Would appreciate some advice. HTFU is already known. Anything more insightful is appreciated.
I am in my 4th year of racing – strong swimmer, top 1/3rd biker, slow runner. I have 7-8 hours/week devoted to training. I get in 1-2 long rides of 40-80 miles or 25-35 hill rides /week. 2 bricks each week. I compete in sprints and Olys. My long runs are 6-8 miles. I already know I need to drop 15 lbs to get to Slowman’s definition of race fit.
I can’t seem to finish strong through the run. Checking my HR, I suppose I could back it off a titch on the swim. Bike HR was just right. I generally “rule out” nutrition as a cause since I eat 30 mins before swim and take in 1 gel at start of bike and another 5 miles before the end.
Is it a mental thing or a physical thing at the end of the run and I can’t push it?
Month and miles … jan 63, feb 42, mar 70, apr 70, may 35, jun est 50
runs now are 70% endurance runs, 25% hills. 5% speed … based on the miles
Change months to weeks and your problem is solved. Run more = better runner. Forget speed and hills (for now).
this. 15mpw isn’t enough. more miles. and maybe backing off slightly from the swim and bike in races. it’s amazing when people try to kill the bike and then blow up on the run b/c they went too hard for their current fitness on the bike.
Month and miles … jan 63, feb 42, mar 70, apr 70, may 35, jun est 50
Hate to say it, but the “more is more” lesson is yours to learn if you want your run result to stack up to your swim result. Those monthly totals are within shouting distance of my weekly totals and I suck at running big time (but it IS improving ever so slowly). Try searching for BarryP’s running tips, in particular his 3-2-1 schedule.
Listen to Yknot, forget speed and hills for now. Just simply build up your running base more, you will get a lot faster even without doing speedwork. The 10k is 95% aerobic or something like that, so you need to have a strong aerobic base. Don’t worry about the anaerobic stuff until you have a strong base. You can actually do some hills for strength but just do a hilly route, don’t worry about doing hill repeats.
A wise ole triathlete once told me to negative split *every time *I was running. This will help you finish strong and work on your HTFU. I’m not exactly an FOPer but running is my stronger suit in a race. Not sure if it’s from the negative splits or…something else. Also, maybe a run focus, as others have suggested, would really get you where you want to be. Good Luck!
Month and miles … jan 63, feb 42, mar 70, apr 70, may 35, jun est 50
runs now are 70% endurance runs, 25% hills. 5% speed … based on the miles
Change months to weeks and your problem is solved. Run more = better runner. Forget speed and hills (for now).
He said he only has 7-8hrs of time devoted to training per week.
I think you need a mix of long runs and speed work. I think speed work helps improve your technique. If you’re a top 1/3 cyclist, then your should be a top 1/3 runner based on power output. So clearly your issue is technique, or something mental in terms of pacing.
I’d work on increasing you leg turnover/cadence. increase your long run distance to 8-10 miles and focus on your form when your legs are tired in the last 2-3 miles. Pay attention to what your doing wiht your arms and leg turnover.
MY observation of most runners with poor technique is taht they are not running upright, arm are doing some weird things and are not well coordinated, and they are either taking long strides or plodding.
Losing weight makes a big difference too. Although I’ve put 2-3lbs back on in the last 2 months (probably 1/2 muscle, 1/2 fat) but haven’t noticed much loss in running speed but my swimming and cycling are stronger, so it might be a good trade-off.
What problem are you having? Leg cramping, muscle fatigue, or heart rate is maxed (out of breath)?
I know my limitation is leg cramping on tri’s longer than 1 hour. I need to do my LT training. I’m also into my first year back in term of serious training. Next season I should perform much better.
Monday: Swim
Tuesday: Bike 25 Miles, Run 3 miles easy
Wednesday: Swim, Run 6 miles @ tempo pace
Thursday: Bike 25 miles, Run 3 miles easy
Friday: Swim, Run 6 miles @ tempo pace
Saturday: Bike 40-60 miles, Run 3 miles easy
Sunday: Run 9 miles @ something between easy and tempo pace.
If you aren’t ready to do this on week one, then build up to it.
Thanks to all … especially the weekly plan. I can do that
Yesterday’s sprint tri … knowing that the longer the tri, the higher the level of fitness, but the relative results to ALL MALES 227 in total tell the tale. I need to work on the run.
9 on the swim
87 on the bike
181 on the run
93 total - male 56 y.o.
I can do better and appreciate the help. next race in an OLY on July 9
Your results are exactly like mine. I get out of the water at the front, do pretty well on the bike and then have a parade of people run past me. At least that was my situation for the last two years. Starting in March I changed my run focus to running more often (6-7 days/week) and it has completely turned my run performances around. I haven’t done a tri this year yet but have done 3 duathlons and my run performances off the bike have been night and day compared to last year. I dropped a minute and 30 seconds off my 5k time and over 2 mins off my 10k time just since march. All I did was run more often, no speedwork, no hills, just run.
Thanks to all … especially the weekly plan. I can do that
Yesterday’s sprint tri … knowing that the longer the tri, the higher the level of fitness, but the relative results to ALL MALES 227 in total tell the tale. I need to work on the run.
9 on the swim
87 on the bike
181 on the run
93 total - male 56 y.o.
I can do better and appreciate the help. next race in an OLY on July 9
Awww. That’s my birthday!
Seriously though, I came from a running background (still slow for most runners) and would echo adding in more base miles. It took me 4 years to get a solid base where I could sub-2 a half. While that is slower than most of the people here, I did get faster over time and also discovered some major gait issues that are corrected now through drills and exercises.
Try adding in the miles and see how it goes. When I was just running, I did around 45-55 a week depending on what events were coming up. As it is now, I am probably around 25 or so to make time for family and other sports.
Monday: Swim
Tuesday: Bike 25 Miles, Run 3 miles easy
Wednesday: Swim, Run 6 miles @ tempo pace
Thursday: Bike 25 miles, Run 3 miles easy
Friday: Swim, Run 6 miles @ tempo pace
Saturday: Bike 40-60 miles, Run 3 miles easy
Sunday: Run 9 miles @ something between easy and tempo pace.
If you aren’t ready to do this on week one, then build up to it.
Good Luck
I like this - although I’d go even more extreme.
Drop all swims but one swim per week. Drop one of the bikes.
Increase the easy runs to 5-6 miles (build up to this), and swap out a tempo run for a interval session (VO2 type 400s-800s)
WIth your placements you should be mentally training pretty much as a pure runner. Your swim will take a minimal hit even at 1 day/wk since you’re FOP, and you can count on enough overlap of the run with the bike that your bike won’t suffer much as well. (An AG FOP runner can generally run themselves into an AG FOP bike split with very little cycling. Note this doesn’t apply to FFOP/podium/pro/elites.)
Of course, build up to this SLOWLY. Injuries are FAR more likel to derail you than the training run load.
I think you answered your own question. Look most triathletes run 3-5 miles for their average run distance and 3-4x per week. Neither is going to cut it to improve. You might as well just bike more, you would be just as likely to improve your running. The bottom line is unless you develop the run fitness you will never have the run fitness to finish strong especially as the distance goes from sprint to oly.
When you can get you average run into the 6-8 range, and your long run into the 10-13 mile range and you are running ~5x per week, then ask again. I wrote something on my blog yesterday to get you started if you care to read about this very topic.
Eric told me this last year that to be a better runner you must bike more. You still need to have those key runs throughout the week but the more comfortable you are on the bike the better you run. I have seen a huge improvement in my run this year and I would say it has to do with having a coach and then the amount of time I have put in on the bike.