So when is Masters swimming not beneficial for Triathletes? DOing mostly 100’s? THat push up work out…
Just curious on some thoughts, I have read alot of people are happy with it but seems to depend on the coach. Here its like he is more intersted in swimmers… not triathletes.
My masters swim coaches are of course more concerned with swimmers than triathletes, the coaches are long time swimmers, although one of mine does do Tri’s now as well, and the majority of the people in attendance are not Triathletes although we do have a decent crowd.
For what I pay (100 a year), I get 4 days a week of either evening or morning pool time, designed workouts, coaching and technique and a pretty decent group of friends. I sometimes get frustrated at doing sprint 50s and 100s and other things that don’t immediately seem like they fit into my age-grouper smooth and steady wins the day approach to Tri swimming, but that is why I do my own open water workouts. The pool excercises, even the speedwork goes a long way to helping with those more hectic parts of Tri’s such as the wave start, the recovering from a sudden kick or obstacle, etc.
Masters swimming can be frustrating though, and I’ve thought to myself more than once or twice after getting owned in some workouts “…well… I’d like to see your ass out on the bike!” but the sad thing is, a lot of the guys who tear it up at masters are also guys who bring it in all disciplines at local races, it at least appears to be paying off for them.
While there are differences between pool swimming and triathlon swimming, the truth is, most triathletes just need to focus on becoming better swimmers. Most are not good enough to start worrying about the differences between the two.
You can do all the training of a full-time swimmer, and you will probably be in the top 5% out of the water at most races. When you start getting to the top, then it becomes more important to focus more on the specific needs of triathlon swimming.
Do the master’s workouts and get in some open water swims of your own, and you will be a faster triathlon swimmer.
While there are differences between pool swimming and triathlon swimming, the truth is, most triathletes just need to focus on becoming better swimmers. Most are not good enough to start worrying about the differences between the two.
You can do all the training of a full-time swimmer, and you will probably be in the top 5% out of the water at most races. When you start getting to the top, then it becomes more important to focus more on the specific needs of triathlon swimming.
Do the master’s workouts and get in some open water swims of your own, and you will be a faster triathlon swimmer.
QFT
IMHO, it’s always beneficial. When you run, you probably train like a runner (1 mile repeats, strides, tempo). When you bike you train like a cyclist (FTP, hills, TT’s, LSD). So why wouldn’t you want to train like a swimmer? I will admit that the 50’s and 100’s aren’t ideal for “in season” but during the winter they are great for building speed. During the tri season, just cut back a bit on masters and add some OWS or continuous swimming in the pool to hone your needs for tris.
I agree with one addition.
I feel newer swimmers need more open water confidence. Once you have that, pool time is all you really need. Just keep training like a swimmer.
jaretj
I agree with one addition.
I feel newer swimmers need more open water confidence. Once you have that, pool time is all you really need. Just keep training like a swimmer.
The occasional half hour game of water polo or even full contact sharks & minnows during swim practice can actually help a person develop a fair number of open water tools in a pool environment too-how to sight, change directions quickly, deal with incidental and not so incidental contact, treating water if you need to adjust your goggles, etc.
OH, I miss sharks and minnows!!! I haven’t played that for years. Same with our HS “water polo” (wasn’t polo, was a “reward” from practice where we got to beat the hell out of each other - boys and girls mixed - I’ve never done anything as challenging since)…was really like trying to drown each other. I’m not sure that it did much for my OWS, but it sure did a lot for my mean streak!
Wonder if I could convince any of my club to play sharks and minnows…
What would a coach who is interested in triathletes do differently than a coach interested in swimmers?
Either way, you want to swim like a swimmer, not barely survive like a triathlete.
If the coach has too much stroke for your liking then you could just swim free during those sets anyways.
I think it is beneficial for triathletes pretty much all the time except maybe in the 4 weeks or so prior to a race. At that point you should begin focusing more on tri-specific sets (longer, sprint at beginning of endurance sets, open water, sighting, etc…) But in general I think it is a great workout year-round, and the more you do it the better your technique should get. Also, one other advantage is that master’s swimming is a good way to do some high-intensity intervals without tearing yourself up as in running or biking. It seems easier to recover from a hard master’s workout than a hard track or interval workout on the bike.
I went to my first masters workout last week and when the coach found out the three guys in my lane were triathletes she had us line up on the T at the end of our single lane. Then we started at the same time, raced head out of water for 1/3 of the pool, regular freestyle for 1/3, and heads up for 1/3 to the other end. Catch our breaths, tread water over the T at that end, and same thing back. I was pretty battered and bruised from the contact with the other 2 swimmers and the hard plastic lane barrier, but it sure reminded me a lot of a tri swim!
I liked everything up to the point where you are saying to do your 50’s and 100’s in the winter. Do you do your mile run repeats in the winter and then stop in season? I hope the answer is no. So, why would you do that in the pool?
There is no reason to train any differently for swimming than cycling or running (if you want to be competitive). Build a base, then build speed. Same reason you do speed workouts on the bike and run. Some days have to be hard sprint type efforts, others should be endurance.
IMHO, it’s always beneficial. When you run, you probably train like a runner (1 mile repeats, strides, tempo). When you bike you train like a cyclist (FTP, hills, TT’s, LSD). So why wouldn’t you want to train like a swimmer? I will admit that the 50’s and 100’s aren’t ideal for “in season” but during the winter they are great for building speed. During the tri season, just cut back a bit on masters and add some OWS or continuous swimming in the pool to hone your needs for tris.
I agree with one addition.
I feel newer swimmers need more open water confidence. Once you have that, pool time is all you really need. Just keep training like a swimmer.
The occasional half hour game of water polo or even full contact sharks & minnows during swim practice can actually help a person develop a fair number of open water tools in a pool environment too-how to sight, change directions quickly, deal with incidental and not so incidental contact, treating water if you need to adjust your goggles, etc.
x2
The most beneficial thing I have ever done for my open water swimming was 4 years of high school water polo.
Play one game as a 2-meter guard and triathlon swims will seem downright easy.
Masters elevated my swimming quite a bit and my tri swim times were pretty good (after Masters some time in a Masters program) for someone with no particular swimming background. I found that I pushed myself harder/longer (even if the longest interval we did was 500 yards) than I would otherwise when training solo. I personally think that the long, slow steady swims in preparation for a HIM or IM are extremely overrated. Thus, I would recommend joining a good Masters program even if it is “geared” towards swimmers (i.e. shorter, harder intervals).
As you can see I said “cut back a bit on masters and add some OWS…” I’d like to think that it was intuitively obvious to the OP that continuing masters during season, albeit a bit “cut back”, also meant doing a speed workout or 2/week during the season with the masters group. If not, then that is what I meant.