Although I’m probably not even MOP by ST standards (30 min 1.5K swim), but around my neck of the woods a half hour OD swim gets me to the front of the MOP. I swam for a few years for a club in middle school - so when I picked up tri’s 15 years later I had some semblance of a swim stroke. Am doing 3X per week - just curious for one that could use some work on their stroke, should I primarily be doing sets to keep form, or should I do more continuous swims to build my base and form will follow (assuming form is somewhat close)? Initially was thinking of doing 2 days of sets and 1 continuous swim of ~1500-2000 yds (training for OD)?? Can’t possibly do more than 3x per week at this point, so getting in more than 6k or so per week is not an option.
Chicken and egg. You need to develop good form to develop efficiency (speed) and you need to develop speed and hold good form to get faster.
Continuous pool swims, in my opinion, are an utter waste of time. They only seem to serve as a confidence boost so that the swimmer “knows they can do the distance.” I watch triathletes doing continuous swims in the lap lanes while I coach masters. They stay the same speed, and my swimmers get faster.
Question: you have 3x a week and you only have time to do 2k? Try to do at least 2.5k per session- 3k if you can.
Start a workout with some drill work, warm up and then do a main set of 1k-1.5k. Mix up shorter faster efforts 10x100 on a base that gives you 10 sec rest while holding an above race pace effort, with longer efforts like 3x500 at near race pace with 30 sec rest. Then if you have time do a little more drill work at the end. If you only have time to swim 2k, it should be all QUALITY stuff. You should be really tired after a good quality workout.
Obviously have no idea what your stroke looks like, but general drills I think are good are i) finger tip drag to loosen up your shoulders and try to lead your stroke with your elbow, not your hand ii)some sort of drill where you pause on your side and kick a few beats, 3 strokes, pause on the other and iii)some work with paddles to improve catch position and shoulder strength
Good stuff. Thanks for the input. Speaking of masters - was thinking of joining local club here that happen to meet the 3 mornings I am able to swim. Only question is I see some of their workouts, and a lot of the sets are IM work. I’m guessing I might be opening a can of worms - but wouldn’t I be better served doing purely freestyle in my sets if my #1 goal is a faster swim time in a triathalon? Would like to join masters to have a coach, but understand I’m probably not going to get advice from him if I’m doing my own workouts…
It probably is a can of worms but I for one think it helps your triathlon training to do IM workouts. The IM days at my club are probably 50% freestyle anway. Improving your backstroke/fly will probably make you a better freestyler IMO. It’s very rare to see a person who can swim any other stroke better than freestyle. Plus IM is harder, you get more bang for your buck if you’re time limited.
I understand your dilemma; while I think that IM work is great for overall feel of the water and swim strength, and indeed you can become a faster freestyle swimmer doing some IM work, I agree with you that if you only have time for 6k a week you should dedicate that to doing freestyle as much as possible.
I can’t speak for your masters program, but often the triathletes I coach will do freestyle instead of IM; as long as they lead the lane and make sure everyone in their lane doing the actual IM set is getting enough rest, no one has a problem with it. Usually if you are up front and honest about your ability and goals fellow swimmers and the coach will be receptive.
It’s worth having a conversation with the coach about your goals and asking what their philosophy is. Some great resources on slowtwitch here- youtube videos of stroke mechanics and detailed technical info from garyhallsr. Check that out too.
But bottom line to get better is: time in the pool, doing quality swim sets.
Day 1 - fast, well above race pace 200’s and less
Day 2 - around race pace 200s-500’s
Day 3 - mix of stroke, mid distance intervals (150-300) and some short faster then race effort sprints.
I just pick a workout from “Swim Workouts in a Binder” by Gale Bernhardt based on how I am feeling that day. There are lots of 2500 yard workouts that take about 45-minutes.
Chicken and egg. You need to develop good form to develop efficiency (speed) and you need to develop speed and hold good form to get faster.
Continuous pool swims, in my opinion, are an utter waste of time. They only seem to serve as a confidence boost so that the swimmer “knows they can do the distance.” I watch triathletes doing continuous swims in the lap lanes while I coach masters. They stay the same speed, and my swimmers get faster.
Question: you have 3x a week and you only have time to do 2k? Try to do at least 2.5k per session- 3k if you can.
Start a workout with some drill work, warm up and then do a main set of 1k-1.5k. Mix up shorter faster efforts 10x100 on a base that gives you 10 sec rest while holding an above race pace effort, with longer efforts like 3x500 at near race pace with 30 sec rest. Then if you have time do a little more drill work at the end. If you only have time to swim 2k, it should be all QUALITY stuff. You should be really tired after a good quality workout.
Obviously have no idea what your stroke looks like, but general drills I think are good are i) finger tip drag to loosen up your shoulders and try to lead your stroke with your elbow, not your hand ii)some sort of drill where you pause on your side and kick a few beats, 3 strokes, pause on the other and iii)some work with paddles to improve catch position and shoulder strength
this! +1
Although I’m probably not even MOP by ST standards (30 min 1.5K swim), but around my neck of the woods a half hour OD swim gets me to the front of the MOP. I swam for a few years for a club in middle school - so when I picked up tri’s 15 years later I had some semblance of a swim stroke. Am doing 3X per week - just curious for one that could use some work on their stroke, should I primarily be doing sets to keep form, or should I do more continuous swims to build my base and form will follow (assuming form is somewhat close)? Initially was thinking of doing 2 days of sets and 1 continuous swim of ~1500-2000 yds (training for OD)?? Can’t possibly do more than 3x per week at this point, so getting in more than 6k or so per week is not an option.
the swim group that I work out with never do long continuos sets of 1500-2000.
Typical workout for me is something along lines of (all in yards)
- 500 free
- 200 kick
- 500 pull
1 minute break
-10 x 50s drill sets (do a drill for 25 yards…flip turn…then do free the other 25 yards). - main set (something maybe like 5 x 200s on set time, or 16x75s broken up into four distinct sets)
- warm down
will get you around 2500-3000 yards in about 75 minutes or less.
Continuous pool swims, in my opinion, are an utter waste of time. They only seem to serve as a confidence boost so that the swimmer “knows they can do the distance.” I watch triathletes doing continuous swims in the lap lanes while I coach masters. They stay the same speed, and my swimmers get faster.
I’m one of those triathletes in the lap lane swimming continuously - however, I’m mixing up the intensity, and in different quantities - I find that by not having any rest time (contrary to many swim programs) I build excellent fitness, especially for an all out 2k - quite a few times I’ve come out of the water ahead of triathletes who always out-swim me in the pool. (though, to be honest, it could also be that the wetsuit covers up all my hairiness making me sleeker)
IMHO, the weak points of many swim programs are the rest intervals (there are no rest intervals during the swim in a tri race) and lack of a long, continuous (fartlek-like) swim. But I’m talking out of my@ss coz I taught myself to swim.
Probably the easiest and best advice here!
Is there a concept of a base phase in swimming like running and cycling? Or should just do intervals all year? Or does the base endurance from cycling/running apply pretty well to swimming that you don’t need it?
I’m with you. I swam on teams as a kid. When I came back to swimming at age 42 I swam sets, drills etc. My first IM was 1:03. I have swam masters programs, had a coach trying to get faster. 10 years later I swam 1:03 at the same race. For the last couple of years all my swims are continuous mixing up the intensities. I do not swim any slower and I feel great coming out of the water. I think there is a place for swimming 3000 - 4000 continuous on a regular basis especially if you primarily do long course racing.
+1 to Desert Dude’s outline, but I would sub drill progressions for all but the sprints on day #3
+1 to npda’s comments about long straight swims, actually, I would go a plus 10 on that. Long straight swims for the average MOP’er and BOP’er are likely to make you worse rather than better. Every few months you can throw in some thousands and above, but in my experience people with iffy strokes will make themselves slower by relying too heavily on long straight swims.
regards,
r.b.