I’ve always been under the understanding that when you start to get over the ~300 calorie mark, the body isn’t able to absorb it and you’re increasing the chances of shutting down or at least disrupting your stomach. However, reading through some of the Kona race reports, I’ve been stunned by the number of calories some of the faster IM folks are consuming each hour. It seems like they’re taking in 500-600 calories per hour and aren’t having any stomach issues. This is impressive, and I would think it’s advantage to be able to make sure your body is topped off fuel wise.
My questions:
Is this trainable?
Is the body actually absorbing a majority of these calories?
Any other considerations when increasing calorie intake? (lower electrolyte concentration, sugar/carb types, protein/fat, etc.)
I follow the Core Diet and do their Race day planning. It works perfect, but you have to train your gut. I think I took 450-500 Kcal an hour at my last race (half IM) and I weighed 128 at the race. This is a combo of Perform and nutrition (Gels and Bars). No GI problems.
Answers:
-It is trainable.
-Body probably not absorbing all these calories
-Don’t always do what Pro’s are doing
Agreed on not always doing what the pros are doing. These guys aren’t pros, and their finish times were close enough to my expected race goal that it’s comparable.
Still would like to know how many of those calories are being absorbed. If you can train your stomach to handle increased calories without revolting against you half way through a 9-10hour day, and you actually absorb some of those increased calories, that’s a pretty big advantage.
Looking at Jordan Rapps blog, he’s consuming about 380 calories per hour on the bike. I’m not sure where 500-600 came from. I think 300-350 is a good target. but you’ll have ot space it out carefully and probably avoid consuming many calories at all the last 30 minutes before the run to let your stomach clear. But I haven’t done a IM yet, but that’s what I’ve been reading. A calculator on the Pacific Health Labs (Accel/Endurox products) website has me around 225 calories per hour @ 157lbs body weight. I thikn that’s a little light, and it underestimates the intensity I’ll be going at. But I think 250-275 is a good target for me and it’s what I’ll practice in my long rides. It also only has me at 110 calories per hour on the run. So it’s thinking that I’ll burn 9600 calories, but only consume about 1600 total and the rest from glycogen stores and mostly fat stores. That’s only 2lbs of fat. I do know that on the swim, my HR will probably be the lowest it is all day based on HR checks I’ve done while training. I’ll probably burn mainly fat during the swim, so there’s almost 1000 “free” calories right there.
I think your better off erring on the lower side and training your body to burn fat mroe effciently. I know from very low carb diets, that that I can run faster and with less discomfort after bonking than I can in major GI distress… as the later means I’m probably walking. That’s my take.
Same as yorkcb7…did the CD plan last year in prep for Kona, and it worked great, except I don’t tolerate the ClifBlox for some reason. Perform/Gels/Powerbar with a few succeed tabs for additional salt ( I’m a heavy sweater). 500 cals/hr on bike and 300 on run, no GI issues. BUT, you have to train this just like the race distance.
Unfortunately for me I’ve yet to find a nutrition solution that doesn’t lock up my gut about 45 mins into the IM run, including Kona this year. With 8 IM’s under my belt I’ve tried every type of nutrition as well as varying amounts of calories, from as low as 200 to as high as about 450.
For Kona this year I went with about 350 cals per hour on the bike and felt fantastic. No stomach issues at all on the bike with great energy levels. At about mile 3 of the run I told my wife I felt better than I’ve ever felt at that point in an IM run. Took my first gel of the day around mile 5 and things started locking up tight. From that point on coke was the only thing that I could stomach, just barely. I tried another gel at the first aid station out on the Queen K with the same results.
Doesn’t seem to have kept you from posting some solid results.
I find if I overdo the eletrolyte content, my gut will cramp as I get further into a long workout/race. I’ve never had problems from overdoing the calorie density, but if I load up on something like EFS I can guarantee that I’ll have stomach/intestinal cramps.
Yet another example of a guy taking in a shocking number of calories. His sodium levels are incredibly high as well.
Yeah, read the comments, and you see how shocked some were at the amount he could put down coupled with that kind of performance level. Brian’s responses were even along the lines of…some of this shouldn’t work for James according to the science, but it works very well for him…so we go with what we find works…
I actually got the impression they were consuming less, maybe only 250-300. Some might get to 350 for the taller, larger men.
I’ll have to read some of their recent blogs.
Check out the recent reports by Rob Gray and Brad Williams.
In addition to my Kona report, check out my IM Los Cabos nutrition report 560 calories per hour. This intake was necessary to maintain glycogen levels, in addition to having created decent fat burning adaptations in training. i.e, at race pace I was burning 50-60% of calories CHO, at about 1100-1200 calories per hour. So assuming 2000 calories of glycogen to start, even at 560 per hour I was racking up a slight deficit, that would mean I still need 300+ on the run (300 on the run is a lot more difficult than on the bike - for me it means chugging coke straight up on the rocks). Of course if I slowed down on the bike I could get away with a lot less a) because I’d be burning less calories and b) there would be a higher % of energy from fat. But for a bike split of approx 5 hours, that’s what I need to do. I also tested Kevin Coady before Kona and he too was at 500+ per hour - he went 9:15, would have been about 10 minutes faster if he didn’t have a few issues with his quads (obviously muscular related not nutrition)
For me, most commercial products make me bloat for some reason. I get 500+ through home made gel, rice, and gummy worms.
If someone in the medical profession would like to sponsor a gastric emptying test to see what happens to all that stuff I take in, I’d be up for that! But in the meantime I’m working on the assumption that zero bloat = good absorption.
As much as you need. Listen to your body. If you try to calculate it, you’ll likely end up with too much or too little. 300ish is a good ballpark starting point though.
i had:
2 powerbars
1 cup dates
1 cup dried papaya
handful of cyrstalized ginger
6-8 gus
1 sports drink
2 slices of pizza
8 boiled small potatoes with parm cheese and oil and salt
7 salt tabs
err that’s all i can think of for now.
i am 5’3" and weight 125lbs. some people have higher metabolisms and can digest certain foods other than others. the best way to tell is to go on a long training ride and find out. IE 85-100 miles at 90% race pace.
Unfortunately for me I’ve yet to find a nutrition solution that doesn’t lock up my gut about 45 mins into the IM run, including Kona this year. With 8 IM’s under my belt I’ve tried every type of nutrition as well as varying amounts of calories, from as low as 200 to as high as about 450.
For Kona this year I went with about 350 cals per hour on the bike and felt fantastic. No stomach issues at all on the bike with great energy levels. At about mile 3 of the run I told my wife I felt better than I’ve ever felt at that point in an IM run. Took my first gel of the day around mile 5 and things started locking up tight. From that point on coke was the only thing that I could stomach, just barely. I tried another gel at the first aid station out on the Queen K with the same results.
I’m sure you’ve tried many different things on the run but that just sounds like your body doesn’t like gels while running. I can take gels on the bike and I can take them mixed into water (eq: 100cal gel w/ 20oz water) but the slightest bit of straight gel while running and it’s game over no matter my pace or distance or setting. Makes IM running hard to get the calories but I lucked out that I can slam massive amounts of coke with no problem. Honestly, I think my body can only take liquid while running; simple as that.