How much weight can you pull with a cable machine?

Triathlon Forum
1

Upfront, I may be the weakest “pulller” in this thread. From a running/cycling background, 64yr, 6’ and 145lbs. 100s are at 2:00.

I started doing one arm cable pulls at the local gym to get a feel for a stronger pull than I was experiencing in the water. At first 10lbs was a noticeable pull compared to what I was doing in the water. Have worked up and pretty much plateaued at 20lbs in a 3x5 lifting scheme. On good days, 25lbs 3X5; yet, protecting my left shoulder and don’t want to press my luck.

So I’m only doing 20lbs 3X5 while standing and rotating the body some as if I were in the water.

How much weight can you pull with a cable machine?

Is this one of those things where the more you can pull, the faster you are in the water?

Ready to be amazed and dismayed.

2

Dunno. I don’t do those when I lift.

I just stick with basic, boring movements. Dumbbell press, rows, lat pulldowns, that kind of thing. It’s not necessary to emulate a swimming motion in the weight room. That’s what actual swimming is for.

3

Unless you’re a swimmer doing them under coached guidance so that you’re doing the pull in a swim-relevant manner, adding tons of strength in the cable pull won’t translate to faster swimming.

It’s not that different a scenario compared to someone who can do lots of pullups including heavy weighted pullups, yet doesn’t swim fast (and I’m not talking about someone with tons of water resistance, I’m talking a weaker pull in general.)

I’m small but I genetically have big lats, and without any training I can cable pull a lot, close to 300 lbs, which is a lot more than my body weight. I could probably even do more, but my grip/forearms are the limiter - if I used lifting straps, I’d bet I could do more.

Has no effect on my MOP swimming, though. You’d think my big lats would make me at least a sprint monster in the pool, but no such luck. I think the reality is that unless the rest of the muscles in your pull motion (rotator cuff, triceps, etc) can keep up the power chain, it doesn’t help to have one monster muscle in there, as the weakest muscle will limit the entire swim muscle chain.

I would be really surprised if Javier Gomez or Alistair Brownlee, who are FOP elite triathlon swimmers, could cable pull as much as me, but they swim nearly 2x my speed!

4

I’m small but I genetically have big lats, and without any training I can cable pull a lot, close to 300 lbs, which is a lot more than my body weight. I could probably even do more, but my grip/forearms are the limiter - if I used lifting straps, I’d bet I could do more.

I would be really surprised if Javier Gomez or Alistair Brownlee, who are FOP elite triathlon swimmers, could cable pull as much as me, but they swim nearly 2x my speed!

Wow - 300lb one arm standing cable pull. That’s ant like strength in my mind. Amazed.

5

I’m small but I genetically have big lats, and without any training I can cable pull a lot, close to 300 lbs, which is a lot more than my body weight. I could probably even do more, but my grip/forearms are the limiter - if I used lifting straps, I’d bet I could do more.

I would be really surprised if Javier Gomez or Alistair Brownlee, who are FOP elite triathlon swimmers, could cable pull as much as me, but they swim nearly 2x my speed!

Wow - 300lb one arm standing cable pull. That’s ant like strength in my mind. Amazed.

Doh - 300 lbs for double cable pull. Not one arm. Not amazed.

6

For a cable row? Done the whole stack before.

7

For a cable row? Done the whole stack before.

Whole stack. Standing. One arm replicating a swim pull. Amazing.

Dang, maybe a 100 in 2:00 isn’t terrible for me who is tested by 20lbs.

8

For a cable row? Done the whole stack before.

Whole stack. Standing. One arm replicating a swim pull. Amazing.

Dang, maybe a 100 in 2:00 isn’t terrible for me who is tested by 20lbs.

Now that I’ve completely read what you’re talking about…nope. But what you’re suggesting isn’t a normal gym move per se.

9

Dunno exactly…but, I’ve done a few tethered swims in my backyard pool with an elastic tether. At one point I got curious how much pull I was putting on the tether. So, I swam at different “paces” and marked how far I stretched the tether and measured that force.

At my 50y repeat pace (1:25 / 100y), I was pulling at 35-40 lbs.
At my 100y repeat pace (1:35 / 100y), I was pulling at 25-30 lbs.

I wouldn’t go so far as to say that’s exactly the same as it would be swimming free, but that’s the order of magnitude anyway.

So, if I were going to put that into sets/reps/weight terms I would say something like:

20 sets, 22 reps per arm, 40 lbs. (20s rest) = 20x50y repeats @ 42s
20 sets, 44 reps per arm, 30 lbs. (20s rest) = 20x100y repeats @ 1:35

As noted above this should be a very swim specific motion. Lean over, point your head at the cable pully, stretch your arms out over your head: catch-pull-underarm-recover, repeat. Its almost exactly what I do with my stretch chords on days I can’t get to the pool.

ETA: Swim specific means, same joint motions, same range of motion, same speed of pull, same frequency of pull. if somone looked at you sideways, you should look exactly like you are swimming. And your pull speed/frequency should look the same. My stroke rate is 57 spm at 100y pace, and is 61 spm at 50y pace, and is 65 spm at 25y pace. I use a metronome to set the pace I’m trying to emulate.

I also simulate 25y sprints with 50 lbs. 20x11(per arm) @ 50 lbs, 15s rest.

10

For a cable row? Done the whole stack before.

Whole stack. Standing. One arm replicating a swim pull. Amazing.

Dang, maybe a 100 in 2:00 isn’t terrible for me who is tested by 20lbs.

Now that I’ve completely read what you’re talking about…nope. But what you’re suggesting isn’t a normal gym move per se.

True. It isn’t a normal gym move. I wouldn’t suggest it to build muscle.

For me, it was a way to develop a feel for a freestyle “pull”. I think I was making the mistake of the elbow leading the pull as I swam (just like the elbow leads the arm backwards while running). So while it’s not a much weight, it feels like the weight helps me get a feel of “anchoring” the hand/arm while engaging the core and pull without the elbow leading backwards.

11

I asked Friel about “swim specific S&C” and he told me there wasn’t really much to do other than swim more.

12

For a cable row? Done the whole stack before.

Whole stack. Standing. One arm replicating a swim pull. Amazing.

Dang, maybe a 100 in 2:00 isn’t terrible for me who is tested by 20lbs.

Now that I’ve completely read what you’re talking about…nope. But what you’re suggesting isn’t a normal gym move per se.

True. It isn’t a normal gym move. I wouldn’t suggest it to build muscle.

For me, it was a way to develop a feel for a freestyle “pull”. I think I was making the mistake of the elbow leading the pull as I swam (just like the elbow leads the arm backwards while running). So while it’s not a much weight, it feels like the weight helps me get a feel of “anchoring” the hand/arm while engaging the core and pull without the elbow leading backwards.

You’d be better off using stretch cords and doing like 50 reps at a time.

13

Dunno exactly…but, I’ve done a few tethered swims in my backyard pool with an elastic tether. At one point I got curious how much pull I was putting on the tether. So, I swam at different “paces” and marked how far I stretched the tether and measured that force.

At my 50y repeat pace (1:25 / 100y), I was pulling at 35-40 lbs.
At my 100y repeat pace (1:35 / 100y), I was pulling at 25-30 lbs.

I wouldn’t go so far as to say that’s exactly the same as it would be swimming free, but that’s the order of magnitude anyway.

So, if I were going to put that into sets/reps/weight terms I would say something like:

20 sets, 22 reps per arm, 40 lbs. (20s rest) = 20x50y repeats @ 42s
20 sets, 44 reps per arm, 30 lbs. (20s rest) = 20x100y repeats @ 1:35

As noted above this should be a very swim specific motion. Lean over, point your head at the cable pully, stretch your arms out over your head: catch-pull-underarm-recover, repeat. Its almost exactly what I do with my stretch chords on days I can’t get to the pool.

ETA: Swim specific means, same joint motions, same range of motion, same speed of pull, same frequency of pull. if somone looked at you sideways, you should look exactly like you are swimming. And your pull speed/frequency should look the same. My stroke rate is 57 spm at 100y pace, and is 61 spm at 50y pace, and is 65 spm at 25y pace. I use a metronome to set the pace I’m trying to emulate.

I also simulate 25y sprints with 50 lbs. 20x11(per arm) @ 50 lbs, 15s rest.

Thank you Tom. I do try replicate a swim specific motion on the pull including some body roll by standing with or leaning over so that the catch position would feel like a free style catch. I don’t do a weighted overhead recovery though (maybe similar to a Vasa, I just let the weight return and then pull again).

What I miss with a stretch cord is the “anchor” feeling that a cable weight provides immediately at the point of “catch”.

So you are basically pulling at least 2X the weight for longer periods and faster compared to what I can safely manage for only 3X5 reps. And this is one of those things where I don’t think I could even pull 30lbs with a swim like motion even once with my good hand/arm.

Thank you for data that’s relevant to where I am at in comparison to much better swimmers.

14

3x5 / singles… 5 reps ~ 35

15

Dunno exactly…but, I’ve done a few tethered swims in my backyard pool with an elastic tether. At one point I got curious how much pull I was putting on the tether. So, I swam at different “paces” and marked how far I stretched the tether and measured that force.

At my 50y repeat pace (1:25 / 100y), I was pulling at 35-40 lbs.
At my 100y repeat pace (1:35 / 100y), I was pulling at 25-30 lbs.

I wouldn’t go so far as to say that’s exactly the same as it would be swimming free, but that’s the order of magnitude anyway.

So, if I were going to put that into sets/reps/weight terms I would say something like:

20 sets, 22 reps per arm, 40 lbs. (20s rest) = 20x50y repeats @ 42s
20 sets, 44 reps per arm, 30 lbs. (20s rest) = 20x100y repeats @ 1:35

As noted above this should be a very swim specific motion. Lean over, point your head at the cable pully, stretch your arms out over your head: catch-pull-underarm-recover, repeat. Its almost exactly what I do with my stretch chords on days I can’t get to the pool.

ETA: Swim specific means, same joint motions, same range of motion, same speed of pull, same frequency of pull. if somone looked at you sideways, you should look exactly like you are swimming. And your pull speed/frequency should look the same. My stroke rate is 57 spm at 100y pace, and is 61 spm at 50y pace, and is 65 spm at 25y pace. I use a metronome to set the pace I’m trying to emulate.

I also simulate 25y sprints with 50 lbs. 20x11(per arm) @ 50 lbs, 15s rest.

It occurred to me that I underestimated how much more weight you are moving.

2X what I am doing would just account for the weight on the tether.

Add 2X that amount would beause you are swimming. ( I did a tethered swim a few times and it felt twice as hard to me).

You probably catch, anchor and hold the water at 4X what I can manage. It might be even higher or you are also more efficient with the rest of your body through the water too.

This makes some sense. Not surprised that people have a pull that is 2-4 times stronger than mine.

16

“weight” on one machine versus another machine is meaningless. It’s like “speed” on a trainer. Different machines with different designs provide different mechanical advantages. I even own a machine with levers to change the number of pulleys utilized, changing the resistance by 50%.

17

“weight” on one machine versus another machine is meaningless. It’s like “speed” on a trainer. Different machines with different designs provide different mechanical advantages. I even own a machine with levers to change the number of pulleys utilized, changing the resistance by 50%.

Agree that machines can vary. Cable weights vary less so; yet, the pulleys can make a difference. At my gym, the cable weights are similar from station to station.

18

For a cable row? Done the whole stack before.

Whole stack. Standing. One arm replicating a swim pull. Amazing.

Dang, maybe a 100 in 2:00 isn’t terrible for me who is tested by 20lbs.

Now that I’ve completely read what you’re talking about…nope. But what you’re suggesting isn’t a normal gym move per se.

True. It isn’t a normal gym move. I wouldn’t suggest it to build muscle.

For me, it was a way to develop a feel for a freestyle “pull”. I think I was making the mistake of the elbow leading the pull as I swam (just like the elbow leads the arm backwards while running). So while it’s not a much weight, it feels like the weight helps me get a feel of “anchoring” the hand/arm while engaging the core and pull without the elbow leading backwards.

You’d be better off using stretch cords and doing like 50 reps at a time.

I read that Phelps can do 28 chin ups, that that would approximate pulling his body weight 28 times during a 100 fly. Pretty impressive given how “big” he is. 28x of your body weight for that exercise is pretty good.

19

I read that Phelps can do 28 chin ups, that that would approximate pulling his body weight 28 times during a 100 fly. Pretty impressive given how “big” he is. 28x of your body weight for that exercise is pretty good.

28 pullups isn’t all that impressive compared to his swimming ability.