A few older guys in my neighborhood ride P5X / P5s
How much time am I leaving on the table w my current bike vs the newer super bikes? Tried to search a bit and couldn’t find anything
I rarely race on my TT anymore (maybe 2 TTS a year?), so there’s that too… but I really want to be fast!
A few older guys in my neighborhood ride P5X / P5s
How much time am I leaving on the table w my current bike vs the newer super bikes? Tried to search a bit and couldn’t find anything
I rarely race on my TT anymore (maybe 2 TTS a year?), so there’s that too… but I really want to be fast!
Very little if anything. The P2 design has barely changed in 10 years. I know a few people that have gone from P2s to P5s and P5xs with very little improvements in performance.
maybe 1min per 40k
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1 min per 40k is quite meaningful
Are there things I can do to my p2 to close the gap?
handlebars, cable routing.
you would know better than me, but id question that.
i had some of my quickest races on a p2, shes a good lil bike!
1min per 40km, sounds like a guess…
well the p4 is about ~40s / 40k slower than the p5. so i’m extrapolating from that. it’s an educated guess, thanks very much. i’d say it’s pretty solid. do you have better input?
Curious how you determined the P5 is faster than the P4?
Jens says his P3C is faster than his P5. I suspect that there is little difference between any of them when optimal parts are used. 1 min in a 40k is ~6% total CdA difference, or ~.014m^2 or 140cm^2. That’s a lot for something that is all nice narrow airfoils. I doubt a frame alone is typically more than 300cm^2.
Jeez, you guys are all over me.
I am quoting Cervelos data from like… 2012? Jens has an optimized AF P3C I’m sure which is great for him. Doubt OP is in a similar boat with his P2 “classic.”
I know it’s all the rage these days to take old ass bikes that can barely brake ( a la P4 ) and spend all your time and energy making that fast but the simple fact is that the new platforms are generally faster for most people.
Here’s P4 vs P2 (and others) for your perusal
Jeez, you guys are all over me.
I am quoting Cervelos data from like… 2012? Jens has an optimized AF P3C I’m sure which is great for him. Doubt OP is in a similar boat with his P2 “classic.”
I know it’s all the rage these days to take old ass bikes that can barely brake ( a la P4 ) and spend all your time and energy making that fast but the simple fact is that the new platforms are generally faster for most people.
Here’s P4 vs P2 (and others) for your perusal
Jens also saves over an inch in Q on his P3, that is impossible on the P5. The one test I did was 80 grams on neg 6mm axles on P5.
I didn’t repeat because I always ride narrow, but it gives an idea.
Like you say optimized AF.
Maurice
Ok, while we’re on the subject how would a 2005 QR Lucero with ~2008 Zipp 808s compare to a decent modern mid range TT bike and wheels? I’d been assuming that since I had a decent position and had ticked off the basics (TT position, clean front end, internal cabling, deep rims, etc) then I wasn’t giving away too much, but if a P2 is giving up 1 minute over 40k I might need to rethink!
Only got back into TT and tri fairly recently after a long hiatus, hence the old equipment. My last TT I was 12 seconds off the podium in a 20km race, so this may be fairly relevant…
Thanks, not sure whether to be depressed at how much speed I’m giving away or happy at the thought of how much “free” speed is out there! Assuming my kit all qualifies as entry level/low end aero, seems there are a lot of potential gains out there.
Based on the photo (not much to go on) I saw of the 2005 QR Lucero, you may be giving up a minute or more. Clean up the cable routing, and good bars and fork might be a place to start.
Unless you are testing it’s tough to optimize. Have you picked all the other low hanging fruit?
Too bad you weren’t comparing a P2K with a P3C.
I just wondered. Lot’s of people saying the P4 (with good bars) and front brake is better than the P5 at low yaw. And I don’t think the P2C gives up nearly that much to the P4 with the same bars, wheels, etc. And Nick at Tririg set up a NP2 so it was quite a bit better than a P5. I believe the frame itself is a small factor (usually), compared to the other parts.
Have you picked all the other low hanging fruit?
Most of it I think. Good position with help from a fitter. Aero helmet (POC Cerebel so maybe not quite the best but works in a range of positions and I got a good deal on it). Snug fitting suit. Front end and cabling is as clean as I can get it. Hydration behind the seat, frame is clean. Zipp 808s (albeit old ones), latex tubes, Conti TT tires. Planning to pick up some aero socks/covers for TTs. Am sure there’s a few watts to be saved if I went full aero weenie, but can’t really justify spending big money on tunnel time or major upgrades like a new front end on such an old frame.
i think a well appointed p4 CAN be faster than a stock p5 at certain aspects and be a better fit for the type of athlete that wants that type of bike, so to speak.
that being said, the p5 can be set up with different bars and then be faster than stock. i have no data points on whether they would then be equal. i’d take a p5 over a p4 any day of the week, personally.
just using cervelos graph the p4 is worth what looks like 100+ grams over the p3c/p2.
A few older guys in my neighborhood ride P5X / P5s
I live in the wrong neighborhood then, that’s all I know.