So i’m getting pretty frustrated with trying to figure out an appropriate saddle/seatpost combination for my bike setup. A bit of background: my primary focus is cyclocross and road esque cycling, so having a fit is pretty important but with the amount of movement you do on a 'cross bike I don’t really have a huge desire to get an incredibly expensive fit… Plus I’m nowhere near the podium or the money so at the moment, getting a good feel on the bike is what I want.
Body specs: 5 ft 8" with a ~30 in inseam
bike: Niner BSB 9 RDO 53CM
Crank: 170MM crank arm length
The problem: My seat is slammed all the way forward and it seems to be like that with every bike I get that’s between 53-54CM sizing.
I’m running a zero degree offset seatpost with a specialized toupe 144MM wide saddle. To get a decent pedal stroke and not feel like the saddle is “battle axing” me, I’m having to slam the seatpost all the way forward. As far as getting what feels to be a decent pedal position, I have just been going with the standard “plum bob over the pedal spindle measured at the knee.”
I had a 50CM Felt which allowed a decent play in the saddle, but I also had wicked bad toe overlap as well as feeling like I was sitting way on top of the bike and riding on cross courses left me totally off balance.
The BSB 9 feels good on the upper portion of my body, like I’m not really reaching with a 100MM stem, no pain in the upper/mid back or arms. No pain in the legs, the pedal stroke doesn’t lock the knee’s out even when trying to keep a parallel platform with the ground, so I don’t believe the seatpost is too high.
Anyone run into a problem like this? Not sure if this is a common problem, and would rather look at just getting a different saddle/equipment placement rather than having to pay for a bike fit.
Get a 52cm and shorter cranks. I have 165mm on my road bike, I can’t really teal much difference vs when I had 175s… except more ground clearance, less toe overlap.
It might just be that those bikes have too long reach for you, so you are having to move your seat forward to get close enough to the bars. You could start with a shorter stem, but maybe smaller frames would be better.
My seat is slammed all the way forward and it seems to be like that with every bike I get that’s between 53-54CM sizing.
I’d also start paying to your frame stack and reach numbers, since traditional sizing numbers are almost meaningless. Do all of your frame have a similar reach? It is VERY helpful to have S/R numbers in mind when buying your next bike.
I still think it would be worth getting a fit on whatever bike you spend the most time on. At a minimum, it should give you a good baseline of S/R numbers to inform future purchasing decisions and position tweaks.
I’m the same height and inseam as you and have a pretty good handle on bike fit for both road and cx bikes. Do you know how far back your tip of saddle is behind your BB? Most people with our height and proportions would have 5-7cm setback (tip of saddle behind BB) as a good starting point.
Personally, I normally ride bikes between 51cm and 54cm (reach 375-380 and stack 530mm-560mm). Higher stack range would be a cx bike. I tend to run 110mm stems on my road bike and 100mm stems on my cx bike (depending on the size).
While I’m much smaller than you I have very similar saddle setbacks between my Tri, Road and Mountain bikes.
I have short femurs compared to most people and I think that’s why I like to be further forward.
Tri bike is 54mm in front of the BB
Road bike is 35mm in front of the BB
Mountain bike is 20mm in front of the BB
It’s not because of the bike fit lengthwise, it’s because I don’t feel I have an effective pedal stroke sitting further back. It feels like I’m pushing forward if I set my saddle back to 0
I believe I have the same dimensions as you, and I have had a similar experience. What turned out to work for me was to lower the seat height. I ride an arione saddle, and as soon as i lowered the seat height (just 2-3mm), I started sitting more backwards.
I quickly checked the geometry on the BSB 9. That bike’s got a fairly short reach and a really tall stack, so I don’t think reach is your problem. The best way to check is to see your shoulder angle. If it’s >90 degrees, then a shorter stem should help.
I’ll see if I can get a picture of me on the bike when I can get around to setting it up on the trainer.
It’s definitely not a reach issue. Having the saddle slammed all the way forward just allows me comfort to ride since i’m not sitting in the middle of the saddle and it’s not wedge “in between” my sit bones.
I’ve tried three different saddles. the Arione horrible saddle that’s too small for me the Specialized power saddle and the Specialized toupe. Both of those work, but only when I’ve slammed the saddle all the way forward, that’s when my sit bones are seated at the back end of the saddle and thus provide comfort.
So yeah… I really wasn’t hoping that it was a frame issue but I’m starting to lean that way as well…
I’m running a zero degree offset seatpost with a specialized toupe 144MM wide saddle. To get a decent pedal stroke and*** not feel like the saddle is “battle axing” me***, I’m having to slam the seatpost all the way forward. As far as getting what feels to be a decent pedal position, I have just been going with the standard “plum bob over the pedal spindle measured at the knee.”
What do you mean by this?
How did you settle on the 143 width?
I’m going to make the assumption that battle-axing is uncomfortable pressure (splitting your pelvis like a log-splitter) that is relieved by sitting further back on the saddle.
If this is correct, you may be on a saddle that is too narrow for you and are moving as far back as possible to find support. Therefore in an attempt to get your hips in the correct position, you are slamming the saddle forward.
If you have a compelling reason to be on the 143, stick with it. If not, try to use a saddle that is a width wider. If you are near Boulder, I may have something you could try. (Only because you’re a CX guy )
Also, remember that saddle position should be set first, reach to the handlebar second.
I tend to run CX about ~1cm forward of my road position. I think it helps weight distribution on seated cornering.
Nah I’m all the way up in the Northwest unfortunately.
So the “battle axing” you’re right on the money. my sit bones essentially rest on the outsides of the saddle if i scoot forward enough and the pressure is right on the peri area. moving myself actively backwards and getting that actual pressure on both the left and right sit bones is the only way to get a comfortable ride and to ride for 2+ hours without wanting to throw my bike into a ditch.
No reason to not try a wider size saddle, I’ve just done that whole specialized fit thing and sat on the memory foam and got measured. I haven’t really found a saddle that I liked that might allow for a more forward position. I might try and see if I can get my hands on a 155CM saddle and go from there unless you/anyone else has better recommendations.
I’ll see if I can get a picture of me on the bike when I can get around to setting it up on the trainer.
It’s definitely not a reach issue. Having the saddle slammed all the way forward just allows me comfort to ride since i’m not sitting in the middle of the saddle and it’s not wedge “in between” my sit bones.
I’ve tried three different saddles. the Arione horrible saddle that’s too small for me the Specialized power saddle and the Specialized toupe. Both of those work, but only when I’ve slammed the saddle all the way forward, that’s when my sit bones are seated at the back end of the saddle and thus provide comfort.
So yeah… I really wasn’t hoping that it was a frame issue but I’m starting to lean that way as well…
That’s kinda strange: Arione vs Specialized Power there is at list 3-4cm difference between them, having said that; you can move S. Power back by 3-4cm and you will feel exactly the same as on Arione, minus the pressure due to cut out… If you measured your seat bones size and it placed you on Arione 147cm you need Specialized Power 155mm, power generally should be one size up from regular saddles.
How flexible are you?
Are you racing in drops or on the bars?
Can you spent 60 min in drops comfortably?
How much riding are you doing a week, is it 30-50km or 200-300km?
Are you wearing bibs or shorts with what padding?
Is your saddle straight or tilted, what direction nose up or down?
You should feel massive difference between Toupe vs. Power
Nah I’m all the way up in the Northwest unfortunately.
So the “battle axing” you’re right on the money. my sit bones essentially rest on the outsides of the saddle if i scoot forward enough and the pressure is right on the peri area. moving myself actively backwards and getting that actual pressure on both the left and right sit bones is the only way to get a comfortable ride and to ride for 2+ hours without wanting to throw my bike into a ditch.
No reason to not try a wider size saddle, I’ve just done that whole specialized fit thing and sat on the memory foam and got measured. I haven’t really found a saddle that I liked that might allow for a more forward position. I might try and see if I can get my hands on a 155CM saddle and go from there unless you/anyone else has better recommendations.
I’m of the opinion that the fit starts with the saddle.
As other’s have said; you may just have short femurs, in which case you need to be pushed forward. (I certainly do, my saddles are easy to set: Slam them forward on a 0offset post!)
However, with a 30inch inseam on a 5’8", I’m reluctant to think that is the case.
My steps would be:
Find a saddle you’re happy with and that allows you to sit on naturally with good bi-lateral support
Set saddle in correct position to set hips / knees in correct position (either Tibial tuberosity at forward edge of spindle or +1 cm ahead)(to start)
I’ll see if I can get a picture of me on the bike when I can get around to setting it up on the trainer.
It’s definitely not a reach issue. Having the saddle slammed all the way forward just allows me comfort to ride since i’m not sitting in the middle of the saddle and it’s not wedge “in between” my sit bones.
I’ve tried three different saddles. the Arione horrible saddle that’s too small for me the Specialized power saddle and the Specialized toupe. Both of those work, but only when I’ve slammed the saddle all the way forward, that’s when my sit bones are seated at the back end of the saddle and thus provide comfort.
So yeah… I really wasn’t hoping that it was a frame issue but I’m starting to lean that way as well…
That’s kinda strange: Arione vs Specialized Power there is at list 3-4cm difference between them, having said that; you can move S. Power back by 3-4cm and you will feel exactly the same as on Arione, minus the pressure due to cut out… If you measured your seat bones size and it placed you on Arione 147cm you need Specialized Power 155mm, power generally should be one size up from regular saddles.
How flexible are you?
Are you racing in drops or on the bars?
Can you spent 60 min in drops comfortably?
How much riding are you doing a week, is it 30-50km or 200-300km?
Are you wearing bibs or shorts with what padding?
Is your saddle straight or tilted, what direction nose up or down?
You should feel massive difference between Toupe vs. Power
I would say average flexibility? can touch my toes with locked knees. Can’t do anything like putting my feet flat on the ground though
racing 'cross or even road racing is half and half, sometimes in the drops but usually not for more than 5 minutes without feeling some general discomfort
I ride around 120-150 miles a week, unless it’s a build up period then I’m putting 200-250 a week.
bibs with a decent padding, voler’s 4+ hour type padding
Saddle is straight, no tilt.
Gonna play around with the fit right now. I am wondering if maaayyyybe i just have the seatpost way too high and see if I drop the saddle a tad and throw the seatpost back a bit, go from there.
I dropped my saddle a solid half an inch and threw my saddle back probably a good 1/5th to 1/4th of an inch, it actually feels REALLY good and this is without padding and riding in hospital scrubs. Eyeballing my knee to spindle intersection i’m pretty confident I probably moved my knee a bit forward. Something tells me that the “saddle being too high” was correct, and hopefully this MIGHT help me out with getting some extra power? Only assuming since I would think that I would be engaging more of the major muscle groups…
I think it’s safe to say that I need a bike fit…
Thanks everyone for all the help! I think that it’s probably complex enough of a problem that can’t be solved by mere posting, however you guys definitely got me to a point where I think it’s not a bike issue but more of proper fit issue.
thanks again! Free beer’s for everyone*
*only valid in northwest and limit 1 per customer, expiration date 10/31/16
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