After beating the crap out of my training wheels (with Velocity Deep V’s) for 8 years it’s time to replace the rims as the brake track got worn down. Getting a new set built by Wheelbuilder.com with Hed Belgium Plus rims which gives me the opportunity to go tubeless. I’ve always ridden with Conti GP4000s because they are such a good all around tire but as far as I know they’re not considered tubeless ready. Which tire would be equivalent (but can be run tubeless) - looking at rolling resistance, durability, resistance to flats?
Or - has anyone used the GP4000s to run a tubeless setup and if so, are there tips and tricks to make it work?
While I love running tubeless (and have two sets of tubeless wheels), given the current low prices of the 4000sII’s, it’s hard to beat the value. I haven’t found a tubeless tire that isn’t more than double the price of the Conti’s if you run 23s or 25s.
Personally, I use the Schwalble Pro One Tubeless Easy. Love them. So far as I can tell, they are fast, comfy and I didn’t have any issues at all fitting them and getting them to seal. I’ve done about 500 miles on them, on British roads (i.e. utter rubbish road surface) and they still look like new.
And, for the love of god, do not even attempt to run a non-tubeless tyre, tubeless. Asking for a very quick, and expensive, trip to the dentist if you do.
Personally, I use the Schwalble Pro One Tubeless Easy. Love them. So far as I can tell, they are fast, comfy and I didn’t have any issues at all fitting them and getting them to seal. I’ve done about 500 miles on them, on British roads (i.e. utter rubbish road surface) and they still look like new.
And, for the love of god, do not even attempt to run a non-tubeless tyre, tubeless. Asking for a very quick, and expensive, trip to the dentist if you do.
I’m using the same tire and while I agree with them being comfy and tough, I wouldn’t call them fast. Outside of my Thunderburts and some old HTs, Schwalbe tires have always felt slow to me. Also, I think the comfort comes from the larger volume and low pressure vs any benefit due to their construction. However the price is right and I’m not sure any other Tubeless tire out there is faster right now (Outside of the Vitt, which is too fragile IMO).
After beating the crap out of my training wheels (with Velocity Deep V’s) for 8 years it’s time to replace the rims as the brake track got worn down. Getting a new set built by Wheelbuilder.com with Hed Belgium Plus rims which gives me the opportunity to go tubeless. I’ve always ridden with Conti GP4000s because they are such a good all around tire but as far as I know they’re not considered tubeless ready. Which tire would be equivalent (but can be run tubeless) - looking at rolling resistance, durability, resistance to flats?
Or - has anyone used the GP4000s to run a tubeless setup and if so, are there tips and tricks to make it work?
Thanks!
No you definitely don’t want to use a GP4000s as tubeless. Could you possibly get it to work, probably, with enough sealant but it wouldn’t last. You want to use a dedicated tubeless tire. The best available is the Vittoria Corsa Speed. It also happens to be one of the fastest rolling tires ever produced. Some have some durability concerns from others but I raced on them all season without incident. Thanks to the help of some on ST as well, we were able to crowdfund some aero testing of the tire. It tested surprisingly ok aerodynamically.
And, for the love of god, do not even attempt to run a non-tubeless tyre, tubeless. Asking for a very quick, and expensive, trip to the dentist if you do.I haven’t tried but what’s the issue? I thought they just wouldn’t hold air.
Yeah I read some test data and this seems to be the fastest tire. That said, I’ve never had good experiences with Vittoria tires and flat protection. Rolling resistance was always great but durability and resistance towards flats were a problem. Since these aren’t my racing wheels (they’re for training as well as ‘aggressive’ race-style group rides) I need them to be robust. What kind of mileage do you get out of them?
And, for the love of god, do not even attempt to run a non-tubeless tyre, tubeless. Asking for a very quick, and expensive, trip to the dentist if you do.I haven’t tried but what’s the issue? I thought they just wouldn’t hold air.
The bead isn’t strong enough, they’ll blow off the rim - possibly while you’re riding fairly fast.
Personally, I use the Schwalble Pro One Tubeless Easy. Love them. So far as I can tell, they are fast, comfy and I didn’t have any issues at all fitting them and getting them to seal. I’ve done about 500 miles on them, on British roads (i.e. utter rubbish road surface) and they still look like new.
And, for the love of god, do not even attempt to run a non-tubeless tyre, tubeless. Asking for a very quick, and expensive, trip to the dentist if you do.I was looking into these as well but going by the Amazon reviews they appear to be a hit or miss; some claiming they’re great and some having cuts and issues right from the start - and it seems it’s more than just installation error that’s causing the issues. Their rolling resistance seems comparable to the GP 4000 when looking at this: https://www.bicyclerollingresistance.com/road-bike-reviews/schwalbe-pro-one-tubeless-2016
I stopped using Schwalbe Pro One Tubeless pretty quickly. Got a quick sidewall cut on the first ride of one, but I’ve done that with other tires, too.
My issue is their absolute abysmal performance in the wet on brick or concrete blocks you find in city streets. Did two different crits that had brick or cobbled sections and there was zero traction. Unlike any tire I’ve ever ridden on before. Took me until the second crit to figure out it was the tires. Haven’t touched them since.
No you definitely don’t want to use a GP4000s as tubeless. Could you possibly get it to work, probably, with enough sealant but it wouldn’t last. You want to use a dedicated tubeless tire. The best available is the Vittoria Corsa Speed. It also happens to be one of the fastest rolling tires ever produced. Some have some durability concerns from others but I raced on them all season without incident. Thanks to the help of some on ST as well, we were able to crowdfund some aero testing of the tire. It tested surprisingly ok aerodynamically.
Whoops. Forgot about that guy. To be fair, though, it’s not on my radar as it’s durability is quite questionable, your experience notwithstanding.
I stopped using Schwalbe Pro One Tubeless pretty quickly. Got a quick sidewall cut on the first ride of one, but I’ve done that with other tires, too.
My issue is their absolute abysmal performance in the wet on brick or concrete blocks you find in city streets. Did two different crits that had brick or cobbled sections and there was zero traction. Unlike any tire I’ve ever ridden on before. Took me until the second crit to figure out it was the tires. Haven’t touched them since.
What year were those tires? I had another person tell me the same thing about cuts but that was an older version than what I currently have. As to the bricks/pavers, that sucks. I’ve done a few races which cobbles and sliding around on them is always “fun”.
Yeah I read some test data and this seems to be the fastest tire. That said, I’ve never had good experiences with Vittoria tires and flat protection. Rolling resistance was always great but durability and resistance towards flats were a problem. Since these aren’t my racing wheels (they’re for training as well as ‘aggressive’ race-style group rides) I need them to be robust. What kind of mileage do you get out of them?
Yeah these definitely are not for training. They could be if you want to but you might as well get a more robust tire for training.
Usually I run the Supersonics down to the cord. I haven’t worn a Speed out yet and that isn’t for the lack of miles, I have at least 4 halfs, 2 Ironmans, some training rides + some sprints on them. My experience with cotton-based tires has always been they are more flat prone. With that being said, the addition of sealant should add to durability IMHO.
I was looking into these as well but going by the Amazon reviews they appear to be a hit or miss; some claiming they’re great and some having cuts and issues right from the start - and it seems it’s more than just installation error that’s causing the issues. Their rolling resistance seems comparable to the GP 4000 when looking at this: https://www.bicyclerollingresistance.com/...ro-one-tubeless-2016
I have a larger set of the edit: “G Ones” on my gravel bike and put 3k miles on them this year without a lot of complaints. I agree with LAI on how well they roll. TomA tested them against Compass and Challenger gravel tires and they aren’t fast. But they took some serious punctures and in all but one case sealed right up. For the worst puncture it just took one genuine innovations patch cord pushed thru to seal up. This is running at 60-70psi max, I haven’t gone the tubeless route on road wheels/tires yet.
For tubeless road from the bicyclerolllingresistance list I’d give the Hutchinson Fusion 5 Galactik TL a try. They test fast and are supposed to have better puncture resistance than the Vittoria CS TLR. Hutchinson has been making tubeless tires longer than most of the other manufacturers and probably make some of the tires sold under OEM names.
I was looking into these as well but going by the Amazon reviews they appear to be a hit or miss; some claiming they’re great and some having cuts and issues right from the start - and it seems it’s more than just installation error that’s causing the issues. Their rolling resistance seems comparable to the GP 4000 when looking at this: https://www.bicyclerollingresistance.com/...ro-one-tubeless-2016
I have a larger set of the Pro Ones on my gravel bike and put 3k miles on them this year without a lot of complaints. I agree with LAI on how well they roll. TomA tested them against Compass and Challenger gravel tires and they aren’t fast. But they took some serious punctures and in all but one case sealed right up. For the worst puncture it just took one genuine innovations patch cord pushed thru to seal up. This is running at 60-70psi max, I haven’t gone the tubeless route on road wheels/tires yet.
I have a larger set of the Pro Ones on my gravel bike and put 3k miles on them this year without a lot of complaints. I agree with LAI on how well they roll. TomA tested them against Compass and Challenger gravel tires and they aren’t fast.
“Aren’t fast” seems way harsh. Bicyclerollingreistance show them as pretty darn fast, “11W” puts them in some pretty good company, and only 0.9W behind the Fusion 5 Galactik TL and 2.3W behind the magical Vittoria CS.
TomA’s spreadsheet has the “non-pro” Schwalbe Ones doing pretty well.
I wouldn’t choose it as my all-out TT tire, but it sure as hell isn’t a Gatorskin. Certainly a decent choice for a durable tire to throw down in competitive group rides, etc, without dragging an anchor around. It’s probably pretty close to par in Crr to the venerable GP4KS. BRR has that at 12.2W with butyl tubes, so it probably marginally beats the Pro Ones with latex.
I stopped using Schwalbe Pro One Tubeless pretty quickly. Got a quick sidewall cut on the first ride of one, but I’ve done that with other tires, too.
My issue is their absolute abysmal performance in the wet on brick or concrete blocks you find in city streets. Did two different crits that had brick or cobbled sections and there was zero traction. Unlike any tire I’ve ever ridden on before. Took me until the second crit to figure out it was the tires. Haven’t touched them since.
What year were those tires? I had another person tell me the same thing about cuts but that was an older version than what I currently have. As to the bricks/pavers, that sucks. I’ve done a few races which cobbles and sliding around on them is always “fun”.
I have a larger set of the Pro Ones on my gravel bike and put 3k miles on them this year without a lot of complaints. I agree with LAI on how well they roll. TomA tested them against Compass and Challenger gravel tires and they aren’t fast.
“Aren’t fast” seems way harsh. Bicyclerollingreistance show them as pretty darn fast, “11W” puts them in some pretty good company, and only 0.9W behind the Fusion 5 Galactik TL and 2.3W behind the magical Vittoria CS.
TomA’s spreadsheet has the “non-pro” Schwalbe Ones doing pretty well.
I wouldn’t choose it as my all-out TT tire, but it sure as hell isn’t a Gatorskin. Certainly a decent choice for a durable tire to throw down in competitive group rides, etc, without dragging an anchor around. It’s probably pretty close to par in Crr to the venerable GP4KS. BRR has that at 12.2W with butyl tubes, so it probably marginally beats the Pro Ones with latex.
Yeah. Sorry. iPad and coffee wake up. Gravel bike should have been a clue. Mine are the Schwable G-Ones. Tom tested these vs. Compass (Panaracer?) and Challenger offerings and they were slower than Challenger and faster than most of the Compass line to which I had planned on switching. The bummer with the Challenger line is that none are tubeless. So what I’ve got is where I’ll be for now if I want tubeless. The last time I looked, Tom hadn’t posted these gravel tire tests in his spreadsheet. He posted them to a ST thread somewhere.
Part of my confusion is I have Schwable Pro-Ones on the bench to try on a set of my wife’s road wheels. The wheels were a sponsor deal, but with the tubeless shoulders she is challenged to get a tube swapped at all which would end her day racing. We’re trying the Hutchinson for her gravel build with 28c.
Thanks everyone for the comments and suggestions - looks however like the market isn’t quite ready yet and the limited options all come with significant drawbacks compared to a standard setup with GP4000. So I think I’m just going to stick with that for now…
