Any thoughts on the value of a high end wetsuit for an average swimmer? It seems some of the features may be lost or even a determent to those with average or worse technique.
Thoughts/experience?
Cheers!
Define high-end.
Blue Seventy’s Helix is their top-tier suit, but it’s geared more at those with proper swim form (ie, neutral buoyancy).
You’ll get unreal shoulder flexibility, but not as much lower-half floatation. So what kind of swimmer are you, what sort of suit will benefit you?
Zoot’s Prophet, Huub’s 3:5 Archimedes, are their top-tier suits, and have a good bit of lower half float, but perhaps not quite as much shoulder flex.
So, as is often the case, the answer is it depends
Any thoughts on the value of a high end wetsuit for an average swimmer? It seems some of the features may be lost or even a determent to those with average or worse technique.
Thoughts/experience?
Cheers!
What features of a high end wetsuit are “lost” by an average swimmer? I don’t get that argument. The hands down best wetsuit I’ve EVER used is the B70 Helix, which is far and away the most flexible-shouldered suit I’ve ever worn. Those two factors frequently go hand in hand.
I would hesitate buying any full sleeve wetsuit that isn’t a top of the line suit, because what you pay for is higher quality rubbers and better panel design. I think.
I have to agree with the others. I’m a good swimmer - for a triathlete. The Helix made me faster than the Reaction. Considerably. There’s no reason I can think of why a swimmer of any ability wouldn’t be helped by increased flexibility and range of motion. Just take a Reaction and a Helix (or equivalent from other brands) and turn them inside-out. That should make it pretty obvious immediately.
Huub Archimedes 4:4
Blueseventy axis
Nineteen rogue
Blueseventy is the top of the food chain. However, Huub is quickly moving towards the top. A few more tweaks to their design and they will be the suit to beat.
I don’t think any features of a high end suit are “lost” on an average swimmer, but I don’t think the swimmer will benefit as much as some other over looked things.
For the average swimmer, the biggest free speed is getting the best fitting suit. I don’t think most average swimmers get their suit in the right position nor tight enough. They opt for comfort over function.
They, lol, I mean we. I’m average. I love the b70 helix, but I realize I can get some help from other suits. I’m currently plaing with the nineteen rogue, but I’m really looking forward to huub’s designs. Very cool stuff coming up.
I wish zoot would make a reverse zipper and a 1.5 mm thick arm/shoulder. Zoot is so close, just wish they would take the next big leap. They are such innovators with shoes and tri suits. I hope they do the same with their wetsuits.
Other peoples experience can only take you so far.
No wetsuit is going to fit you like it fits anyone else.
Once you’ve tried a few suits on, you should be able to define the characteristics that define “value”.
A high end suit is going to:
-Be very flexible in the upper body
-Use a softer neoprene
-Likely offer some type of core support (not necessarily external the Phantom has)
-Fit a little bit on the slimmer side
-Fit you very tight.
…
There are several suits out there at a high level. I recommend trying some suits on. Find what fits you best.
Value being a relative term, a high end wetsuit is definitely a value performance wise if it fits properly.
I don’t think that any characteristics would be lost on an average swimmer.
The only detriment I could imagine, is if the wetsuit doesn’t fit you properly, or you don’t put it on correctly.
What are you swimming in currently?
What is considered an “average swimmer”?
I’ll throw the Phantom in on this conversation. But still recommend trying some other suits on.
jake
Same value as a high end bike for an average cyclist.
To illustrate the issue…
Orca has two high end wetsuits. 3.8 and Alpha. Both cost $650. Both have awesome flexibility. Almost like wearing no wetsuit. The 3.8 has more buoyancy to fix the body position. In other words, it helps the poor swimmers. The Alpha is thinner and offers less boyancy and is supposed to help better swimmers. Both are high end and you’d never know 3.8 were considered a “thick/buoyant” wetsuit if you tried one on.
So be careful what you buy. High end may not always mean thinner neoprene, and low/mid range may not always mean a 5mm inflexible exoskeleton all around you.
I just ordered a two pieces DeSoto wetsuit. I heard good things about this wetsuit to have less restriction around the shoulder area
I ended up getting a great deal on an Aquaman ART. I’m an average swimmer, but I have bad shoulders and you can hardly tell you have that suit on. The main selling point is how quick the suit comes off. . .in short distance stuff that will be invaluable.
Same value as a high end bike for an average cyclist.
Probably even less since you’re only in the water for a fraction of the time you’re on the bike.
You will love the T1!
I’m a huge fan of the DeSoto T1 First Wave setup. Used to have the DeSoto Black Pearl, which is a bit cheaper, but not as flexible. The First Wave has really supple neoprene, plenty of flexibility and the return policy rocks. High recommendations from someone who has been wearing wetsuits for nearly 34 years!
I’d like to think I am a back of the front of the back swimmer. Racing in the 5:30’s for a 500y free. IM swim around 52-56.
This past year I got the new HUUB Arch 4:4 and I love it! My only real comparison to an older B70 helix came in June and in a half mile swim I was a good 20 seconds faster with equal or less training than I’d done in the past (new baby!) and I had no one near me in that race.
Their 3:5/4:4 option is great if you are a “floater” or a “sinker”. Highly recommended with one complaint. The thin areas of the suit are VERY thin and can tear pretty easily. It’s a pro that it’s not too thick in those spots, but it does make it possible to tear.
For an average swimmer, I think it’s reasonable to consider the amount of shoulder flexibility in a high-end or low-end wetsuit.
From experience, as I would consider myself an above average swimmer, shoulder flexibility in a suit is very important in minimizing fatigue during a race. I have noticed that my stroke falls apart when there is less flexibility and more constriction. I think the ability to hold and pull more water is catered by more flexibility in the shoulders because proper form is likely to be maintained. More constriction will likely cater to a windmill-type stroke.
I have tried both the new Blue Seventy Helix and the Zoot Prophet wetsuit and notice a big difference in shoulder flexibility between the two. The Helix had much more flexibility than the Prophet, even though both are considered high-end wetsuits. For my stroke, if I could choose a suit, the Helix would work best because I do not have a straight arm recovery/pull or a high stroke rate.
If you are not looking to spend money on a high-end wetsuit, look for cheaper suits with more flexibility in the shoulders. From what I have seen, the thickness of a suit will increase in the higher-end market, which will aid in buoyancy, but in my opinion, you’re better off training harder than spending extra money on features that won’t make drastic differences in your swimming times. Something else I’ve noticed is that wetsuits won’t help average swimmers as much as very poor swimmers, technique wise. Someone with a terrible stroke and a very high level of aerobic fitness can sometimes swim just as fast as a swimmer with superior technique, especially if they are wearing the same wetsuit. I think this is because of the buoyancy in wetsuits changing body position in the water, which will have more positive changes in someone with usually very poor body position (without a wetsuit).
I am a very average swimmer (2:00/100m on a goooood day 
and the High end wetsuit I got for real cheap (2XU Project X1 for $250) helps a lot. Buoyancy-wise it is clear right away and the arm panels help scoop more and easily.
On a tough swim (for me) like IMFL it was useful. My second lap was slower but I did not have to dig deep too much (and I did not…) thanks to this very good suit.
More flexibility on the shoulders is greatly appreciated but put it on before you buy. 2XU velcro placement is questionable and makes a big mess of my neck every single time (got infected this time… ).
On a quiet lake OWS without contact nor drafting it is a 10 sec gain for me. With the wetsuit on, I slow down and relax so my time remains the same…
Bike investment might indeed bring more results and time gains as you will spend a fair bit of time on it and can make up for a slow swim (in part…)
Thanks, I think this is where I need to research as I wrongly assumed that high-end entailed less buoyancy (thinner/lighter more flexible material). I got a chance to trial a TYR Freak of Nature and I thought the shoulder flexibility was great, but I believe I was actually slower because of lower hip position. Likely just the features of this particular suit.
Sounds like I need to shop for the suit with good flexibility and higher buoyancy for the hips ala the 3.8, without respect to the price. Spending $600 for a wetsuit is still a big pill to swallow.
Cheers!
The buoyancy vs thinner material in a high end suit is a trade off.
You get thinner material in the arms and shoulders. In most high end suits you will still find a 5mm panel down the front of the suit. Likewise this panel will in most cases wrap around the hips. (the Phantom offers this).
There will also be some high end suits that offer buoyancy displacement. Aka, thinner material in upper body, and thicker panels elsewhere.
If you are searching for a suit that will help keep you planed out on top of the water, you are looking for something with 5mm in the front of the suit.
Shoulder flexibility does come from thinner material in the shoulders, but it also comes from what you pull against when you are in the reach phase of your stroke. In high end suits especially, you will see this addressed. Whether it be the ROM zones, TST panels, Bio Stretch zone, or something else that helps to minimize the restriction of a simple motion of raising your arm (or reaching in your swim stroke). Much of the restriction is caused by pulling against thicker material in the back of the suit. These solutions will make the suit more flexible.
In addition to this, you will see some items that help keep water out, and make the suit easier to get out of.
Understandably, a $600+ wetsuit is a tough pill to swallow, but I also believe that people under estimate the value of a strong swim in a triathlon. Much of that swim can depend on how your wetsuit performs while you are exerting yourself.
Don’t just consider it a faster swim, but also consider a less taxing swim that allows you to come out of the water less fatigued.
Also consider that some mid level suits offer a very good performing suit at a lower cost.
jake
Thanks Jake,
I need to research suits and swim more…a lot more!
Any recommendations on a suit with better than average hip buoyancy and shoulder flexibility?
Cheers!
Ive had most of the top wetsuit brands, nothing comes close to the huub in terms of flexibility, durability and comfort.