fatigue the tabs which then allow the brake to slide and will cause very inaccurate calibration results as every time you release/close the brake to tension the wheel, the brake will move and alter the contact point, and will require replacement of the position block to correct.

This is an older thread but wanted to say thanks for this detailed explanation. I recently got the tacx vortex smart and it did take a little while to sort this position out. It’s a total crap design. My previous Cycleops trainer had it right. Just a knob that you turn until it pops and you’re done. I’m now jealous seeing the cycleops magnus coming out in the fall.