Grad school options/help: chiro/pa/exercise phys

I’m going to be graduating next year with a degree in kinesiolgy-exercise/movement sci from uw-madison. I’ve been looking into chiropractic schools as well as weighing my other options. I’d like to stick with a more science based chiropractic school. I’ve been looking into national chiro as well as recently bridgeport since my gf is going to be going to school at harvard and its closer. Unfortunately i know nothing about the area (Conn as well as bridgeport) and haven’t found much on biking/training in that general area. I’d also be interested in other suggestions for grad programs. Does anyone have any opinion on bridgeports program? I’d also entertain getting an advanced degree in exercise physiology since i really enjoy it, but it seems difficult to find a decent paying job in the field. Any rec. on schools out towards boston area for exercise phys? Any help or suggestions would be appreciated, just no chiro-bashing!
Thanks

I’m going to be graduating next year with a degree in kinesiolgy-exercise/movement sci from uw-madison. I’ve been looking into chiropractic schools as well as weighing my other options. I’d like to stick with a more science based chiropractic school. I’ve been looking into national chiro as well as recently bridgeport since my gf is going to be going to school at harvard and its closer. Unfortunately i know nothing about the area (Conn as well as bridgeport) and haven’t found much on biking/training in that general area. I’d also be interested in other suggestions for grad programs. Does anyone have any opinion on bridgeports program? I’d also entertain getting an advanced degree in exercise physiology since i really enjoy it, but it seems difficult to find a decent paying job in the field. Any rec. on schools out towards boston area for exercise phys? Any help or suggestions would be appreciated, just no chiro-bashing!
Thanks
Personally, I’d go with a good PA program. I think there are a lot more options as far as sub specializing if you want to, and if you get hooked up with a good doc, then you can do pretty much anything they do. With the exercise kine, ASU has pretty much almost abandoned the masters part of the program and you go straight into doctoral work, and then unless you get a good break, you’re almost certainly limited to clinical/teaching paths. Chiro, well, you said no bashing so I won’t give you my opinion of chiropracty. :smiley:

John

Tufts has a good ex phys dept. Not sure how their grad programs work. Dr. Roger Fielding does some good stuff there.

If you want a scientific DC program, I would stongly consider Western States Chiropractic College in Portland, OR. I know it’s a long ways away form Harvard, but you will get a great education! (I am a 1992 grad from WSCC). Being a chiropractor is very rewarding and you can specialize in many different areas, ie. Sports, nutrition, wellness…

I don’t have any info on Bridgeport other than it is fairly new. NorthWestern is also very scientificly based. Hope this helps and good luck.

I’ve been a chiropractor for 26 yrs and am slowly retiring myself out of it over the next year or two, having involved myself in a couple of other fields. I graduated from Canadian Memorial Chiropractic College which was one of the better colleges which gave us a fairly sound scientific cirriculum. I know National is one of the better colleges and U of B is a recognized university which offers a lot of other other degrees/diplomas which make it rather unique for a chiro college since most are stand alone institutions.

The 80’s was a “golden age” for chiropracitic because generous insurance reimbursement almost made a chiropractic degree a license to print money. However, that has changed. The problems chiropractic now faces are an over supply of practitionors, competition from PT’s, massage therapists, accupuncturists, etc whose numbers are also growing. The biggest challenge will be insurance reimbursement as that is an ongoing battle. If anything, chiropractors have actually been losing % market share in the last few years.

The frustration of being a chiropractor, especially if of a scientific mindset, is that you always feel like you’re an outsider from the big picture of the health care system, always a bit excluded from the mainstream. Nobody in the general population seems to be indifferent to chiropractors, they either love you or think you’re a quack, even if they’ve never been to a chiro.

If you want some more thoughts on chiropractic feel free to PM me.

UMASS Amherst - for ex. physiology/Kinesiology
Springfield College - for PA and ex. physiology, google Peter Karpovich :wink:

Both colleges are in western mass and about 1.5 hours from Boston. And they have some of the best ex phys/pa programs in the country.

Have you shadowed any of your respective graduate options or worked as a ugsr in the ex. phys dept?

Are you going after lifestyle, $$$, intellectual challenges, all?

UConn Storrs has the #1 ranked kines. program in the country. Look into it:

http://www.education.uconn.edu/departments/ekin/

Also, there is no shortage of roads and trails for training.

An exercise physiology degree will not necessarily land you a job. As you have probably found out already, a BA or MS in exercise phys does not really do much for you as far as jobs are concerned. It can help with credibility if you want to be a personal trainer, coach, or want to work in the health club industry. There are some jobs like strength coach or athletic trainer that you can get with a specialized degree but they don’t pay much. At the PhD level, you are looking at teaching and research. That is about it. I think BY FAR your best option is PA. I personally know at least 5 ex chiropractors in their 30s who are now doing something else. One of them is my brother. It is very hard to make a living in that business nowadays.

Mike

i unfortunately haven’t had enough time to shadow any of the positions appropriately. i will be working with my exercise physiology professor this summer in his lab as my practicum in order to graduate. My only issue with PA school is that i believe you need a large amount of patient contact hours in order to even apply. i wont have very much time this coming year to be able to get a job to get contact hours since i will be managing the swim team here. A perk to that though is the coach got his masters in exercise phys! Thanks everybody for you input so far!

Check to see if the department can plug you into a clinical job. Kines/Ex. Phys dept. usually have contacts with local hospitals and cardiac rehab usually has a few students from Kinesiology doing their senior internships, could be a good way to get hours and credits at the same time.

Keau

“I personally know at least 5 ex chiropractors in their 30s who are now doing something else”

I think that’s happening much more now. It’s mostly due to the declining insurance reimbursement and increasing overheads. My practice is less than it was even five years ago but fortunately I’m at an age and stage in life where I would want to cut back anyways, but never suspected that would be done for me by market conditions. There are still some chiros making really good money, but it is definately much tougher than it was, especially for newer grads.

Just curious - what’s your brother doing now? Some good options for ex chiros are ortho/medical equipment sales or community college teaching. I agree that becoming a P.A. might be the OP’s best option nowadays.

My wife has a Kinesiology degree. Very good degree but really good jobs in that field are hard to find. She worked in vocational rehab for 12 yrs with poor pay and a lot of frustration dealing with workman’s comp and MVA cases. She then went back to teacher’s college for a year and now teaches elementary school.

if you want more input feel free to contact me off line. Being a girl and you a boy there are different options out in the field.

Sitting here with my D.C. degree and still contemplating going through the motions of getting licensed (Life06). LOVE the field, love everything it taught me, and apply everything daily, with the exception of delivering the adjustment - I concentrate all efforts on the soft tissue problems and refer out. If I had to do it over again, for less money and way less time, it would have been the PA degree.

Looking at the overhead to run an office versus the massage therapy overhead, and looking at the amount of time tied to the office, no clue why I got the degree (other than a ‘dr’ was expected out of me). Upon truly examining EOBs (explanation of benefits) from the insurance company, this is what I witness: charge 100 today, 60 days from now the ins co decides you didn’t include enough paperwork, refile, they decide ok, we’re going to give you 40, but only 20% of that so in 60 more days you will get a check for $8 (not all are like this, but the ins game is bs). Where as with massage this is what I see: paid today, in cash, no bs - and often pple try to give more, which usually I decline. NO overhead, I set my hours, set my days, take my 2 months off a year. When my body wears down, will implement a CEU seminar series (already in the works) to teach others the advanced tricks that have time tested worked, info they don’t get in the 6 month massage program. The DC degree isn’t going to waste, just not utilizing it the way it was intended. Which is how you might envision one of your degrees. You can ALWAYS work for yourself in some field, just need to find your niche.

As for Bridgeport - I had considered them when I first started looking, I liked their set up. Life was the obvious bc of the proximity to me returning home to the beach in Florida. It doesn’t matter where you go, so long as you can pass the boards and you learn what you need to (you’re going to be the Dr. you are designed to be). Shadowing someone in the field taught me more than school ever could, you would be doing yourself a major bump up if you can provide this personal growth opportunity, and might help your decision.

Any help or suggestions would be appreciated, just no chiro-bashing!

Have you thought about Physical Therapy??? :slight_smile:

Actually, a degree in Ex Phys is almost a guaranteed job if you i) have an EKG course and ii) do an internship. Our placement rate of grads who want a job in Cardiac Rehab is close to 100% (90% without moving). The US is only gonna get unhealthier, so, I don’t see that trend changing anytime soon. From my experience, most who get an MS in Ex Phys and go into Cardiac Rehab are facility directors within a few years. It’s not for everyone, but it is essentially a guranteed job (Cardiac rehab) if you have an Ex Phys degree.

That being said, PA is the way to go right now if you are looking for options, job security and good pay. Again, our placement rate from Ex Phys into PA programs is 85% right now, I believe. Most PA programs though are looking for PA relevant experience, and that typically takes time to acquire.

From my experience Bridgeport is not the best place to train. I’ve slept in hotels there and done a triathlon, but from what I can tell the area is not the best. Maybe someone with more experience can chime in.

Also, I go to Springfield College and have good friends in the Grad PA/PT/S+C/ex phys/AT/OT majors, so let me know if you have any questions. Western mass is a great place to train and although the college is in a city it is simple to access the beautiful rural roads of western mass and northern CT. There is a decent tri scene out here too (I’m also the president of the tri club :wink: Same goes for UMASS amherst, beautiful training area.

“I personally know at least 5 ex chiropractors in their 30s who are now doing something else”

I think that’s happening much more now. It’s mostly due to the declining insurance reimbursement and increasing overheads. My practice is less than it was even five years ago but fortunately I’m at an age and stage in life where I would want to cut back anyways, but never suspected that would be done for me by market conditions. There are still some chiros making really good money, but it is definately much tougher than it was, especially for newer grads.

Just curious - what’s your brother doing now? Some good options for ex chiros are ortho/medical equipment sales or community college teaching. I agree that becoming a P.A. might be the OP’s best option nowadays.

My wife has a Kinesiology degree. Very good degree but really good jobs in that field are hard to find. She worked in vocational rehab for 12 yrs with poor pay and a lot of frustration dealing with workman’s comp and MVA cases. She then went back to teacher’s college for a year and now teaches elementary school.

My brother is in med school in the Bahamas. He just did not see a future in chiropractic. Hipe it works out for him.

Mike

Check individual PA school requirements. I’m in PA school right now. I entered with limited direct patient contact hours since I came from a research background. Some schools have less experience requirements than others. Many schools will count athletic training work as experience.

I’m really excited about going to work as a PA. There are plenty of job opportunities and you can specialize in just about any area. I’m really leaning toward family practice, but I absolutely loved Orthopaedics/Sports Medicine so I’m doing my elective clinical rotation in ortho.

PA school requires a pretty intense time requirement for about 2 years (depending on your school), but it was no more than my previous graduate degree requirements (I just sit in a classroom instead of a research lab). I’m excited to get out there for clinical rotations. Our school requires service learning at the local free clinics during the didactic year so I have gotten more clinical experience during school. I really like working with patients and helping people that have limited access to healthcare. There is just something really cool about helping sick people get better so I’ve been working at the free clinic as much as I can during my first year. Feel free to PM me if you wanna know more about the PA school experience.

My brother-in-law is a PT, he loves it.

Good luck with the decision!

Unfortunately I can offer no help with regard to the specific programs. However, I would not want to live in Bridgeport. I believe it has gotten better, but it is still not a desirable place to live.
good luck,
tom

Do you or anyone else know what is the norm for “patient contact” hours, and what exactly those entail. I’ve heard mixed reports that something like personal training can count for those but i know a lot of the school sites generally say things such as emt or cna work. I guess it may be an option to take a semester or year off of school and just personal train out that way if that’s an acceptable option.