There have been a few threads about this of late and, since it’s the off-season for many, it’s the perfect time to shake things up a bit.
A proven way of improving your running is to, simply run more days each week. However, triathletes being triathletes, there is a tendency to over-think this.
I break it down and try and make it simple in a new post on my Blog:
As always your mileage may vary. Comments are welcome here and at the blog.
Hope this helps.
Frequency, not duration.
It works.
You mean I’d have to put down the pie, and run more than the zero days a week I’m currently running…?
Sigh…
I’ve been following BarryP’s running plan for the last 4 weeks, religously. 6 days of running a week, at paces (slow that is) that I never ran before. I’m up to 4 hours a week, and, roughly 23 miles. My legs have never felt better. Look forward to each run. Don’t feel trashed after any run. Can run the next day since my legs don’t hurt and not on the edge of injury. Am I any faster? I’ll find out during a 5k on Nov 20, which should give me a new set of paces.
Background: Non runner in early life. 14 years of multisport. Beaten for a podium spot due to run in more races than I can count. I hate to admit it, I’ve run nearly 85 miles in the last 4 weeks, which is approaching the total miles I used to do for Sprint training for the whole season 
Gee, any wonder why I got beat on the run?
I’m trying to run 6x/week this winter. I hate the cold, but I want more speed for next year. We will see how it goes.
Edit: And a question… if I’m looking to speed up my 5k time for next summer, is 2-3 higher-intensity miles per outing enough to get this effect? It’ll still be <20mpw, but I’m focusing on sprints and maybe one Oly.
There have been a few threads about this of late and, since it’s the off-season for many, it’s the perfect time to shake things up a bit.
A proven way of improving your running is to, simply run more days each week. However, triathletes being triathletes, there is a tendency to over-think this.
I break it down and try and make it simple in a new post on my Blog:
As always your mileage may vary. Comments are welcome here and at the blog.
Hope this helps.
I agree with this. Based on personal experience it worked very well for me.
But I’d also say this…I think it is great for newer runners. I think it is great for injury prone runners to get in some additional volume without doing damage. I think it is a great way to improve and enjoy running. It is a great way to get stronger. It is not necessarily for elite runners. It is for normal folks to improve.
However I also think it will only get you so far. There comes a point where you as an individual can only do so much even if it is spread across 6-7 days. For some that is barryPs 30-60-90, for others it is more, or less.
There are other trains of thought that say threshold work is the way to go. And that a run program of 4 days per week where 3 days include threshold work will make you faster. Endurance Nation teaches this. But there is a big caveat here…when you do the harder workouts you rest MORE.
As I was told…people often get into trouble when they do harder workouts because they conveniently forget to dial back other workouts to compensate and allow recovery. If you don’t recover you will most likely end up hurting.
BarryP’s program works great because you add frequency and volume - but there is very little threshold or harder efforts in his plan. As you improve and get faster and want to add in harder efforts, the volume and frequency have to be adjusted to allow for recovery. Otherwise you end up burned out, injured, or both.
I suspect and hope BarryP will confirm my thoughts here as it is just my opinion at the moment.
Winter goal.
Thanks for the post. For the past few months I have been doing only a few very long runs each week. The sense being that as I am training for ultras, doing a few very long runs would be more beneficial. However during the last two weeks I have switched to more frequent short runs and feel that I am improving. The line that struck me the strongest was when you said, “whatever you do, needs to be repeatable the next day.”
There have been a few threads about this of late and, since it’s the off-season for many, it’s the perfect time to shake things up a bit.
A proven way of improving your running is to, simply run more days each week. However, triathletes being triathletes, there is a tendency to over-think this.
I break it down and try and make it simple in a new post on my Blog:
As always your mileage may vary. Comments are welcome here and at the blog.
Hope this helps.
I really think there is something to this as well. I have been trying to not only run more, and run with carefully planned zones from McMillan, but I’ve been trying to do more frequent shorter runs the past few months. It has definitely helped me pick up some durability and speed. I just ran Silverman course in 1:46 this weekend. Silverman is a hilly run and follows a very demanding bike which I hammered hard, so I was very pleased with my run split. FWIW, I’m 44 and 202 lbs (didn’t race as clydes though).
After reading all these posts on run frequency and experiencing some end of season running aches and pains that limited me towards the end of the season, I’m going to move to a 6 day/week running plan. My regular running loop is 4.25 miles, so I’m going to use that as my easy loop and modify it for the rest of my runs.
Between now and Christmas, my running weeks will look like this.
Monday: Off
Tuesday: 6.5 Tempo
Wednesday: 4.25 Easy
Thursday: 9 Long
Friday: 4.25 Easy
Saturday: 6.5 Track/ Interval
Sunday: 4.25 Easy
After the holidays, I’m going to move closer to BarryP’s 1:2:3 plan and adjust the milage rhoughtout the year. I also intend to do 3 bike rides and 2 or 3 swims per week.
Beaten for a podium spot due to run in more races than I can count.
Studies have shown that you can increase the number you can count to faster than you can improve your speed. ; ^ P
4 days a week with 2-3 being threshold is a program that will genrally make you a very solid runner for sprints and olys. However, it is very difficult to get there from a position that lacks fitness.
The plan forward that I find best is to start from being fat and slow, run as much as you can by running as often as you can. Do that and hit a plateau. Then gradualy trade out the easy runs for threshold runs. Depending on the event, this may be 1 (HIM) or 2 (Oly, sprint), or even 3 (time limited athlete). Thought I don’t think 4 runs is ever better than 6 for running, it just might be better or triathlon if you need more bike/swim work, or if you just don’t have the time. Having said that, I still firmly believe that the path to get there is through volum and frequency first, even if you have to make sacrifices to get there.
There are plenty of examples of veteran athletes who do well off of fewer runs, but most built a base at some point. When training for my first IM, I actually ran 50 mpw for a while off of 4 runs (2 10s, a 12, and an 18). After getting injured and needing to build back up, I went back to 6 runs.
When my work schedule changed in May, I starting doing short semi-quick runs during my lunch hour. I agree that my legs felt good, not like when I was on the 20 week plan. I was able to maintain what little run fitness I had gained up to that point. I would alternate weeks of this with biking. A work week (5 days) of running, bike on Saturday, rest Sunday. Then a work week of biking, run on saturday, rest Sunday. Not the best but it let me limp through the season without too much fitness loss or injury. I’m on the EN outseason plan now and I’m just loving it. Getting close to where I ended last winter in only three weeks. I have never felt better from an energy / normal aches and pains standpoint. Definately digging the shorter, more frequent, high intensity mindset.
And a question… if I’m looking to speed up my 5k time for next summer, is 2-3 higher-intensity miles per outing enough to get this effect? It’ll still be <20mpw, but I’m focusing on sprints and maybe one Oly.
Do a month or two of the run-nearly-every-day plan and then as I suggest run a 5k and see where you are at. You might surprise yourself. From there, you may want to start to introduce faster paced running. This faster paced running should be at or near the 5K race pace goal pace.
Do a month or two of the run-nearly-every-day plan and then as I suggest run a 5k and see where you are at. You might surprise yourself. From there, you may want to start to introduce faster paced running. This faster paced running should be at or near the 5K race pace goal pace.
Thanks! The Colder Boulder is Dec 4, and that’s the next race on my schedule. Unfortunately, I don’t know what’s out there in Jan-Feb locally, so I’ll have to look. I’m also going home for Christmas-New Year’s, so I’m sure I’ll be falling off the wagon somewhat for that week. The first race I have after the Colder Boulder is the Dash & Dine series in early spring, so I’m not sure how to get race timing before then. I’ll see if I can dig anything up. I’m really only looking to hit a 6:30 pace for June, so my goals are modest.
I’ve always done 6-7 runs a week but this off season I’m bumping to 9.
We’ll see what happens. I’m also going to be in Kona from Dec 1 -March 1 and doing 5-6 bikes and 6-7 swims.
I’ve been following BarryP’s running plan for the last 4 weeks, religously. 6 days of running a week, at paces (slow that is) that I never ran before. I’m up to 4 hours a week, and, roughly 23 miles. My legs have never felt better. Look forward to each run. Don’t feel trashed after any run. Can run the next day since my legs don’t hurt and not on the edge of injury. Am I any faster? I’ll find out during a 5k on Nov 20, which should give me a new set of paces.
Background: Non runner in early life. 14 years of multisport. Beaten for a podium spot due to run in more races than I can count. I hate to admit it, I’ve run nearly 85 miles in the last 4 weeks, which is approaching the total miles I used to do for Sprint training for the whole season Gee, any wonder why I got beat on the run?
I started drinking the KoolAid to avoid injury - every 3 months I tear my calf muscle and have to rest it from 2 to 4 weeks. I’ve been doing Barry’s plan:
3,3,4,3,0,6
2.25,4,2.25,4,2.75,0,5.75
2.5,4.5,2.5,4.5,2.5,0,6.6
2.5,4.5,0,0,0,0 (sick)
(sick) 4.5,3,0,6
2.5 and tore calf muscle again. Last time I tore was 07/28/2010 so I got more than 3 months with Barry’s plan and it also is not nearly as bad as all the other times. I can walk and am barely limping so I’m not sure it is even torn so I’m wondering.
BUT, when I ran 4 days/week I never had PF or Achilles issues nor knee problems. With 6 days/week my knees are very painful on the Sunday (6 m run; I’ve run up to 10 miles before on my old 4 day/week program), my Achilles is sore and unless I ice my heels I have PF pain afterwards so I wonder if I should continue the Barry plan.
I understand I might have jumped directly into the 20-23 mpw Barry plan after being sick and that might be why I injured my “bad” calf, but I’m starting to wonder about the whole plan. Ideas? Before I started Barry’s plan I had been doing 20, 19, 18, 17, 20 mpw (previous 5 week) at 4 runs/week.
Given your bum calf, you might need to really step back in turns of volume and intensity when starting the plan. You might even consider a run-walk program (i.e. breaking up each run between bouts of running and walking). Unless the knee is something degenerative, like RA, which might preclude running 6x a week, I think you just need to give it time. Even if you’re healthy, you need to be careful in starting this program, no less coming into it with an injury history.
There are other trains of thought that say threshold work is the way to go. And that a run program of 4 days per week where 3 days include threshold work will make you faster. Endurance Nation teaches this. But there is a big caveat here…when you do the harder workouts you rest MORE.
Agreed. My Blog post is more for the person who is relatively new - maybe two years into triathlon with minimal running back-ground. It’s for these folks who are going to get the biggest gains.
There are many ways to slice and dice this, my overreaching thoughts are that many people make it too complicated and over-think it all. They don’t realize that they can get to 95% of their performance level on some pretty basic and straight forward training. However, many are fretting and farting around worrying about how to squeeze out that last 5% with these specific and proprietary workouts, when they have not even put the time in to really establish a deep base of fitness, durability and efficiency. That always should come first!
Now for the mid-level to experienced crowd, this does not mean slow running all the time. That’s another common mistake - all LSD all the time! Some days you can open it up a bit and let it flow. Learn how it feels to surf right along that edge holding it there for 10 - 20 minutes. But again, know that you need to run again tomorrow!
Instead of a constant progression, I believe Barry has said you need to allow your body to adapt to what you are doing. Which may mean you need to plateau for a bit at one workload before progressing to another workload.
Constant progression is not adaptation, as you keep finding out.