How to go from half marathon to 5k training

Triathlon Forum
1

I race short course - did my last race, an Olympic, on Labor Day weekend. I’ve basically gone to straight running with minimal swim and bike for the past two months training for a half marathon. I lost two weeks due to a back issue, school started, it got cold and dark, blah blah blah. Anyway, I never built to the 50 mile peak I wanted. I did 36 last week (long run of 14 - I know that’s a bad ratio Desert Dude) which isn’t even as good as my tri peak of 40 this summer. Mostly focused on mileage and any tempo work was in the goal pace range, 6:50-7:20.

My race is this weekend. After that, I have 4 weeks to get ready for my last race of the year, a 5k. I want to go under 20 minutes. I hit 20:30 a bunch both open and in tris this summer on 5-6 runs (plus swim and bike) with a long run around 10, medium run with 3-4 of tempo, short hill repeats, a few easy 3-4 milers and a medium run with 3-4 of track work, mostly 800s.

Probably too much frosting, not enough base.

In the short 4 weeks after my race, what should I focus on? My base isn’t too big - should I try to get up to 45-50 miles, not worrying too much about speed? Should I focus on a tempo run and speedwork? Should I do intervals under that 6:25 pace? I know it isn’t much time - how should I use it?

2

I’ve gotten to sub 20 on 16 miles per week. Run a 5k 6 days a week for the next 4 weeks. Just my 2 cents - some-one that knows how to run fast will hopefully given you a better answer. I have no idea how to even run 50 miles in a week.

3

Seems to me that you have a time goal of sub-20 for a 5k (how’s that for top notch reading skills?). This is ~6:26 per mile. You have to start doing intervals that are at least this pace or faster. You already have the base so focus on the speed. IMO, you need to do intervals that are shorter and faster than goal pace, such as 400 repeats on the 90 seconds with 1 min rest. I’d also include a tempo run trying to hit at least 10-15 min of 6:40’s. Good luck.

4

I know it isn’t much time - how should I use it?

My $0.02. I think you’ve got enough base to focus on speedwork for the next 3.5 weeks. Given your apparent youth (you’re in school) I think you might be able to do 8 - 10 interval workouts @ 2 - 3 per week.

I’d focus on 400s, e.g. 8, 10, 12, and 16x400 @ 90 seconds w. 400 slow jog or 200 walk recovery. I’d also add sessions of 4, 6 and 8x800 @ 3:05 w. 400 slow jog recovery and a session of 4x1600 @ 6:20 w. 400 jog recovery.

HTH,
Phil

5

Thanks to everyone for the help so far.

Phil - good guess, looking at what I wrote. I’m actually a 34 year old teacher. I might be able to swing two interval sessions a week, but would probably need to cut back on overall frequency. I wondered about an approach like that…never done that much speed, and it is appealing for a short block!

6

Here are some workouts you ought to be doing:

Tempo:

Tempo: 5x1 mile@6:55 pace, 1’ rest interval

Interval: 4x1200 in 4:45 (3’ rest)

Rep: 8x400 in 1:29 (200m easy jog rest interval, 3’ rest interval)

These are times that would indicate fitness for a 20:00 5K. The “interval” workout is a good indicator of your current 5K pace. If you are able to avg faster then the 4:45 pace for all 4 of them, you should shoot to improve that avg the next time you do the workout while staying consistent across all 4. I used this table to get the paces:

http://www.runbayou.com/jackd.htm

FWIW, the book Jack Daniel’s Running Formula gives a decent description of different types of speedwork, and has some good info on when you would be wanting to do various workouts in relation to your race date.

At this point, adding mileage isn’t going to help you much on race day. If your race is on a Sunday, I do do my last hard workout as a tempo day on Tuesday, then just 3-4 mile runs on the days leading up to the race with some strides.

I’d have the tempo day also be my long run day, probably around 8 miles. I’d shoot for 2 hard days a week, one being the tempo, and then the rest of the runs being 4 miles easy. Do 4-6x100m “strides” (not all out, maybe 1 mile race pace) on a couple of the easy days each week.

7

Here are some workouts you ought to be doing:

Tempo:

Tempo: 5x1 mile@6:55 pace, 1’ rest interval

Interval: 4x1200 in 4:45 (3’ rest)

Rep: 8x400 in 1:29 (200m easy jog rest interval, 3’ rest interval)

These are times that would indicate fitness for a 20:00 5K. The “interval” workout is a good indicator of your current 5K pace. If you are able to avg faster then the 4:45 pace for all 4 of them, you should shoot to improve that avg the next time you do the workout while staying consistent across all 4. I used this table to get the paces:

http://www.runbayou.com/jackd.htm

FWIW, the book Jack Daniel’s Running Formula gives a decent description of different types of speedwork, and has some good info on when you would be wanting to do various workouts in relation to your race date.

At this point, adding mileage isn’t going to help you much on race day. If your race is on a Sunday, I do do my last hard workout as a tempo day on Tuesday, then just 3-4 mile runs on the days leading up to the race with some strides.

I’d have the tempo day also be my long run day, probably around 8 miles. I’d shoot for 2 hard days a week, one being the tempo, and then the rest of the runs being 4 miles easy. Do 4-6x100m “strides” (not all out, maybe 1 mile race pace) on a couple of the easy days each week.

This is almost exactly what I would have written, so I’m going to quote it so the OP reads it twice. The only thing I would say on top of this is to not worry about your weekly mileage at this point. You already have all the base you’re going to have built, so sharpen it up, and you’ll do fine. Oh, and don’t run uneven splits in the race itself unless the terrain forces it. If your goal is to break 20, don’t go out in 5:40.
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8

I’m actually a 34 year old teacher.
No problem. Given your apparent relative youth I think you might be able to do 7 interval workouts @ two per week, e.g. 1 every three days. :slight_smile:

I wondered about an approach like that…never done that much speed, and it is appealing for a short block!
A revised potential sequence would be:

8x400 @ 90 seconds w. 400 walk, slow jog or 200 walk recovery - as necessary.
4x800 @ 3:05 w. 400 walk/jog or 200 walk

10x400 @ 90 seconds w. 400 walk/jog or 200 walk
6x800 @ 3:05 w. 400 walk/jog or 200 walk

12x400 @ 90 seconds w. 400 walk/jog or 200 walk
8x800 @ 3:05 w. 400 walk/jog or 200 walk

4x1600 @ 6:20 w. 400 jog recovery.

I think you’re going to have to do something like this to be confident that you’ll be able to drop 30 seconds and it was encouraging to see that these workouts are generally compatible with Daniels’ formula.

I think you also may benefit from core work on recovery days.

Best,
Phil

9

OK - so I’m all over these intervals. Did the 400s and 800s this week along with 2 miles on the treadmill around goal pace (2% grade).

My issue is I’m slacking on in-between runs. Does that matter at this point with 2 weeks to go? I’ve done 4 runs since last Saturday - 3 hard efforts, 1 easy 3 miler, 3 rest days (partly due to work). Should I try to get more runs or just worry about getting 3-5 more hard sessions in before the race?

10

OK - so I’m all over these intervals. Did the 400s and 800s this week along with 2 miles on the treadmill around goal pace (2% grade).

My issue is I’m slacking on in-between runs. Does that matter at this point with 2 weeks to go? I’ve done 4 runs since last Saturday - 3 hard efforts, 1 easy 3 miler, 3 rest days (partly due to work). Should I try to get more runs or just worry about getting 3-5 more hard sessions in before the race?

Keep the miles coming - they’re benefiting you more than you might realize. It doesn’t matter if the pace is slowing on those, but keep 'em up. Don’t have a schedule that consists of primarily high intensity runs. That may be asking for trouble.

11

In general I’m with you. With my 5k in 2 weeks does it matter as much?

12

Should I try to get more runs or just worry about getting 3-5 more hard sessions in before the race?

The emphasis should be on quality, not quantity. I’d suggest three or four more interval workouts, e.g. 6x800, 10x400, 4x1600. These are common sharpening/peaking phase workouts designed to increase your pace. They should be difficult but you should stop if you begin to struggle with the pace or if your time increases by a few seconds on successive intervals.

You can also do intervals during your taper, e.g. 4x400 @ goal pace four days b4 race; 2x400 @ goal pace two days b4 race.

13

Just reading this now, did you make your sun 20 5k ?