Nothing fancy here, but how fast should I be running my long run for the week? Thirty to forty-five seconds off race pace is what I have been doing, but as the longer runs start to get longer, the potential for screwing up race day seems to be greater if I am not executing this run properly.
I am also doing one interval run a week and one speed session. Running six days a week, you know the rest…
…again the is about the pacing of long run.
Race day is seven weeks away
Thanks, Derek
The marathon training group I trained with a few times said your long runs should be 60-90 seconds slower than your race pace. There were some very fast and very experienced runners and coaches in this group and followed this plan. As you get closer to the race you should slowly add race pace miles into the middle of your long runs. The training plan called for two to three 20 milers and a 22 miler with a few 18 milers. Most people would run the first 20 miler on a flat route a bit faster than the normal long run pace, usually a negative split. The second (and third) 20 milers would have 5-8 miles at race pace with the rest being 60-90 seconds slower.
As you get further in your training plan your long runs turn in to more of a tempo run. So, just keep adding race pace miles but probably not more than half the distance of the long run. FWIW Ryan Hall adds a couple miles (no more than 1 at a time) at faster than race pace on his long runs.
One way to get an idea if you can run your expected pace is to do a Yasso 800s workout at the track.
Disclaimer: I am not a certified coach.
Assuming your long runs are between 30-35K - for a** ten week build**, I like to start with marathon pace + 1 min. Each week I try to shave off 15-20 secs per mile until I’m marathon pace minus 5-10 seconds for my final long run (about 3 weeks out).
Assuming your long runs are between 30-35K - for a** ten week build**, I like to start with marathon pace + 1 min. Each week I try to shave off 15-20 secs per mile until I’m marathon pace minus 5-10 seconds for my final long run (about 3 weeks out).
I do the same, but that last long run is 18 @ race pace. It helps me understand where I need to pace (realistically). Also it’s kind of a tradition.
I think what this does is give some variety to your long runs. They all aren’t slow, and they all aren’t fast. I may interrupt the build with a slower run as well depending on how I feel.
General rule of thumb is race pace + 10-15 %. So for a 7:30 min/mile that would be between 8:15-8:37
If I was designing a marathon program for myself, I’d put in 3 fast-finish long runs, the way that Macmillan describes them. For the rest, I’d forget about the pace; run comfortably, don’t time the miles, chat with a running partner if possible.
Ty
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Long runs are aerobic. I go by HR, keep it below 150bpm (max is 200). That has me around a 4:45min/k pace (I’m aiming for a 1:18-19 HM).
Steve Moneghetti (sub 2:10 mara runner and one of the all time greats in AUS) did most of his runs at 4:30min/k pace, ie 90s per k off his mara time.
The long run is about building an aerobic engine and economy. Of course there are times when you want to speed it up, but that needs to be specific targeted work. The risk of going too hard in a long run is injury and leaving you cooked for the shorter key sessions, e.g. speedwork, tempo, tempo intervals.
I take a similar approach: early in the training cycle, take it slow, but then add in some marathon pace intervals or blocks till you are running good portions of the long run at race pace just prior to the taper.
Victor
A long run is either a hard day or an easy day. This distinction should be determined by effort.
If it is hard day, you are doing some of it (if not most or even all) at a specific effort that is “hard”. It might come out to marathon pace, threshold pace, whatever. But it aint no jog. If it is an easy day, then stop worrying about the pace value and just run EASY. So that it feels easy the whole way. Let the pace fall where it falls. Don’t look at splits. Don’t worry about pace. Practice relaxing and making it effortless. You’ll know you’ve done these easy long runs right if you recover quickly. If you need a day or two off from them, you are going too hard (or possibly too long)
Since you are already doing an “interval run” (not sure exactly what you mean by that but I take it that’s a hard day) and a speed session during the week, then the long run should probably be an easy day most weeks. I find that two hard days running is good and 3 hard days is usually too much. Rarely I let myself do it. You might be different.
If a long run is hard for you merely by virtue of how many miles it contains, then you are going too long on that long run. Or, conversely, you are not doing enough running miles the rest of the week.
There is nothing magic about long runs. No reason to need to do them every week. Yes they’re good but your consistent weekly mileage is a better determinant of how well you run,.
There is nothing magic about long runs. No reason to need to do them every week. Yes they’re good but your consistent weekly mileage is a better determinant of how well you run,.
I tend to disagree on that for marathon - I really don’t think you will be able to hit the necessary 55-65 quality miles per week without at least 2 long runs - 2-a-days just dont substitute too well there. At least not until you run out of days when you’re trying to push 80 mpw.
I also disagree. The long run is the most specific workout possible for the marathon, and ultimately, specific workouts are those which will help the most. An extra long-run (say 20+) is less necessary for 5k/10k training because it is not specific to the 5k/10k, and recovery from the long run will inhibit your ability to complete the necessary speed work.
Soooooo to the original poster. Your pace should not be fixed. Nor should your distance. They should progressively move toward the marathon distance and pace. Not necessarily at the same time (i.e. don’t increase pace and distance on the same run, but alternate). Given you’ve only got 7 weeks until the race, that means you’ve got maybe 5 opportunities for long runs left. Here’s how I would structure it (counting backwards):
2 weeks to go: 30km @ 97-100% MP
3 weeks to go: 35km+ @ 95% MP
4 weeks to go: 25km @ 97-100% MP
5 weeks to go: 35km @ 92-94% MP
6 weeks to go: 20km @ 95-98% MP
7 weeks to go: 30km @ 91-93% MP
Basically–you’re switching back and forth between pushing out that distance and inching up the speed. None of these workouts is individually overwhelming, but they work both your speed and endurance to extend the distance at which you can carry your speed.
Just my $0.02
There is nothing magic about long runs. No reason to need to do them every week. Yes they’re good but your consistent weekly mileage is a better determinant of how well you run,.
I tend to disagree on that for marathon - I really don’t think you will be able to hit the necessary 55-65 quality miles per week without at least 2 long runs - 2-a-days just dont substitute too well there. At least not until you run out of days when you’re trying to push 80 mpw.
Maybe we disagree on how long a long run is. Not sure But if you need 2-a-days to do 55-65 miles a week, you are either not running enough days per week or not enough miles per “regular” run.
I think too many people try to use the long run as sort of a band-aid for their training. They don’t do nearly enough running during the week and then try to cram it all in on the weekend long run. That’s almost counter-productive. If I were getting 35% or more of my weekly miles in one run, I’d probably think it was “magical” too. But that’s just a bad idea. We all have to do it sometimes but it should not be the basis of a training program.