I’m curious as to what y’alls favorite (and by favorite, I don’t mean least painful… but we’re hard core here right?!) track workouts… in season and out of season… Obviously it’s fall now and people are getting ready for 10ks, half marathons, marathons…etc… and then eventually for tri season.
Here’s mine… the good ole standby that hurts like hades!
All done as hard as can be done and finish the workout…much faster than 5k race pace (my basic times are in to the side )
2.25 mile warm up (we have a warm up route)
1.25 mile (800 jog) 7:40
mile (800 jog) 6:10-6:15
1200 (400 jog) 4:15-4:30 (depends on how hard that 1.25 & mile are!)
800 (200-400 jog) 3:00-3:05
400 (200 jog) 1:23-1:28
4 x 200 with 200 jog :37ish
For triathlon training my favorite track workout was when younger
2 mile warmup
12-16 x 400 in 75 second with a 45 second 200 as recovery this was a fast tempo.
Now in my mid 50’s I do a lot of tempo based stuff or cruise intervals such as 10-12x1 minute slightly faster than tempo with 1 minute float which is slower than tempo. It again is tempo but toggles the speed workout.
After 40 years as a runner I can’t do pure track work anymore without injury but tempos keep me fast. I do strides once or twice per week as well.
For Triathlon Tempo based training is the way to go. 20-60 minutes of tempo. It does not have to be straight tempos but broken up. This also will be close to what you will run off the bike. My tempos are real close to my triathlon race pace.
12 (or whatever number you like)x 400m alternating between overspeed, and target 10k race pace. 1 minute rest between 400s. So example…90 second 400/1min break/75 second 400/break. Catches up after a while.
400 on 1:29, walk 50-75 meters, 325-350 on 1:45
400 on 1:28, walk 50-75 meters, 325-350 on 1:45
400 on 1:27, walk 50-75 meters, 325-350 on 1:45
400 on 1:28, walk 50-75 meters, 325-350 on 1:45
mile on 6:25, jog 800
400 on 1:32, walk 50-75 meters, 325-350 on 1:45
400 on 1:29, walk 50-75 meters, 325-350 on 1:45
400 on 1:29, walk 50-75 meters, 325-350 on 1:45
400 on 1:29, walk 50-75 meters, 325-350 on 1:45
So your having back to back hard workouts? Or is tempo not really considered a hard workout, but the way you mention the tempo run suggests that that is also a hard workout? When is the recovery run?
Sprint:
The Newton
2 mile wmup
4 sets of 6x200
45 second rest in the first set
30 second rest in the second set
20 second rest in the 3rd set
10 second rest in the 4th set
2 mile cooldn
Olympic
2 mile wmup
4 -5 sets of 200/400/800/200 all at mile race pace (200 rest between reps…400 jog between sets)
2 mile cooldn
IM
2 mile wmup
4 to 6 sets of 1000/2000/1000 at 10k race pace (400 rest between everything)
2 mile cooldn
.
The basic gist is “speedwork” (taking about 1.5K - 3K race pace stuff) is really meant for 800m - 5,000m racing. The bulk of workouts for 800m-1,500m will be speed, while smaller portions are useful for 3,000m - 5,000m racing. For the 10K and up, only the tiniest amounts are necessary, especially if you are running under 50 miles a week and over 30 minutes for a 10K.
Having said that, all of my favorite workouts are really more tempo/threshold based.
Bread and butter workouts (for 10K-40K & Sprints - HIM):
tempos of 20-60 minutes in length (1hr - 2hr race pace, or 10 mile to 18 mile race pace in my case).
1600m cruise intervals at 1hr race pace with 1 minute jogs
1500m at 45 minute race pace w/300m recovery
Re- OP (now that I’m finished preaching):
My favorite are 80/100s. This is an 80 sec 1/4 followed by a 100 sec 1/4 with no rest. Repeat until you can’t.
What this really is is a 1/4 at 5K race pace followed by a 1/4 20 sec slower. It’s really a tempo workout, but allows you to dip down close to V02max efforts, but for short enough periods that you can sustain the workout. I like using this as a fitness test. Out of shape I might only be able to do 2-3 miles. In shape I can go much further.
I have 3 favorites: #1
1.5 mile warm up
2x400, 2x800, 2x400, 2x800
1 mi ez
#2
1 mi warm up
1x400 to get average 400 pace
400/500/600/800
800/600/500/400
2x400 all out
#3 for Ironman/marathon training.
1 mi w/up
400m
5x3000 (200 jog recovery) at half-marathon pace
1 mi c/d
I love track workouts but we have the hardest time getting onto the HS tracks around here, especially with football just now. I have done my last few track workouts on the street, for easiness I run 3200’s instead of 3000 and just use my Garmin.
The basic gist is “speedwork” (taking about 1.5K - 3K race pace stuff) is really meant for 800m - 5,000m racing. The bulk of workouts for 800m-1,500m will be speed, while smaller portions are useful for 3,000m - 5,000m racing. For the 10K and up, only the tiniest amounts are necessary, especially if you are running under 50 miles a week and over 30 minutes for a 10K.
I would disagree in that speedwork is essential to set yourself up for those (more important) threshold workouts. Especially for the younger people who do not have a running background but could potentially be front of the pack AGers or even pros. If I want to lower my threshold from 6min/mile → to 5 min/mile, I could run loads of tempos, but I could also set up those workouts with a disciplined approach to speed training (k repeats, 800s, etc.)
Here are a few we do that I always feel I get the most out of. This is purely subjective. Note: the terminology I use here for paces is Daniels terminology (i.e. “repeat”, “threshold”, “interval” paces). Note also that these are workouts given mostly to people who are just running, not doing triathlon. I am not sure how (or if) you would adjust these for triathletes. They all work better when you are running a big diet of easy mileage.
A: A good heart-of-marathon training workout. Very tough and best when you are running a lot of miles: This workout consists of running anywhere from 3 to 9 miles continous on the track, depending upon average weekly running mileage (or 3 to 9 times 1600 meters – the difference isn’t that important for this workout). Alternate your speed every 800 meters between marathon goal pace and threshold pace. We got this workout from Russian runner Tatyana Podznyakova: http://runningtimes.com/....aspx?ArticleID=5363
B: A good multi-pace workout during a buildup to middle distance races - 10k to half marathon: 3 to 4 x 1600 meters with 2:30 - 3:00 rests (depending upon speed. Slower 1600 runners take more rest). Run laps 1 and 2 at threshold pace. Run lap 3 at repeat pace. For lap 4, return to threshold pace. Returning to threshold pace is really tough. I love this workout because you need discipline and it gets you used to drastically switching gears mid-race.
C: A great Tuesday-before-the-marathon workout. Perfect workout for taper week: 4800 meters (6 x 800) continuous on the track. Start off running at your goal marathon pace for the first 800 meters. Then run each successive 800 four seconds faster than the previous one. Got this one from Lou Ristaino, an excellent local runner here in Boston. I’ve been using it for years. It always leaves me feeling just right during taper.
I also agree with Barry on “speedwork” being overrated for triathletes…
That’s why the workouts I listed were not really speedwork…but, strength and tempo changing workouts…
Even the Newton (just 24x200) isn’t really speedwork…You will feel like you have done a 5000 meter time trial when you are done…there is vanishingly little recovery in this workout.
I come from a running background (30:06 and 14:12 on the track)
A “real” speed session has almost full recovery between sets and a good bit between reps.
I was told once by a guy named Jon Sinclair (one of the top US road racers in the 80s) that the big problem with most runners is that they don’t go easy enough on easy days…or hard enough on hard days.
During a running camp that he was a speaker in, I watched him do these sessions:
4 mile wmup
4 sets of 800/1600 (jog to full recovery - under 100bpm or easy ability to talk casually - between everything)
2:07/4:21 - 2:04/4:18 - 2:01/4:13 - 1:57/4:05
4 mile cooldn
That was a Tuesday…On Thursday he did:
3x4800 with 400 recovery in 14:25, 14:12, 13:58
He won Peachtree and Bloomsday that year I think.
He couldn’t swim or ride though
Triathletes need strength…same interval sessions with slower speeds (relative to their maximum) and less recovery than runners.
to Kev train’s point…AG racing and ITU pro racing are 2 different things…
To jump off the bike and go 30 flat…you better put in the running speedwork to go 28:30 - 29 minutes on the track.
An AGer going 38 minutes off the bike is a very different animal…strength, strength, strength.
Here’s how I think about it:
Running a front AG time requires strength
Strength is obtained (mainly) by threshold running
Threshold running is best maximized by supplemental speed work.
I do agree with you that running a 10km off the bike is mainly a strength run, as is a 10km on the track (just ask Bekele), but my main point is that these top guys (say Bennett, Potts, Whitfield, Reed, many etc.) MAXIMIZE their threshold workouts by making sure their speed is there, too.
Even Ryan Hall mentioned it in his Flotrack Workout. He was doing 800 meter repeats getting ready for a half marathon and eventually a marthon. Afterwards he said that he likes these workouts b/c they set up his tempos, not because he’ll need to run a 2:00 800 during NY.
I also don’t want to use ITU guys as references, because most (or all) of the top guys have significant runing backgrounds.
I would disagree in that speedwork is essential to set yourself up for those (more important) threshold workouts. Especially for the younger people who do not have a running background but could potentially be front of the pack AGers or even pros. If I want to lower my threshold from 6min/mile → to 5 min/mile, I could run loads of tempos, but I could also set up those workouts with a disciplined approach to speed training (k repeats, 800s, etc.)
I don’t necessarily disagree with you. However, I find that many triathletes over emphasize speed. I’m not sure if you read the link I provided, but I eloborate a little more in the other thread.
As an example, I’m training for a 10 miler in May. 12 weeks out I plan to run 3-4 workouts of V02max intervals to “set myself up” for the race specific tempo workouts in the last 8 weeks. The key, however, is that they will be conservative.
The difference here is that I intend to race at 5:20-5:30 pace. The workouts will be in the range of 4-6K @ 5:00-5:10 pace.
Where I see people go wrong is that I feel they take it to an extreme. Assume that I am the same exact person training for the same exact race. As a typical triathlete I might be inclined to run 20x400 at 68-70 sec with 400 jog recoveries each week for the last 12 weeks. That’s just plain over kill for a race that is going to be at 5:20-5:30 pace.
To futher clarify (also covered in the link), as ridiculous as the above may seem, it is the equivalent of what a lot of people do, except that they don’t think they are over doing it @ 10x400 in 90. However, that same person is running half the weekly mileage that I do and their mile race pace is 20sec slower a mile than mine is. So that 10x400@90 is just as much over kill as 20x400 @ 69 would be for me.
I would disagree in that speedwork is essential to set yourself up for those (more important) threshold workouts. Especially for the younger people who do not have a running background but could potentially be front of the pack AGers or even pros. If I want to lower my threshold from 6min/mile → to 5 min/mile, I could run loads of tempos, but I could also set up those workouts with a disciplined approach to speed training (k repeats, 800s, etc.)
However, I find that many triathletes over emphasize speed. *
Definitely agree
As an example, I’m training for a 10 miler in May. 12 weeks out I plan to run 3-4 workouts of V02max intervals to “set myself up” for the race specific tempo workouts in the last 8 weeks. The key, however, is that they will be conservative.
The difference here is that I intend to race at 5:20-5:30 pace. The workouts will be in the range of 4-6K @ 5:00-5:10 pace.
Yes, I think we’re on the same page. I running Philly Half Marathon in November and I plan to ONLY run progression runs and a tempo every other week (plus striders regularly). Doing any speed work would improve training only by a small percent, not to mention run tangent to the main purpose of off-season training.
For triathletes, frankly the brick is the most crucial workout of the week…and it should be strength over speed here as well…in addition to repetition.
I ran that race last year. Nice course…cold, but nice.
Be careful as the mile markers were way off last year. Look for a winged foot painted on the ground in the middle of the road. Those are the actual marks. The clocks were in teh wrong spots last year.
Good luck. My 10 miler is going to be Broad Street.
more of an unintentional tempo run! Started talking with a friend and then we look at the watch…woops! Not far…only 5 miles…not like a 10 mile tempo run.
Not sure I buy that. Experience from watching my husband who was coached by John McDonnell and our other sub 2:20 marathoners in Birmingham. For some it may not be helpful, but I tell ya what…by doing speedwork I saw my times from 5k to half marathon drop significantly…esp off the bike. Cumulative effect…yes, partially, but not completely.
there are always more than one school of thought for everything…
oh…and as far as off the bike…
Hubby who barely trained last year, ran a 35:30 off the bike @ Chattanooga… fastest 10k of the day.
He was also a road 5k pr of 14:03; 13 something on the track, and was a 4:02 miler, 1:08 1/2 marathoner… he was 34 when he did that. Yes, I am proud of him.
