This will be my 4th IM but my first in AZ. Hoping for a KQ in M40-44, but with the reduced slots who knows.
A few questions
Bike Pacing strategy on the out and back - I’m aiming for 5hr bike, and I notice that most who do it in that time typically take 1h out and then 40m back (x3), which suggests that there’s some speed coming back down. Do you notice the hills or is it more of a grind? The course says that it’s flat, but 3x 200m elevation on the outs at 1-3% in places isn’t pancake flat.
How’s the road quality?
Course congestion - how bad does it get on loop 3?
Swim - Is this brackish water? Does it have a current?
-Anything else I need to know?
Did the race last year. Swim was very cold, 59 degrees if my memory serves me correctly. The long straightaway looks into the sun which was a bit disorienting. No current at all and calm water.
The bike is a grind on the way out, especially if the wind is strong like last year, and the way back into town is very fast. I would say its between 1-2% grade for the first 70% of the outbound stretch and then kicks up to 3% toward the turnaround. The road quality if very poor toward the far end of the course. In addition, the three loop course gets very congested on toward the end and makes for some sketchy riding.
Run is mostly on concrete paths with a some slight undulation throughout.
The hill is definitely noticeable. Typically comes with a very large headwind. By my standards the road quality is very poor . . . If I were doing it again I’d go w/ 28s just to cope.
Raced last year. Water was cold but I prefer that to borderline wetsuit temps & possible overheating. Can just lock into race pace & swim what you trained for. Decently long run through T1. The bike is slightly uphill on the way out. Last year, the wind was pretty bad & it was a headwind going out so that definitely factored into the bike splits. If there’s no wind, it can be a really fast bike course. You don’t have to get out of the saddle & there isn’t a ton of cornering. You’re just exposed on the highway so it was important to not force the pace into the wind & dial into effort. There was probably a good amount of over-biking on that stretch. My advice would be to look at someone who was even on each loop who rode ~5 hours. I would also say that a 5 hour ride last year would have been worth something faster. I think if you were in 5-flat shape on a flat course with ideal conditions that it would’ve been a mistake to ride that pace last year. Just something to keep in mind. We often lock into a preset goal & don’t adjust for weather. The bike did get pretty congested about halfway through. The run course is straightforward. Pancake flat. Plenty of aid stations. Weather is usually good in AZ in November. It might be a little warm but it shouldn’t be humid. Definitely a run PB kind of course. Gets a little lonely on the other side of the river. Gotta find a way to stay motivated in the last 10k.
Wind is the biggest factor on the bike. You will likely have a headwind out for the first 2 laps, then it will shift to a headwind back. Focus on power and staying small in the wind. On good days w a decent tailwind I can get top to bottom of beeline @30mph avg not in race setup. There will be a few rollers and a smallish hill at the far end of the course.
The course gets crowded by 2 and bad on lap 3.
I think they are switching back to the OG course so the road surface should be way better but I’m not sure. Rio Solado sucks as does Country Club.
No real current. Possibly some wind. What you will notice is that there will be chop in the water from everyone swimming and that motion just going to the walls and bouncing back. Water will be 60 plus minus.
Beeline is notorious for goat head thorns. Tubeless is the best set up IMO. I have not flatted on tubeless on the beeline in years and I prob ride it 3x a month. (Knock Wood)
I have done it 8x and I think it’s rained 4 of them. Bring rain gear just in case.
I was thinking 5hrs is doable since I would have done under that in Maryland last year without the flat. Plus a few Aero tricks for this year so doable, but as you said stick to power because weather is a variable.
Thanks for the heads up on rain/water temps. I’m not really worried about rain or the cold water though. I’m coming from Canada and I suspect anything that AZ will have in November will be a cakewalk compared to what I’ll have back home. Unless it gets low single digits Celsius + rain I can probably stick to my usual gear.
Thorns are definitely a worry though and my wheels aren’t tubeless compatible. I lost out on a KQ slot in MD last year due to a flat and I don’t want to have another episode, especially with fewer slots this year. I’ll have to think of something…
This will be my 4th IM but my first in AZ. Hoping for a KQ in M40-44, but with the reduced slots who knows.
A few questions
Bike Pacing strategy on the out and back - I’m aiming for 5hr bike, and I notice that most who do it in that time typically take 1h out and then 40m back (x3), which suggests that there’s some speed coming back down. Do you notice the hills or is it more of a grind? The course says that it’s flat, but 3x 200m elevation on the outs at 1-3% in places isn’t pancake flat.
How’s the road quality?
Course congestion - how bad does it get on loop 3?
Swim - Is this brackish water? Does it have a current?
-Anything else I need to know?
Thanks!
People always want to say the IMAZ course if super flat but it’s just not. It’s not hilly by any stretch but you know you’re going uphill on that five mile stretch to the turnaround. I was a little over 5 hours and you’re right… it was more or less 60 minutes out and 40-45 minutes back. It’s also wind dependent. The year I did it the wind changed directions each loop.
Road quality was okay but that was 11 years ago.
Loop 2 and 3 can get a bit crowded but I didn’t find it sketchy until you got back towards town. Last five miles or so of each loop.
Brackish means a mix of sea and fresh water. Obviously, no sea nearby. I think you are asking about water clarity or murkiness. It’s not clean and clear. Water quality kind of sucks too. It’s also fucking cold.
As someone mentioned, beware of those goat thorns. They’re everywhere near the transition area. I had to fix a flat on race morning. I’d suggest carrying your bike through transition when you rack it the day before and when you head out of T1.
Swim: single loop, which is nice. Cold (but bearable) temps. A few years ago there was a close call that recent rain would mean water quality would be too poor, but swim went off. Poor visibility in the water.
Bike: I really hope they revert to the old bike route out of town. Pavement last year before beeline was awful, and very congested on laps 2/3. The beeline road also has gone from nice to poor—you feel it on the high speed downhill after the turnaround.
Key point about bike is that the “back†of the out and back is super fast/easy. That means the last 18.5 miles of the 112 is pretty easy—a big contrast to courses where good cyclists put a lot of time in the bank in the last 20 miles.
Run: mostly concrete paths and some dirt. Temp will be in the 70s. Nothing especially difficult about it
Wind kinda varies from year to year. Usually headwind on the way out but it changes direction usually after 12. So if you’re killing it on the way on lap 3, be ready to grind it on the way back.
Water can be really cold. I almost bailed on the swim in 2019 due to being nearly hypothermic. If I do it again, I am bringing a thermal with me.
Gets really congested even on lap 2. Lap 3 is like zombie warfare.
Take it easy going up Curry Road hill on the run. It will make or break your second lap.
This will be my 4th IM but my first in AZ. Hoping for a KQ in M40-44, but with the reduced slots who knows.
A few questions
Bike Pacing strategy on the out and back - I’m aiming for 5hr bike, and I notice that most who do it in that time typically take 1h out and then 40m back (x3), which suggests that there’s some speed coming back down. Do you notice the hills or is it more of a grind? The course says that it’s flat, but 3x 200m elevation on the outs at 1-3% in places isn’t pancake flat.
How’s the road quality?
Course congestion - how bad does it get on loop 3?
Swim - Is this brackish water? Does it have a current?
-Anything else I need to know?
Thanks!
I think you have most of the info you need. A couple of things to add are:
-Swim course has reportedly changed again to reduce the walk to start and run to T1. Not sure what this will look like. The last few races there the queue to the swim start was supposed to allow for slotting in for your approx speed. But that was pretty much impossible without getting very aggressive. So, if you’re fast and want to be at the front of the swim, get there early.
-Many are surprised by how cold it is in PHX early am November. Between lack of sun and fairly windy sunrise it is a real cold box at transition. These conditions plus very cold water KO’d a lot of experienced racers last year. It was a cold year there already and a cold snap rolled in race week. On race day it seriously warmed up about 5-10*F from what the mornings had been the past week. It seemed a lot of participants showed up to practice parts of the course later in the day after the sun had been out a few hours. Those conditions are much different than race start time.
I’ve done this race many times. Yes, the wind is the biggest factor on the bike. It can be with or against you on the “uphill†and is likely to switch on you at some point. Hold back a little on the first lap or first half of the bike. Lots of complaints about rough roads last year. It can get congested on the second and third laps.
Expect weather! I’ve had rain and hail. Not long, but be ready.
Swim will be cold, usually 58-60°. You can find open water, but most will hug the buoy line.
Bring family, there are many spots to see you on the run. While mostly flat, it has one bigger hill you’ll see twice. The other incline just help break up the monotony.
On a complaining note, I wish Ironman would publish the Participants List.
20 male Kona slots and 60 female Nice slots seems a bit silly.
Yes the swim course is back to it’s original configuration. You start in the water in front of Transition instead of the Tempe Arts Center and swim under Mill Avenue bridge heading east to the far end of the lake and then exit back at Transition. Past couple of years you had to run about 400+M from the swim exit to T1. The bike course is also back to it’s original route, Rio Salado east to McClintok north. East on McKellips, north on Alma School, east on McDowell to the BeeLine. I rode a full loop this past Saturday. Rio road conditions are ok, McClintock is ok, the first part of McKellips to the 101 is nice but the second stretch is in rough shape. Alma and McDowell are fine. BeeLine is the same as it always is.
Ive done it several times. The road conditions on the bike have deteriorated in the last few years. I don’t know if it is bc they switched to the other side of the road, or if the pavement has deteriorated that much. It is tiring, uncomfortable, and dangerous on the downhill. I had an aerobar rattle loose and fall out. Throw in a race moto that pulled in front of me and tapped their brakes, and I had some scary moments.
Ive done it several times. The road conditions on the bike have deteriorated in the last few years. I don’t know if it is bc they switched to the other side of the road, or if the pavement has deteriorated that much. It is tiring, uncomfortable, and dangerous on the downhill. I had an aerobar rattle loose and fall out. Throw in a race moto that pulled in front of me and tapped their brakes, and I had some scary moments.
Yeah there was a bad crash involving a moto on the Beeline 2 years ago.
I’m not surprised. The point at which the moto did this to me last year was the site of a multiple bike serious crash that happens at the front of the race, and the driver was rubber necking. The crash clean up and emergency vehicles were present for several hours, so I passed them multiple times.
Yes the swim course is back to it’s original configuration. You start in the water in front of Transition instead of the Tempe Arts Center and swim under Mill Avenue bridge heading east to the far end of the lake and then exit back at Transition. Past couple of years you had to run about 400+M from the swim exit to T1. The bike course is also back to it’s original route, Rio Salado east to McClintok north. East on McKellips, north on Alma School, east on McDowell to the BeeLine. I rode a full loop this past Saturday. Rio road conditions are ok, McClintock is ok, the first part of McKellips to the 101 is nice but the second stretch is in rough shape. Alma and McDowell are fine. BeeLine is the same as it always is.
I’ll see you out there.
As far as road conditions go… I did get a flat right after I saw you on the beeline Saturday Bryan, lol.
I do hope they move it back to the north lanes of the beeline. The road surface on the south lane heading back to Tempe last year was terrible.
Water was so cold last year. I’m still thawing out.
I’m already getting FOMO. Even though I’ve raced IMAZ 5 times(in heat, cold, wind, rain, and sun) and ride the Beeline at least a couple times a month, still wish I was racing. I think it’s because of the run course around the lake and the crowd support. It’s a great race experience!
Yes the swim course is back to it’s original configuration. You start in the water in front of Transition instead of the Tempe Arts Center and swim under Mill Avenue bridge heading east to the far end of the lake and then exit back at Transition. Past couple of years you had to run about 400+M from the swim exit to T1. The bike course is also back to it’s original route, Rio Salado east to McClintok north. East on McKellips, north on Alma School, east on McDowell to the BeeLine. I rode a full loop this past Saturday. Rio road conditions are ok, McClintock is ok, the first part of McKellips to the 101 is nice but the second stretch is in rough shape. Alma and McDowell are fine. BeeLine is the same as it always is.
I’ll see you out there.
As far as road conditions go… I did get a flat right after I saw you on the beeline Saturday Bryan, lol.
I do hope they move it back to the north lanes of the beeline. The road surface on the south lane heading back to Tempe last year was terrible.
Water was so cold last year. I’m still thawing out.
I’m already getting FOMO. Even though I’ve raced IMAZ 5 times(in heat, cold, wind, rain, and sun) and ride the Beeline at least a couple times a month, still wish I was racing. I think it’s because of the run course around the lake and the crowd support. It’s a great race experience!
Hey Cam! I also had a rear tire loosing air when I got home!
Thorns are definitely a worry though and my wheels aren’t tubeless compatible. I lost out on a KQ slot in MD last year due to a flat and I don’t want to have another episode, especially with fewer slots this year. I’ll have to think of something…
Get tubes with removal valve core and add sealant. I use Orange Seal. We added this to bikes ridden in SW. Cleaning bike after ride I noticed what looked like bublegum on my tire. In fact, it was sealant. I never even noticed the puncture. Not fool proof but it is added extra protection against a flat.
Wind kinda varies from year to year. Usually headwind on the way out but it changes direction usually after 12. So if you’re killing it on the way on lap 3, be ready to grind it on the way back.
Water can be really cold. I almost bailed on the swim in 2019 due to being nearly hypothermic. If I do it again, I am bringing a thermal with me.
Gets really congested even on lap 2. Lap 3 is like zombie warfare.
Take it easy going up Curry Road hill on the run. It will make or break your second lap.
Well, I am in again, xferred from IM Sac due to some injuries.
Into that urban lake again!
Thorns are definitely a worry though and my wheels aren’t tubeless compatible. I lost out on a KQ slot in MD last year due to a flat and I don’t want to have another episode, especially with fewer slots this year. I’ll have to think of something…
Get tubes with removal valve core and add sealant. I use Orange Seal. We added this to bikes ridden in SW. Cleaning bike after ride I noticed what looked like bublegum on my tire. In fact, it was sealant. I never even noticed the puncture. Not fool proof but it is added extra protection against a flat.
Does sealant work with both latex and butyl tubes? How much do you add? How long does it last, does it harden at some point and you just toss the tube?