More fat burning with more hours riding. As I wrote. I find time for a few (additional) easier long rides. Not “in place of”
Simple, not weekly: Ride more = burn more calories.
More fat burning with more hours riding. As I wrote. I find time for a few (additional) easier long rides. Not “in place of”
Simple, not weekly: Ride more = burn more calories.
So longer rider always trumps higher intensity (if proportionate) in terms of burning calories?
More fat burning with more hours riding. As I wrote. I find time for a few (additional) easier long rides. Not “in place of”
Simple, not weekly: Ride more = burn more calories.
So longer rider always trumps higher intensity (if proportionate) in terms of burning calories?
no.
long rides may help u in training the aero position and comfort over long periods.
ride harder and faster. then recover hard. tooling around day after day at 65-70% of your FTP is pretty worthless for improving your bike split.
More fat burning with more hours riding. As I wrote. I find time for a few (additional) easier long rides. Not “in place of”
Simple, not weekly: Ride more = burn more calories.
So longer rider always trumps higher intensity (if proportionate) in terms of burning calories?
no.
long rides may help u in training the aero position and comfort over long periods.
ride harder and faster. then recover hard. tooling around day after day at 65-70% of your FTP is pretty worthless for improving your bike split.
I wasnt really concerned with improving bike splits. I asked about burning calories, thus I was wondering if simply riding longer (say 6 hrs) burns more calories than a 4 hr high intensity ride? He seems to suggest simply riding longer automatically burns more calories, and that was what I was asking? But, I appreciate the info about the higher intensity rides being a key to improving your bike split.
look at the overall kilojoules spent.
Zero? Aww c’mon, give the man an extra burned calorie or two!
BTW, congrats on your AmZof Spring version results…impressive. Now how’s that swimming coming along?
More fat burning with more hours riding. As I wrote. I find time for a few (additional) easier long rides. Not “in place of”
Simple, not weekly: Ride more = burn more calories.
Yeah?!
I’ve actually done the long LSD rides and qualified for Kona 3x with that strategy bu seems like my life is much more time sensitive these days, so rather than waist time I was wondering if I could get by with hammering 4 hours versus longer rides.
NO.
What I wrote not so clearly, is to do both, if you have time. Long rides with intensity AND Longer rides as well, time in the saddle.
I believe there are benefits to both.
The OP still has to build the engine before he can make fine tuning adjustments.
Don’t you think 4 hour rides with intensity build the engine?
The rides are not only about fitness, but learning how to hydrate, and more importantly, eat. An all out, balls to the walls ride is great for someone that has previously perfected their hydration and nutrition requirements, but for a first time Ironman going out and never doing the distance, all that will do is lead to a very long slow walk of a marathon.
I’d argue that a just going out for 6 hour ride is more likely to do this.
So you see no benefit, only detriment to a 6 hour ride? Even with other harder sessions each week.
Really?
The OP still has to build the engine before he can make fine tuning adjustments.
Don’t you think 4 hour rides with intensity build the engine?
The rides are not only about fitness, but learning how to hydrate, and more importantly, eat. An all out, balls to the walls ride is great for someone that has previously perfected their hydration and nutrition requirements, but for a first time Ironman going out and never doing the distance, all that will do is lead to a very long slow walk of a marathon.
I’d argue that a just going out for 6 hour ride is more likely to do this.
Geez DD you must only ever see fit and strong triathletes in your world because there are a shitload of people trianing for Ironman who not posses an engine capable of a four hour ride at intensity.Hell that 6 hr slow time is probrably more intense than the 6:30-7:30hr ride they will eventually do on race day.I know everyone here on ST is fast and strong and in the top 15% of the field but ST isn’t representative of what is actually happening in the tri world.
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I agree with Desert Dude. Most long course athletes ride their long ride too easy. I train a high Zone 2, low Zone 3 (about 78-80% of mac HR) on all my long rides. So many people I know think sitting up and soft pedaling for 5-6 hours is long bike training. I think it’s a waste of valuable time. Go out and crank long miles at those zones week in and week out and you will be a faster biker.
Any thoughts on higher intensity 4 hour rides vs the typical LSD 5-6 hour training rides for IM?
LSD 5-6hr is ok for your first really long ride or two, but after that you want to be working on those long rides. No drafting or chatting, aero position for as much as possible,minimal stopping, counting moving time only not including stop time, pedalling all the time. Aim to to gradually increased perceived exertion in each quarter of the ride and if you are using HR aim to be in upper zone 2 to 3 and minimising time out of those zones. Doing those long rides you will learn a lot that will help you on race day - about position, equipment, nutrition, even effort, recovering from bad periods and nutrition mistakes etc.
4hr rides with intensity can be really hard in a different way, but I still think you also should go for longer to build your mental toughness especially if this is your first or 2nd IM.
I have has my best results when I’ve had 2 or 3 7-7.5hr rides like that under my belt. When I dial back to a 5hr ride it feels like nothing in comparison and then I am ready to ride hard and long.
I know everyone here on ST is fast and strong and in the top 15% of the field but ST isn’t representative of what is actually happening in the tri world.
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But this is ST and so the answer is appropriate.
Ironically I see lots of unfit, weak triathletes. Every weekend in PHX and now in Tucson I see triathletes putzing along at 14-15 mph for 5+ hours and wondering why they can’t seem to develop the engine to go 17 or 18 mph.
Look I’m being practical, time conscious and reasonable. Sure you can be out of shape and try to go ride 6 hours. It’s going to take you about 7 after you stop at Circle K 2-3x, stop at the coffee shop stop, sit up and wait for X to get back on b/c you dropped them up a small hill. Do you really think some person who has to stop 4-10x during a 6 hour ride and is cruising around at 14mph is fit? Do you think they are going to get fit doing that?
Or you can go out and do some intensity in your 4 hour ride and stop at circle k 1x to refill your bottles. I’m not saying doing a lot but 75-120 min is all it takes.
I can’t help it if you don’t know the best way to get faster, god knows it’s been discussed on here 5000 times but yet we still get questions like this weekly.
I have about 1000 power files showing the difference between 6 hours of bullshitting on a ride 4 hours of doing work and the corresponding increases in FTP AND sustainable power over 4,5 and 6 hours. You are more then welcome to come here and I’ll open them up for you.
So I ask you this, do you want a 10w increase in what you can hold for 5+ hours or do you want a 25-40w increase in what you can hold for 5+ hours?
So you see no benefit, only detriment to a 6 hour ride? Even with other harder sessions each week.
Really?
Did I say detriment? Sure I see some benefits from a 6 hour ride.
So now the real question becomes, which ride do you think you would see more benefits from?
Word.
Ironically I see lots of unfit, weak triathletes. Every weekend in PHX and now in Tucson I see triathletes putzing along at 14-15 mph for 5+ hours and wondering why they can’t seem to develop the engine to go 17 or 18 mph.]reply
Maybe those people putzing around are actually out having a fun ride with their mates.They can get some extra speed during the week doing speedwork.
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People who have never been able to ride more than a couple of hours will get fitter than they already are.For some people a 6h ride is an achievment.I agree about being time practicle and believe those people should not stop so much and only putz around for 60% of the time.The rest they should be riding hills hard or racing each other up the highway.
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I never said intense rides should not be done and I agree that they are vital but I’m not going to advocate that average Joe stop enjoying their weekend group rides with their friends just because they are considered a waste of time here on ST.
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[I can’t help it if you don’t know the best way to get faster, god knows it’s been discussed on here 5000 times but yet we still get questions like this weekly.
I have about 1000 power files showing the difference between 6 hours of bullshitting on a ride 4 hours of doing work and the corresponding increases in FTP AND sustainable power over 4,5 and 6 hours. You are more then welcome to come here and I’ll open them up for you.] reply
That is a typical arrogant Slowtwicth guru assumtion. and clearly you missed the fact that I wasn’t talking about myself but the thousands of people who are just happy to get around the Ironman course with as little trouble as possible without being obsessed with training.
I am well aware of what it take to become a faster Ironman triathlete and I will not be asking for your help with anything any time soon.It’s no surprise you try to put me down like that as it is par for the course here on ST.Funny thing is I think my Ironman PR is faster than yours(I may be wrong)
We have different views on what we want out of the sport.Personally I would rather spend my time slowing down on a few long rides to hang out with friends and stare at the scenery than treat every ride like I’m in the lab .The experiences I have with my friends are more important to me than my Ironman finishers time.I appreciate that others have different ideas on what makes them a happy triathlete and I think the dedication among some people here is admirable.Maybe you should appreciate that not everyone that is looking for help here on ST is wanting the full “bells and whistles” training experience.Maybe they just want to know how to get under 17hrs with a mimimum of fuss and a smile on their face.
One thing that would no doubt have you stone me publicly is that I gave up the some of my speedwork session today to help an old guy I met on the road.He wanted to know a few things about getting used to riding with aerobars and I spent half an hour helping him out while we talked about bike touring.Clearly by ST standards I should have ignored him and just finished what I was doing but I got more out of helping that old guy than trying to find a few extra watts somewhere in my aging body.
Have a nice life.
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Huh. Brian’s response seemed very balanced between what you can do to get faster or use time better vs. what you want to do for fun. Both of which are fine, but they require different approaches, which he outlined. And I train like that and I bet my IM PR is way faster than yours, so what does that have to do with it? Your response seems very angry but I don’t understand why.