I need to buy some new tires, and was thinking of just moving the GP 4000s from my race wheels to my road bike and pick something else up for the tri bike.
Looking here it looks like the Grand Prix has the best rolling resistance but I can’t find anything on if they’re as aero as a brick or not. Is there any info out there on these now or should I just go with the turbo cottons. They’ll be for an 808 and super 9. I mostly do sprint/olympic so puncture resistance/wear isn’t that big of a deal for me.
I use a 23c GP TTs on my super 9 and 808. It passes the eyeball aero test for sure and apparently rolls really well. Never got around to field testing for aero, but don’t think I am leaving much on the table at all. I am waiting to see aero/Crr tests of the vittoria corsa speed before considering any change.
I need to buy some new tires, and was thinking of just moving the GP 4000s from my race wheels to my road bike and pick something else up for the tri bike.
Looking here it looks like the Grand Prix has the best rolling resistance but I can’t find anything on if they’re as aero as a brick or not. Is there any info out there on these now or should I just go with the turbo cottons. They’ll be for an 808 and super 9. I mostly do sprint/olympic so puncture resistance/wear isn’t that big of a deal for me.
We discussed this a while back on another thread. That Grand Prix TT is a 25mm and you can’t find it anywhere. Based on Flo’s aero data and Tom’s tire testing, it just doesn’t seem like we should go with anything else when we care about going the absolute fastest and that would be with the 23mm Supersonic. Now someone will argue the 20mm could be faster, but in practice, all things considered, and assuming wide rims, that is my recommendation.
I was running the 20SS as they tested pretty fast for me, but swapped them in favor of an attack due to my last Time Trial’s rough surface. The ride was so much better that I decided to move to the 23 and now have that paired that with the same bonty 9D3 that I was using the 20 on. I am hoping there isn’t an aero hit and is something I will be testing when I hit the tunnel sometime this summer. Also hoping to pick up some CRR over the 20 and with my choice to move from the butyl Ironman to the Zipp Speed SL 27.
Only problem is you can’t (at least that I’ve found - online and otherwise) get a 23 SS.
I asked the LBS if they could order them and this was the response:
I got more info on the tires:
H2 (supplier that brings them in for the US) does not import the GP Supersonic. The closest swap for your customer is the Grand Prix TT. We have it in a 700 x 23 right now if you want to check it out. (C1026125)
700 x 25 the earliest will be in July but could be longer
I got a couple of the 23TT to use for now, we really need someone to test this tire.
Only problem is you can’t (at least that I’ve found - online and otherwise) get a 23 SS.
I asked the LBS if they could order them and this was the response:
I got more info on the tires:
H2 (supplier that brings them in for the US) does not import the GP Supersonic. The closest swap for your customer is the Grand Prix TT. We have it in a 700 x 23 right now if you want to check it out. (C1026125)
700 x 25 the earliest will be in July but could be longer
I got a couple of the 23TT to use for now, we really need someone to test this tire.
I have been asking this question for years and have considered sending the tire to Tom A but I already know the Supersonic rolls faster and would prefer to roll that. I realize that the American distributor doesn’t import that Supersonic. I having working with Trisports for years but they can’t carry it. It is unfortunate but I really do want the tire to continue to exist and to have people go as fast as possible. I have had to buy mine from overseas. Hate to do it, but it is the only place to get it.
23mm SS front and rear? I was thinking 23mm SS front (Flo 60) and a 24mm Turbo Cotton rear (Renn 555 disc) - for better crr and durability. However, I don’t know how the 24mm Turbo Cotton pairs with a Renn 555 disc. Thoughts?
23mm SS front and rear? I was thinking 23mm SS front (Flo 60) and a 24mm Turbo Cotton rear (Renn 555 disc) - for better crr and durability. However, I don’t know how the 24mm Turbo Cotton pairs with a Renn 555 disc. Thoughts?
What exactly are you referring to when you say durability? The SS has shown to have similar RR to the 24mm Turbo and to be far more aero. I personally wouldn’t go with the Turbon Cotton. As for the Renn disc, I am not well informed on that disc but as I understand it is only 21mm at the brake track. This doesn’t sound like the new age wider rim wheels in which case the narrower the tire the better in terms of aero.
23mm SS front and rear? I was thinking 23mm SS front (Flo 60) and a 24mm Turbo Cotton rear (Renn 555 disc) - for better crr and durability. However, I don’t know how the 24mm Turbo Cotton pairs with a Renn 555 disc. Thoughts?
What exactly are you referring to when you say durability? The SS has shown to have similar RR to the 24mm Turbo and to be far more aero. I personally wouldn’t go with the Turbon Cotton. As for the Renn disc, I am not well informed on that disc but as I understand it is only 21mm at the brake track. This doesn’t sound like the new age wider rim wheels in which case the narrower the tire the better in terms of aero.
By durability I mean a tire that’s less prone to flats and secondarily will wear out less fast than the SS.
By being projected by the frame, I’m thinking the rear tire does not need the aero properties of the front tire. Thus was my thinking for a Turbo Cotton on the rear vs a SS. However, the Renn disc is narrow, and a 23mm SS tire would probably fit better on the disc than a 24mm Turbo Cotton.
23mm SS front and rear? I was thinking 23mm SS front (Flo 60) and a 24mm Turbo Cotton rear (Renn 555 disc) - for better crr and durability. However, I don’t know how the 24mm Turbo Cotton pairs with a Renn 555 disc. Thoughts?
What exactly are you referring to when you say durability? The SS has shown to have similar RR to the 24mm Turbo and to be far more aero. I personally wouldn’t go with the Turbon Cotton. As for the Renn disc, I am not well informed on that disc but as I understand it is only 21mm at the brake track. This doesn’t sound like the new age wider rim wheels in which case the narrower the tire the better in terms of aero.
By durability I mean a tire that’s less prone to flats and secondarily will wear out less fast than the SS.
By being projected by the frame, I’m thinking the rear tire does not need the aero properties of the front tire. Thus was my thinking for a Turbo Cotton on the rear vs a SS. However, the Renn disc is narrow, and a 23mm SS tire would probably fit better on the disc than a 24mm Turbo Cotton.
Josh (Silca formerly Zipp) has discussed on here how the trailing edge of a tire is still important even if shielded. Sure, not as much as front matters but aero still matters. The SS is far lighter and maybe be more durable from flats than the cotton that is debatable. As far as wear out goes. I am not sure how many miles one gets out of turbo cotton, but I will say the wear properties of the SS keep two things going for you. First, it ensures you have fresh rubber, rubber that is not nicked or has embedded glass shards that people don’t see that eventually work there way into the tire and cause flats. Second, they are more aero because as a tire wears it becomes less aero.
Force on rear - nervous about road conditions/ flats
23mm SS on rear - when I want to be the fastest I can be
SS in 23 can easily be found at Wiggle or other UK online bike shops. I have no idea why people say they have trouble finding a 23.
People in the US don’t like the idea or don’t know they can order from overseas. They simply can’t find them in the US from their local LBS or online bike shops in the US.
Force on rear - nervous about road conditions/ flats
23mm SS on rear - when I want to be the fastest I can be
SS in 23 can easily be found at Wiggle or other UK online bike shops. I have no idea why people say they have trouble finding a 23.
People in the US don’t like the idea or don’t know they can order from overseas. They simply can’t find them in the US from their local LBS or online bike shops in the US.
So its still 2002 in some parts of the US? : )
Have had orders from PBK/ Ribble/ Wiggle get to me faster than Trisports!
For only 1-2 watts difference, I would get the Specialized S-Works Turbo. They are on sale buy one get one free, I just got four tires, free shipping for $110 plus taxes. That is a great deal to me.
For only 1-2 watts difference, I would get the Specialized S-Works Turbo. They are on sale buy one get one free, I just got four tires, free shipping for $110 plus taxes. That is a great deal to me.
The one or two watts difference is between the Turbo and the GP4000SII, not the SS.
For only 1-2 watts difference, I would get the Specialized S-Works Turbo. They are on sale buy one get one free, I just got four tires, free shipping for $110 plus taxes. That is a great deal to me.
By my calc for two tires that is 7 watts (just in RR), and that isn’t even using the Supersonic which is faster RR wise, more aero, and ligther (100 grams) that the Turbo. You can get 3x supersonics for that price too any day of the week, sale or no sale.