I have no idea about this, but the IM updates say the Faris and Evans are 1 second apart and taking turns at the front heading into the wind.
I obviously can’t see pictures of this, but doesn’t that sound like drafting?
They weren’t really that close and now Faris is way out front, looking really good. There ~IS~ a pack of 5 male pros riding fairly close. As they came by, two or three of them were yelling out the number of another one and saying “where’s the draft marshals?” They sounding pretty pissed off.
Still windy and getting warmer. Windy even on the run course and pretty hot running with the wind.
I have no idea about this, but the IM updates say the Faris and Evans are 1 second apart and taking turns at the front heading into the wind.
I obviously can’t see pictures of this, but doesn’t that sound like drafting?
There is no rule against drafting – only a rule stating how far back you have to ride. IM races have plenty of drafting. The trick is to do it legally. At 22-25 mph, there is a very nice draft 10 meters back from the person in front of you. Looks like Faris and Tom are riding smart races, using each other to put time on the rest of the field.
If the followers don’t like it, they should ride or swim harder next time and get in the lead group. But instead, they’ll probably just bitch and whine.
There is no rule against drafting – only a rule stating how far back you have to ride. IM races have plenty of drafting. The trick is to do it legally. At 22-25 mph, there is a very nice draft 10 meters back from the person in front of you. Looks like Faris and Tom are riding smart races, using each other to put time on the rest of the field…
5.10 Position Fouls.
In accordance with the Rules as set forth in this Section, a participant is not permitted to position his bicycle in the proximity of another moving vehicle so as to benefit from reduced air resistance. While on the cycling course, participants shall not work together to improve performance, efficiency, or position by teamwork or other joint conduct.
Well if that is the exact letter of the law, then they should make the drafting zone 20, 30 or whatever meters it needs to be. Problem is, even at 10m or whatever it is, it’s too much for certains times and places on the course already. Either that or reduce the field sizes significantly. This was rarely a problem years ago when IM race fields only had 500 - 1000 people tops in them. Back then it was not uncommon to ride almost 112 miles with out seeing another cyclist!!
Fleck
5.10 Position Fouls.
In accordance with the Rules as set forth in this Section, a participant is not permitted to position his bicycle in the proximity of another moving vehicle so as to benefit from reduced air resistance. While on the cycling course, participants shall not work together to improve performance, efficiency, or position by teamwork or other joint conduct.
That’s almost too funny!
If anybody thinks that is the actual rule, they’re delusionary. Like Fleck says, that rule has no hope of being enforced in the real world. The best they can do is state a follow distance.
Guys switching places in a long pace-line is not “teamwork or other joint conduct.” It is just smart individual racing. When one guy drops back to take a break from the lead, is the new leader “helping” the follower? No, he can’t control what the follower does. Hence – it’s not “teamwork.”
This was rarely a problem years ago when IM race fields only had 500 - 1000 people tops in them.
I don’t think the size of the field has much bearing on this, as it relates to the pros.
he can’t control what the follower does. Hence – it’s not “teamwork.”
But wait, I thought it, “Looks like Faris and Tom are riding smart races, using each other to put time on the rest of the field.”
Which is it?
They can be “racing smart” as individual racers and still not be cooperating. As long as they are not communicating directly they are each racing an individual race.
It is just like if you and I own competing businesses and I raise my prices and then you raise your prices. As long as we didn’t communicate with each other (that is called collusion) we aren’t breaking a law.
Now, the letter of the USAT position rules say that you can’t get ride with the intent of drafting (regardless of the distance) which is impossible to judge. If pressed, I guarantee both riders would say that they were not drafting, just pushing each other from outside the legal distance. Any draft that occured was incidental, and therefore legal.
Ummm, you can get somewhat of a draft advantage, even if you’re outside the 10-meter draft zone. But if the pros aren’t legal by the rules, (and they can judge it quite easily from motorcycles), whether its intentional or not, the officials will penalize them.
Having said that, just riding in proximity to each other can be a psychological advantage.
Really.
Brian, with all due respect, I recall racing IMC back in the late 80’s and early 90’s, finishing in the top 10 - 15 overall( there was no “pro” divison back then). The race field numbered 1000 or less and I recall riding for LENGTHY periods of time and seeing no one else on the bike. In fact, it would get quite lonely out there!
This is certainly NOT the case in IM races with 2000+ starters, pro or otherwise.
Fleck
at 40km/h, you do 11.11m in 1 second…so that’s more than 10m 
.
Brian, with all due respect
My name’s not Brian. And you probably don’t owe me any respect.
The race field numbered 1000 or less and I recall riding for LENGTHY periods of time and seeing no one else on the bike. In fact, it would get quite lonely out there!
This is certainly NOT the case in IM races with 2000+ starters, pro or otherwise.
How do you figure? How does a field of 2000 people affect the pros, as far as drafting is concerned? If that’s an increase of, say, 1000 people, how many of those 1000 people are anywhere near the pros, anyway?
For sure, bigger fields don’t have any impact at all on the ability of the two people who are way out in front of the other 1998 racers to avoid drafting.
he can’t control what the follower does. Hence – it’s not “teamwork.”
But wait, I thought it, “Looks like Faris and Tom are riding smart races, using each other to put time on the rest of the field.”
Which is it?
***Using each other…***not “helping each other”
But, let’s face it…the rule is too vague, and the only way to make it more precise is to state a distance and let everybody have at it.
nop…there wasnt any drafting from the leaders. The rules for the pro is that you must be staggered at any time. this means that you can ride side by side if you want but must be 2 meter to the side and can not ride behind the rider in front of you. So, from what i saw during the race…the leaders were riding clean…
Honestly, I don’t think there is a very nice draft being 10 meters behind someone. There may be some very little draft advantage, but nothing to brag about. Now if you sit 10 meters behind a big bunch, it’s another story.
Look at Paris-Roubaix yesterday, when the danish could not hang onto the first 3 riders anymore, Backstedt had to overtake him and a gap of 5 meters had formed. Too late for him, he could never bridge that gap.
Sorry about the name. I was posting from home yesterday afternoon while trying to watch the Master’s golf and was a bit distracted. Not sure why I called you, Brian.
The point I was trying to make was, that with smaller fields, the drafting problem is less, throughout the entire field. I say this because I was not that great a swimmer( 57 - 58 min for IM swim), and typically had to work my way up through the field on the bike and I saw and experienced far less drafting in these smaller IM races back than I see now with the bigger IM fields.
If two or three pros, top age-groupers or whoever, want to draft either legally or illegally, out on the course, that’s up to them. But often, back then the fields were so spread out that these opportunities came up less than they do now. If you really want to limit it, go to even smaller races. I did the full Vineman Tri back in it’s second year in 1992. I think there were maybe 200 - 300 entries. I finished 4th overall there and more or less rode a totally solo 112 mile ITT for the bike - it was actually rather boring. I passed a few people early on and then that was it until I got back to T2. Passed a few more on the run.
Fleck
Two different races - Brazil and South Africa. Similar field sizes of about 800 (Brazil maybe slightly bigger). Brazil is (was) a draft fest with large packs. South Africa was completely free of drafting from what I saw.
So while I agree that field size can and sometimes does influence drafting it’s not the only thing. Strict rule enforcement is usually the only thing that stops it.
Legal drafting is just smart racing.
When they went by me, Faris was about 5 yds ahead, they could have been in mid pass, but the lateral distance was too great for a draft. Looked like pictures of the stagger rule.