Adult onset swimmer. I actually completed a 1.2 mile swim once a few years ago and I found it really challenging. I’ve also done an Olympic distance triathlon and was in the back of the pack for the swim. I’ve gone to a TI swim clinic a few years back and found it helpful. I’ll be swimming in a 25 yard pool this winter to start to prepare for a September 70.3.
Not looking to be fast - just want to feel comfortable that I’ll be able to swim the course in under an hour even if there is some current to contend with. This winter is there a certain distance in the pool that should give me confidence I’m on my way? I plan on swimming 3x a week.
10x100 yd. leaving every 2:30 a good indicator? Yes I plan on doing some open water swims during the summer but looking for some advice on what kind of times I should be looking for in the pool. Thanks in advance for any helpful advice.
How fast was your Olympic swim? I would use that as a starting point.
I hardly consider myself a fast swimmer. I had one race where I was literally the last person out of the water. I went from that to having about 30-40% of swimmers behind me. I spent years struggling on my own, but here is what worked for me. Simply adding more time in the pool was reinforcing all of my bad habits and frustrating me without making me any faster. I found someone who could fix my stroke, and more importantly, my mess of a kick. Then I was able to effectively incorporate speedwork. I ended up getting faster with less effort once I learned to get by body out of its own way. Also, because my pull is stronger, I feel much more confident swimming in a current.
Bumping this thread to see if I can get any more responses.
Thank you HappyScientist for chiming in. I guess I would say my question is really aimed at basically seeing if I need to get a swim coach. My goal is to comfortably finish the 1.2 swim in under an hour. My goal for this first 70.3 race is not to be as fast as possible, I want to finish comfortably within the time allowed. So if I can do 10x100 leaving at 2:30 is that a good indicator? Or is there some other pool swim test that a Slowtwitcher can tell me, if you can do X then you should be able to comfortably swim 1.2 miles in under an hour.
If I can meet the test - great I’m on the right path and my swim stroke isn’t poor enough to prevent my goal. If I can’t meet the test on my own or if my goals change then I would look for a swim coach then.
So if anyone on slowtwitch has a pool test they use to gauge that they are ready for a 1.2 mile swim I’d like to hear it. Thanks in advance!
At current speed you’ll swim 47-50 minutes, but it would be good to get an idea of how long it currently takes you.
You’ll want to improve your speed, but it also makes sense getting comfortable with the distance. Putting in enough 2-3km distance sets will help your confidence, and make you fresher on the bike.
If you can do 10x100 on 2:30, that should indicate that you can swim 1.9k in 60 or less, but If you aren’t confident in that, then I would say build up to a couple of straight 2k or longer swims in the pool. You want to give yourself some buffer just in case.
edit - I was thinking 10x100m. If you are doing yards, then if you are doing that set and getting 20s rest after each 100 that’s a lot different than if you are barely able to make it. if you are barely able to make it, I’d say no, you won’t make 1 hour cut unless something favourable happens (like a downriver swim, coughChattanoogacough.)
nc45. . not being snarky here, genuinely unclear to me why my 2014 olympic distance triathlon swim time is relevant to my question, I only even mentioned it to give a little background, but sure it was in 2014 and a swim time of 46 minutes. So do you or happyscientist have a pool test that lets you gauge if you are on track for a 1.2 mile swim in under an hour?
georged - thanks, yes I planned on swimming the whole distance but I’ll be starting from zero and working my way up so I was looking for a test along the way to assure myself I was on the right path. Follow-up question when I get to the point of swimming the whole distance do you just do 1x2150 yards and look at the total time? Do you allow yourself any rest during the set (with the clock still running obviously)? What time in the pool would make you feel comfortable that you’ll be able to do it in the open water in under an hour?
If you can do 10x100 on 2:30, that should indicate that you can swim 1.9k in 60 or less, but If you aren’t confident in that, then I would say build up to a couple of straight 2k or longer swims in the pool. You want to give yourself some buffer just in case.
I’m certainly no expert. But, a 10x100 main set (half the race distance) doesn’t seem like the best bench mark. 20x100, 4x500, 2x1000 with moderate rest (20-30s) seem like better choices. if you can do any of those in under an hour (rest included)…then you should be golden. As Jason said, having some buffer would probably be good.
From my own data last year, I found that my “average” total pace for my workouts (rest included) over the month prior to the race was the most accurate indicator of my Oly swim times. I was slightly faster than that pace in race…but, quite a bit slower than my 1000yTT pace. Maybe that’s a problem that is unique to me…but, that’s what MY data says about ME.
I’m certainly no expert. But, a 10x100 main set (half the race distance) doesn’t seem like the best bench mark. 20x100, 4x500, 2x1000 with moderate rest (20-30s) seem like better choices. if you can do any of those in under an hour (rest included)…then you should be golden. As Jason said, having some buffer would probably be good.
From my own data last year, I found that my “average” total pace for my workouts (rest included) over the month prior to the race was the most accurate indicator of my Oly swim times. I was slightly faster than that pace in race…but, quite a bit slower than my 1000yTT pace. Maybe that’s a problem that is unique to me…but, that’s what MY data says about ME.
Interesting so you were just as fast in the open water on race day as when you did the full distance in the pool? That’s encouraging. Although as you and Jason said - I’ll definitely want a buffer in case current is tough and I just want to start with confidence that I’ll make it under the time allotted. Thanks again all.
nc45. . not being snarky here, genuinely unclear to me why my 2014 olympic distance triathlon swim time is relevant to my question, I only even mentioned it to give a little background, but sure it was in 2014 and a swim time of 46 minutes. So do you or happyscientist have a pool test that lets you gauge if you are on track for a 1.2 mile swim in under an hour?
georged - thanks, yes I planned on swimming the whole distance but I’ll be starting from zero and working my way up so I was looking for a test along the way to assure myself I was on the right path. Follow-up question when I get to the point of swimming the whole distance do you just do 1x2150 yards and look at the total time? Do you allow yourself any rest during the set (with the clock still running obviously)? What time in the pool would make you feel comfortable that you’ll be able to do it in the open water in under an hour?
I wasn’t trying to be snarky, either. But, if you’d mentioned in the OP that your OLY was in 2014, I wouldn’t have asked you about it.
Your speeds would tell me that it’s probably a technique thing. If you’ve got the fitness to have completed an Oly, and you’re not just blowing up 20m in, then you’re probably just super inefficient in your catch. I’d vote the coach route.
Interesting so you were just as fast in the open water on race day as when you did the full distance in the pool? That’s encouraging. Although as you and Jason said - I’ll definitely want a buffer in case current is tough and I just want to start with confidence that I’ll make it under the time allotted. Thanks again all.
Not in the way I think you think I mean. What I mean is that my average pace for an entire workout including ALL rests, from the time I get in the water to the time I get out…was most representative of my OWS pace.
For example, say I go to the pool and do 3100 yards. I get in the water at 545a and I get out of the water at 650am. So, that’s 3100 yards in 65 minutes…or 2:06/100scy. My average pace for my Oly race swims this year was 1:55/100 for my first, and 2:13/100 for the second. The 2:13 was in somewhat challenging conditions with 20mph winds and 800m of the swim was directly into that wind (and chop), and the other two legs were across the wind (no downwind legs). Even ignoring the conditions, the average pace for the two swims was 2:04/100…pretty damn close to that 2:06 above.
Contrast that with my 1000scyTT of 17:00 or 1:42/100 pace. On Tuesday I did a 20x100 (:20) coming in at 1:39/100. So, my pool swimming “paces” are considerably faster than my race OWS pace. But, if you factor in ALL the rest, then my AVERAGE pace (including the rest) matches up much more closely with actual race times.
Maybe that’s just me, and I need to work on whatever makes my OWS paces so much slower. Maybe its just a big fat coincidence that the data above aligns like it does. But, as of now that’s the data I’ve got.
Your speeds would tell me that it’s probably a technique thing. If you’ve got the fitness to have completed an Oly, and you’re not just blowing up 20m in, then you’re probably just super inefficient in your catch. I’d vote the coach route.
This.
Swimming slower than about 1:50/100? You are swimming uphill (legs sinking), or in hammock position (kicking to keep feet on the surface but butt and hips sinking), or twisting your waist (body rotates one way, legs rotate the other way, entire body scrunches up adding drag) rather than keep the hull long and rotate cleanly, or your stroke has some fundamental problems that add drag and slow you down at every catch, or probably all of the above.
Once you get under about 1:50/100 then you can go for speed intervals and power through to 1:30/100 and faster. But until you can effortlessly cruise at about 1:50/100 the solution is going to be body position and drag reduction.
Good news is you got low hanging fruit to improve. With correct drills you’ll be cruising pretty soon. But what is that? One armed swim drills. Kick with fins in superman position (one arm out in front other by your side) and rotate for air. Buoy/paddles to get the feel for the water. Swim with ankles tied together with a rubber band. Keep in mind that these drills can be done incorrectly and then you are just wasting time. That leads us full circle to a swim coach or swim team. But there are just as many bad coaches as there are good ones. You don’t want Sgt Hartmann yelling at you from the poolside. You need someone who can see and understand what you are doing wrong, and give you drills to improve, and correct you if you are doing them wrong.
nc45. . not being snarky here, genuinely unclear to me why my 2014 olympic distance triathlon swim time is relevant to my question, I only even mentioned it to give a little background, but sure it was in 2014 and a swim time of 46 minutes. So do you or happyscientist have a pool test that lets you gauge if you are on track for a 1.2 mile swim in under an hour?
georged - thanks, yes I planned on swimming the whole distance but I’ll be starting from zero and working my way up so I was looking for a test along the way to assure myself I was on the right path. Follow-up question when I get to the point of swimming the whole distance do you just do 1x2150 yards and look at the total time? Do you allow yourself any rest during the set (with the clock still running obviously)? What time in the pool would make you feel comfortable that you’ll be able to do it in the open water in under an hour?
I wasn’t trying to be snarky, either. But, if you’d mentioned in the OP that your OLY was in 2014, I wouldn’t have asked you about it.
Good luck.
No hard feelings - I must have written the original OP in a way that made it seem more relevant then it was - I’ll be more careful next time how I phrase a question. Thanks!
Interesting so you were just as fast in the open water on race day as when you did the full distance in the pool? That’s encouraging. Although as you and Jason said - I’ll definitely want a buffer in case current is tough and I just want to start with confidence that I’ll make it under the time allotted. Thanks again all.
Not in the way I think you think I mean. What I mean is that my average pace for an entire workout including ALL rests, from the time I get in the water to the time I get out…was most representative of my OWS pace.
For example, say I go to the pool and do 3100 yards. I get in the water at 545a and I get out of the water at 650am. So, that’s 3100 yards in 65 minutes…or 2:06/100scy. My average pace for my Oly race swims this year was 1:55/100 for my first, and 2:13/100 for the second. The 2:13 was in somewhat challenging conditions with 20mph winds and 800m of the swim was directly into that wind (and chop), and the other two legs were across the wind (no downwind legs). Even ignoring the conditions, the average pace for the two swims was 2:04/100…pretty damn close to that 2:06 above.
Contrast that with my 1000scyTT of 17:00 or 1:42/100 pace. On Tuesday I did a 20x100 (:20) coming in at 1:39/100. So, my pool swimming “paces” are considerably faster than my race OWS pace. But, if you factor in ALL the rest, then my AVERAGE pace (including the rest) matches up much more closely with actual race times.
Maybe that’s just me, and I need to work on whatever makes my OWS paces so much slower. Maybe its just a big fat coincidence that the data above aligns like it does. But, as of now that’s the data I’ve got.
Your speeds would tell me that it’s probably a technique thing. If you’ve got the fitness to have completed an Oly, and you’re not just blowing up 20m in, then you’re probably just super inefficient in your catch. I’d vote the coach route.
This.
Swimming slower than about 1:50/100? You are swimming uphill (legs sinking), or in hammock position (kicking to keep feet on the surface but butt and hips sinking), or twisting your waist (body rotates one way, legs rotate the other way, entire body scrunches up adding drag) rather than keep the hull long and rotate cleanly, or your stroke has some fundamental problems that add drag and slow you down at every catch, or probably all of the above.
Once you get under about 1:50/100 then you can go for speed intervals and power through to 1:30/100 and faster. But until you can effortlessly cruise at about 1:50/100 the solution is going to be body position and drag reduction.
Good news is you got low hanging fruit to improve. With correct drills you’ll be cruising pretty soon. But what is that? One armed swim drills. Kick with fins in superman position (one arm out in front other by your side) and rotate for air. Buoy/paddles to get the feel for the water. Swim with ankles tied together with a rubber band. Keep in mind that these drills can be done incorrectly and then you are just wasting time. That leads us full circle to a swim coach or swim team. But there are just as many bad coaches as there are good ones. You don’t want Sgt Hartmann yelling at you from the poolside. You need someone who can see and understand what you are doing wrong, and give you drills to improve, and correct you if you are doing them wrong.
Thank you both. I’m not sure really of my swim times yet. I’d like to give myself a chance to get my swim fitness up from zero and test out where I’m at. You are correct Justin I’m overall fit for my age. I’ll pick a goal for the year and then go for it. One year it was bike 208 miles in a day. One year it was a marathon. This year it was backpack 273 miles end-to-end (over 25 days). Next year it’s a 70.3. Having a goal for the year helps motivate me to train or otherwise keep in shape and then the event/race/goal is the reward at the end. Anyway I digress.
Thank you all very much for the advice. When I only had one response to my question I wasn’t very comfortable with my plan of attack for the swim. Now I think I have an idea at least. I’ll get up my swim fitness and see where my times are at and then decide if I need a coach to help me meet my goals. I’ll try to resist my urge to say thank you to every post but I’ll keep checking this thread if others chime in.