First mary was 3:40. Is it possible/realistic to go sub 3:30 (to qualify for BOS) using a normal marathon training schedule, which peaks at 45 miles a week and includes a day of speed work and one long run a week?
I would have to drop 10 minutes. Aiming at Long Beach which is flatter then Rock and Roll SD. Basically need to run 30 seconds faster a mile and not bonk at 20.
Is this a realistic goal? The race is in 17 weeks.
Currently at half ironman fitness.
Thanks
Sure - very realistic if you train like a RUNNER right now. Good luck
You mean dropping the bike and swim for 17 weeks. Damn, not sure I wanna do that. Is boston worth it? My sister qualified and we thought running together would be fun.
But I agree, its possible if I focus mostly on running.
Thanks
Actually, you just need to run 23 seconds faster per mile. That should be very doable unless you “peaked” in your first ever marathon – which seems very unlikely.
Run. Run more. Run faster. Run more faster.
You mean dropping the bike and swim for 17 weeks. Damn, not sure I wanna do that. Is boston worth it? My sister qualified and we thought running together would be fun.
But I agree, its possible if I focus mostly on running.
Thanks
You don’t have to drop the swim/bike. Just don’t focus on it. I’d focus on running, running more, running faster, intervals, hills, etc. Keep the bike and swim to ~ 2x each per week.
John
What Devlin said.
Plus if you drop the other stuff, your likelihood for injury may go up due to all the time you have now (assuming you use that time to run).
If I ran even 8 hours wk, I would be around 70 miles a week. I not sure about you, but that would be a huge increase for me. I would just do a run focus (with proper runner training) where I slowly increase my mileage and do easy swims and bikes.
You mean dropping the bike and swim for 17 weeks. Damn, not sure I wanna do that. Is boston worth it? My sister qualified and we thought running together would be fun.
But I agree, its possible if I focus mostly on running.
Thanks
You don’t have to drop the bike and swim, what you need to do is back down the intensity, (mostly the bike) so that your legs are fresher for the runs and you are able to train at a bit faster pace and a bit more distance. Treat your bike/swim as recovery miles.
JJ
Completely possible and not that difficult actually. As RRoof said, you need to train like a runner and it is highly advisable to throw in some biking and swimming as cross training to keep from getting hurt…If you start putting in 25-30 mile weeks and SLOWLY bring that up to 45-50 miles a week at 6 weeks out from the race and hold that for four weeks, you can easily break 3:30.
Bob
45 miles a week to run 3:30.
See this link for my recommendation:
http://forum.slowtwitch.com/gforum.cgi?post=1838817;search_string=;#1838817
But essentialy if you are running 45 miles a week and no tri training at all, this is what you should shoot for over the last 8-10 weeks of your plan (not including taper):
Speed = 200m / week
V02max intervals = 1200m / week
Tempo runs = 3 miles a week
Since the speed and interval sessions are so low, I’d suggest doing bigger sessions less often, like 8x100m once every 4 weeks and 4-5 x 800m every 3 weeks. If thi splan is too easy, then you bump everything up in proportion, so if the mileage goes up by 10%, then so does each workout.
If you are still biking and swimming, I recommend a little more intensity:
Speed = 200m / week
V02max intervals = 1400m / week
Tempo runs = 3.6 miles
Why more? As it stands I have no clue what you are capable of. If your plan is to do 45 PLUS swim and bike, that tells me you are in better shape than the person who is only running. So a 45 mile week is really like a 55 mile week except that last 10 gets replaced with swimming and biking. Now that you are a 55 mile/wk guy, your workouts get increased. If this is too much, then evrything gets bumped down in proportion.
The real key here is to not do too much intensity so that you mileage is comprimised, but not to do too much mileage at the expense of getting in the right mix of intenisity. I suggest at least using this as a guide so that you can look at your own workouts and say, “Do I REALLY want to run 8x1200m on the track twice a week?”
First mary was 3:40. Is it possible/realistic to go sub 3:30 (to qualify for BOS) using a normal marathon training schedule, which peaks at 45 miles a week and includes a day of speed work and one long run a week?
What did you do to train for the 3:40? You likely need to either do more or something different. Depending on your build, athletic background, etc., I would think that you could run a 3:30 on 45 miles per week. That does not seem too unreasonable.
For the 3:40, I did the 18 wk NY mary program peaking at 40 miles, with three 20 milers in the last 8 weeks and no speed work.
I’m 6ft, slender and 44 years old. Running is my strongest area in tri.
So I figured adding a day of speedwork (track workout with he tri club) and some extra miles would give me the 10 minutes I need. Plus the focus on a time, beating 3:30.
Also, understand a lot more about fueling for longer races. Hoping improved nutrition toward the end of the race will help too.
Anybody done Boston, is it worth it?
Thanks
Most people drop a chunk of time in their second marathon. The event lends itself to experience and the cumulative effect of training. If you do nothing different from your first marathon you’ll probably drop to 3:30.
I ran my last marathon on 45 miles per week. Biked (commute) 3-4 x per week EZer for 75-120 miles and swam 2-3 times (at least 500 yards of kicking).
My runs were 2 ez at 6 miles, 1 interval day, tempo, and long run. More mileage could have benefitted the last 4 miles. This year I am going to up to 55 miles and keep the bike and swim the same.
Bike and swim are great just back off the intensity.
So I figured adding a day of speedwork (track workout with he tri club) and some extra miles would give me the 10 minutes I need.
See my post above. Though it depends on what your tri club does, “speed work” is not the key ingedient you’ll beneeding to add. Intervals done in the 5K-8K race pace range need only be done once every 3-4 weeks. You aren’t going to come anywhere close to that speed so there really isn’t any point in doing a regular dose of intervals at that pace.
What you need to add more than anything is a healthy dose of tempo running @ ~ 1hr race pace. A 25 minute steady run at 7:30-7:45/mile pace once a week will do far more for your marathon than a weekly interval workout.
Perhaps what rroof means is, for “real” runners 45 miles/week is toward the minimum end, not the maximum. Real runners tend to be more in the 60-70+/week range. Many are doing far more. Do that for a few months and 3:30 will be no problem. Lots of marathon “programs” are pretty light on the mileage. It’s like the bare minimum of what it takes, but not everyone will do well just training the bare minimum.
I spent 6+ months running 50+ miles/week, with the last 2 being 70+/week. The result was a 27 minute PR, 3:26 marathon at age 52. All that mileage has also made me much faster at every distance and I’ve PRed 10 times so far this year. Almost all the mileage was done at a slow easy pace - 9:00-9:30 - with the exception of doing a race every other week as my only form of speedwork. During those 6 months I took a total of 6 days off, but none in the last 3 months. Doing all that running also made me lose about 20 pounds and the weight loss contributed to faster times as well.
Ramp up your running to what real runners do and I be seeing you in Boston next year!
Most people improve at least 10mins in their 2d marathon anyway.
Given you are in HIM shape you are pretty close to being ready to run a decent marathon, 17 weeks gives you plenty of time to prepare well.
Doing a faster session once a week will help your running generally. Just be careful not to go too crazy on hard fast interval work. A little bit goes a long way. Tempo running is more specific than doing 15x400s but some shorter sessions such as 10x200 are good for developing your running provided you focus on good technique rather than just blazing away.
I’m a 49yo with a lot of marathons on my scorecard, 2.40s-50s since back in the early 80s onwards. I haven’t done one for a few years but if I was to train for one now my program would be something like this, aiming for a 3hr time.
Mon - bike.
Tue - Around 10 miles on rolling forest trails starting at 8 min pace and working down to 7s.
Wed - bike.
Thu - Again around 10 miles but might throw in some 1-4 min efforts at 6 min pace. If feeling tired I might substitute a shorter session of technique focused running e.g 100-200m striders.
Fri - bike.
Sat - Good testing mtn bike ride then a steady 10 mile run as for tuesday, but the run is being done with a tired body. Emphasis is on holding good running form throughout with that bit of fatigue through the body.
Sun - Alternate weeks.
15 miles on hilly forest trails, 1st 10 at 8min pace last 5 at 7 min pace.
or club race 8-15kms, at least a couple of them on the roads.
8, 6 and 4 weeks before the marathon I would do longer runs up to 22 miles if I felt good. These would be done on the same principle as the 15s, 2/3s comfortable then work home near race pace. I might substitute a flattish 9 miler in an hour in place of a race toward the end of the prep.