Anyone else experience this? I have some decent sized (nickel to quarter sized) knots in the outside of my left calf that have been there for 2+ years, near as I can tell. I also have a bigger knot in the middle of my back on the right side and a smaller knot under it.
They seem to be right on the tendons/muscles and are really, really hard. To the point that if I’m rolling my calf with a rolling pin on the floor there are audible “pops”, etc. They don’t hurt, but I have had all sorts of left foot issues (PF, achilles tendonitis, and that other tibial tendon thingy) and my lower right back has always gotten a little niggle on extended climbs while running or riding. So at this point I’m wondering if there’s a correlation…
I massage them all the time with a baseball, softball, or rolling pin but they never seem to get smaller or really change in any way. They move around when I push them. I sometimes get a similar knot in the shoulders but that comes and goes.
It’s almost like the ones on my calf and back are calcified or something. One orthopedist gave me injections straight into two of the knots ( a muscle relaxer I think) but it didn’t do a thing.
The sub thing cysts on wiki it definitely don’t look like any of those (the cysts being visible on the person). Is that how they normally look?
They don’t potrude out of my skin. They’re on my muscles/tendons. When I kneed the muscle or tendon the full length I hit them. When I manipulate or flex the muscle they move along with it.
These are just little knots, similar to the tension knots you get in your shoulders or something that can massaged out. Except these can’t be massaged out (seemingly).
As I mentioned, one ortho gave me an injection to try and relax them and another said they’d just go away, but I’m wondering if I should see a non-orthopedist or something?
As mentioned, they don’t do anything. Aren’t painful or the like. Just wondering if it’s scar tissue or something that might be shortening or hindering muscle movement thus leading to my bouts of PF, etc.
Any other ideas?
Sounds like kind of an odd thing that others haven’t really experienced, though.
If it’s truly a trigger point in the muscle then one option that is more aggressive than your rolling techniques is dry needling. Also, the trigger points often form because of an overuse or overloading issue that the tissue can’t withstand and/or from poor strength/neuromuscular activation. Fix the strength/activation and they won’t form as badly.
Does “ganglion” or “ganglion cyst” fit the description?
Hmm. Wiki says they usually occur near joints, especially in the hands or feet.
Mine are on one or two of those outer calf muscles/tendons about halfway between the knee and ankle, and then on another muscle mid back (guess that’s close to a joint, though).
It also says “Ganglion cysts are easily diagnosed, as they are visible and pliable to touch.”, though, so I don’t know.
Maybe something to look more into, though. Thanks.
If it’s truly a trigger point in the muscle then one option that is more aggressive than your rolling techniques is dry needling. Also, the trigger points often form because of an overuse or overloading issue that the tissue can’t withstand and/or from poor strength/neuromuscular activation. Fix the strength/activation and they won’t form as badly.
Thanks. Is dry needling like acupuncture? Are they leaving the needles in for a time period or just repeatedly stabbing through the tissue?
And yeah, definitely think there’s an issue further up the chain, notably in my lower back or pelvis or something. I’m trying to work on that in the weight room at the moment but I still haven’t completely figured out the problem.
I have dealt with muscle knots in my gluts and lower back since '11, when I picked up the sport. Have tried PT, Chiro, Accupuncture, pro bike fit, and foam roller. Furthermore have read numerous books on bike/run form and technique.
The foam roller allows me to continue to participate in Tri, but the others saw limited to negative results. For example, massage as never been able to untie knot. Chiro was a disaster. Obviously these are small samples, but I do think your condition is related I.e. shoulder to back to calf.
I return to PT tomorrow searching for answers to similar questions you have. Notably, how to get the knot out for long term???
I have dealt with muscle knots in my gluts and lower back since '11, when I picked up the sport. Have tried PT, Chiro, Accupuncture, pro bike fit, and foam roller. Furthermore have read numerous books on bike/run form and technique.
The foam roller allows me to continue to participate in Tri, but the others saw limited to negative results. For example, massage as never been able to untie knot. Chiro was a disaster. Obviously these are small samples, but I do think your condition is related I.e. shoulder to back to calf.
I return to PT tomorrow searching for answers to similar questions you have. Notably, how to get the knot out for long term???
Derek
Yeah, foam roller doesn’t even touch them for me. Baseballs and rolling pins really get in there, though, and the sound when using them against the wall or floor is crazy.
I’m trying a chiropractor for the first time next Monday to try and determine if I have some pelvic tilt or anything going on and was going to ask him about the knots.
Dry needling uses acupuncture needles but with the intent of provoking a twitch response, a.k.a. contraction, from the muscle tissue. Also, moving the needle around repeatedly and rapidly in a variety of directions does provide some opportunity to break up that hardened tissue. Placing the needle at a single site isn’t going to do that much. Sometimes I do place the needles at a single site and then apply electrical stimulation to the needle to provoke contraction. Most of the time I just get as many twitches from the trigger point area as I can. That isn’t comfortable so I just go as long as the person tolerates it. Don’t watch too many videos on the subject because there’s a big variety in people’s techniques. Some practitioners stretch the muscle as they needle it, which isn’t fun.
Sometimes the injured muscle is plenty strong but compensating for another weak muscle in the area, thereby becoming overworked. Postural issues can be a large factor, either when on the bike or in your day to day.
Pretty much all people will have trigger points in their muscles but only some are more active, tender and painful while others are non-symptomatic. Don’t get too caught up on finding every hard spot and trying to get rid of them all. Keep the whole muscle regularly healthy with your pressure and rolling work and/or with deep tissue massage.
I had a bout of Achilles Tendonitis and had the electric acupuncture a few times and it was very effective in the beginning. I could go and run 15k the next day with zero pain whatsoever. As the issue turned towards PF, though, it stopped being effective altogether.
I’ve never heard of just the needling, though. Not sure if any places around here have it but I’ll look into it a bit more.
I’ll second the use of dry needles. I’ve used it for my calf knots and they went away in a few days. Best of all, I was able to keep running and not take a few weeks off like I previously needed to do before I tried dry needling.
Your description doesn’t fit the trigger points in myofascial pain syndrome. Those are sensitive to pressure, usually causing a twitch response and the person to “jump” when touched. Plus, the ortho’s injection didn’t help.