Hi- I’m training for my first Ironman (CDA) and read several times that almost all rookies go into the race overtrained. At the same time, I’ve been reading that nearly every rookie will end up walking during the marathon. Are they related? Can you help me reconcile the two? I’m pretty sure overtraining won’t be a problem for me (I’m having trouble enough keeping up with my training schedule due to a demanding job), but am still interested in the collective wisdom here. Thanks for any insight.
Overtraining makes you really tired and if you are really tired it is easier to walk part of the marathon.
It is better to go into a Ironman slightly undertrained than overtrained. If you are undertrained, within reason, it is easier to muscle through and HTFU but overtraining means your body just can’t respond to your commands.
After 3 IMs, one of which I was seriously burnt out and overtrained and had my worst time and was miserable for the entire day. My first one I was slighly undertrained and loved most of it. My 3rd one was spot on. I had a horrible swim for psychological reasons but loved the day after that.
Not sure if the two are related since having to walk at some point during the marathon can happen for any number of reasons (heat, nutrition, pacing, injury just to name a few).
My opinion is that if you walk the mary then your are probably UNDERtrained and did a combination of going too hard on the bike and/or screwing up your nutrition. Take the bike incredibly EZ, nail your nutrition and then pass all of the walkers on the run. Don’t forget to snicker to yourself about how cool they looked on their bike that costs 2X yours.
As the esteemed JamieJ said…I did IMLP last year as my first IM and trained with the plan to not walk the run.
For me that meant improving my bike fitness, using a Power Meter to control my pace, training hard enough and long enough, but the big thing for me was my TAPER.
I was irritable, antsy, wanted to do a race a month before IMLP but I stuck with the plan and exceeded my expectations almost breaking 11hrs.
Others have said it before …you have to get to the start line healthy and hungry with a plan to run the whole marathon…I shuffled through 5 aid stations and that cost me breaking 11hrs.
Have fun with your training,
Andrew
IMO I would say that most do not go into the race overtrained, sure some might but I think for the majority it is pushing their bodies into the unknown.
Some may go too hard in the swim or maybe bike too hard and forget about ensuring they get enough calories back into thier bodies to run a marathon (I know I did). They may have also not paid enough or any attention to their nutritional needs in training so when the race rolls around they don’t have a clue.
Most will do a lot of long rides but not do enough bricks and a few long ones to truly understand what you can and cannot do. Walking is an easy option when you get to a point you haven’t been before. Also not know what you can handle eating/digesting during the course of a 9-17hr day. For me part of my issues in my first one is that I didn’t know what I needed to take in and didn’t really eat on the 2nd lap in Lake Placid because I was distracted and caught up in the moment. My other problem is that I did my long runs like I would training for a marathon that starts at 8am. Mine didn’t start until around 2pm, it was baking hot and no shelter from the sun. I hadn’t trained for that condition and it was really one that was always going to be there (my mistake).
As others have said their are many factors but I really don’t think overtraining is the issue.
Good luck with you race.
If you walk chances are you screwed up the bike. I was a rookie Ironwoman this past summer and I ran the entire marathon. I really held back on the bike - - I was even disappointed in how I did on the bike until I hit the run and was passing people left and right. I don’t think walking the marathon is so much a rookie thing as it is an overcooking the swim and bike thing.
Right out of the transition it was mostly men walking. Some of whom I recall having blown by me on the bike.
As to be over / under trained… slightly undertrainined is in all likelihood the way to go if you have no choice. Overtrained is always a bad idea for reasons others have stated. I have another friend who did awesome at her first IM and like me, she ran the entire marathon AND her running volume and especially her long run, were much shorter than what everyone else was doing.
If you are thinking that work might get in the way and you will have trouble squeezing in workouts, try and get some core work in whenever possible. The last 6 miles of the marathon I was wishing I had done more core work…and realizing that I could have worked that in while watching TV or even cleaning the house…
Overtraining makes you really tired and if you are really tired it is easier to walk part of the marathon.
It is better to go into a Ironman slightly undertrained than overtrained. If you are undertrained, within reason, it is easier to muscle through and HTFU but overtraining means your body just can’t respond to your commands.
After 3 IMs, one of which I was seriously burnt out and overtrained and had my worst time and was miserable for the entire day. My first one I was slighly undertrained and loved most of it. My 3rd one was spot on. I had a horrible swim for psychological reasons but loved the day after that.
I agree w/ the idea of erring on the side of undertraining vs. overtraining. I’ve often told those folks who are just starting to race long that its better to be 10% undertrained than 1% overtrained. If for no other reason than you’ll have more fun along the journey.
As the OP said, there are many factors which can contribute to why someone is relegated to walking part of the IM marathon - heat, hills, bike pacing, nutrition, hydration, injury (hopefully never this), etc.
For me, it wasn’t until I completed my 4th IM distance event that everything clicked (I’m also a knucklehead and it sometimes takes longer to fingure things out). Coincidentally, or perhaps not, it also happened to be the race where I was the most undertrained BY FAR. Ended up setting a PR by 50 minutes with most of that time gain coming in the marathon.
I think people are too “awed” by the distance and then go overboard in training thinking the IM distance is this unfathomable distance, when its really not that long. If you do the preparations, but not too the point of being obsessive about getting more and more miles, you’ll be fine.
Train appropriately
Pace in race appropriately
Know what nutrition/hydration plan works for you
Remember this stuff is for fun
Enjoy!
Its easy to overtrain when you are working a lot as work is another stressor.
Contrary to everyone’s else’s opinion - I think running a lot is key. I ran better in my last IM by far (4:20 to 3:44) with less bike fitness but I ran a lot. Running almost everyday and getting used to running on tired legs helps. Of course you need to nail 1) Biking within your fitness, 2) nutrition, 3) hydration, and 4) early run pacing. I think long bikes, long bricks…are all over-rated. You need consistency, health, and decent week to week volume.
Dave
Here are my thoughts self trianing for 2 ironmans (#3 this year!). I think there is a critical volume (not my term but that used by some coaches) that most athletes must complete to run the entire marathon. The critical volume must be completed without putting the athlete into an “overtraining” mode. However, most first time ironman can’t train at that volume without overtraining. In fact overtraining way cause you race to be slower.
For instance, I was really overtrained for my first ironman I completed in about 12:30 hours and didn’t have much fun. However, for my second Ironman I had an unexpected project at work and so was really (like only trained 6 to 8 hours a week for the last 8 weeks before the race) undertrained. I had good base from training for and completing a 50k prior to the work issue. I had a great race and was only 10 minutes slower than my first.
I hope to someday have the time and ability to trian at the critical volume but I am not there yet so for now, I will be walking part of the marathon!
Not trying to be a smart ass, but it is more likely a combination of over and under trained. That is, the amount of training you do is not enough for the distance (undertrained), but at the same time too much for the fitness you had starting the training period (overtrained).
In other words, you are screwed either way.
It is a rare case where first timers have taken the appropriate number of years (yes years) to properly ramp up to a successful first IM (where successful in this case is not walking the run).
" Hi- I’m training for my first Ironman (CDA) and read several times that almost all rookies go into the race overtrained. At the same time, I’ve been reading that nearly every rookie will end up walking during the marathon "
I can speak for 1 CDA rookie in 2003 >>>myself >>>> And I walked a lot of the 2nd lap of the run.
It s a very tough day. My back cramped up and I laid on a power transformer for 10 minutes in a fetal
position along with walking more than the aid stations.
The reality of my walking was not over training. I came out of the scared to death but kicked that lakes ass
swim to the most beautiful day ever. T-1 was happy place and then I saddled up on the smoothest pavement,
with a cheering crowd and an endless stream of people to pass. WOW I thought !!! This is even better
than I expected. This is better than my first kiss a the movie theater!!! That girl Jannice should be here.
I am going 24 miles/hour and swallowing the road whole . I look at my heart rate monitor at about mile 12 and the alarm
in my head goes off. Duuuuuuuuuuuuuude your gonna die. 168 bpm is way over 152. I slowed down
some but felt sooooooo good on the bike that I couldn’t stay seated on the climbs or resist passing
a cluster of racers. At 100 miles my ass was sore enough that I wanted to finish but my stomach was
pretty full and I my legs still felt OK. The new shoes a t T-2 were orgasmic but my legs now felt
kinda numb and wobbly when I stated running. I ran until I cleared the crowd and started the death jog.
it was hot and at mile 15 I could barely jog between aid stations. at Mile 19 could only jog for 2 minutes
then walk 1 minute. Can’t remember how high my heart rate would go but I could not sustain even a slow jog.
The reality of my first IM walk was getting swept up in the moment and going tooo hard on the bike.
It is also questionable that I had 12.5 hours of aerobic fat burning power to get me to the finish.
My advice is to be hard nosed realistic about your pace and heart rate , hold back on the bike , and
do at least 2 extremely long bricks (almost all bike) with no rest breaks to expierence
10 plus hours of steady out put.
Be smarter than me and learn how easy it is to overwork before CDA.
dog.
I did my first IM last year and can share what I did as far as pacing is concerned. I went super easy for the first hour of the bike and then settled into a relaxed conservative pace. I took the first 6 miles of the run ridiculously easy and then settled into my pace. It was my first marathon as well. I ran a 4:07 and had a 6 minute negative split. I passed hundreds of people on the run. Everyone was walking.
I nailed my nutrition and had a good taper too!
Overtraining that people talk about is often really trying to do to much in the last month. Now is the time to be consistant in your training and working on that really solid base that your body will draw off on race day. Don’t waste time and energy on speed, unless you have that natural endurance ability, take longer for recovery and injuries happen.
You are trying to find a pace that allows you to push yourself all day, and that allows you to slow down the least on the second half of the marathon. CDA is hillier than most people think, always dependant on where you are from, the rule is to bike the first loop as relaxed as possible and have two laps the same speed. I went in thinking this and still biked the first lap way too fast. I was smart enough to shut it down and cruise the second lap, which allowed me to have a strong run for me.
Now is the time to watch your weight too, a few pounds make a big difference over a day and it is easy with all the training to take your daily eating for granted.
Everything is dependant on the type of athlete you are and the mental approach you favour. I know some people who do sub 4 hour marathons that use scheduled walk breaks. That may not be fast for all here but I would be happy. others will say any shuffle is faster than a walk. CDA 08 I finished 13:33.
Your nutrition is a huge key…hard to really know what will work…I have done the swim - 150k bike - 26k run brick ( run a 2k loop where you have access to an aid station every lap) to test to adjust race day nutrition, but there are positives and negatives to having a big training day like this for many people. I did a few big brick days, but did not have bricks in my weekly schedules. Remember 70.3 doesn’t give you a great idea what will happen for you after 10 hours. Nutrition is the 4th part of the IM.
CDA weather will play a roll in your day. It can be very hot or pretty cold and there will be wind of some type. Just don’t get caught up in the water temp discussion, but get a neo cap just in case.
Good luck, it is a beautiful race.
I think (this is a personal opinion) that the number one thing to overcome is all the negativity that people will feed you. They will try to take you down before you even reach the line (you are already questioning yourself) and they will try to bring you down or suck you into their downward spirral.
I had this happen to me during my first IM - I was passing a guy on the run that kicked it up a few notches to keep up and then he turns to me and starts telling me how tired he is, how much pain he is in and how he wants to walk the rest of the course. The next thing I knew I was walking with him holding a conversation. All of a sudden I turned to myself self and said “WTF why are you letting this person drag you down with him.”
So my advice is, whether you are overtrained or undertrained, go in with the attitude that you can do it and that you are going to have fun and learn lessons while doing it. And don’t let anyone bring you down before, during or after the race. After all, this is YOUR race.
I did my first last year with only one duo, one sprint, and one HIM ~8 weeks before IM. My goal was not to walk. Training was limited by life/work… that is not to say I did not put in the time when I had it. Hard to define overtraining versus overload. My advice would be stick to your plan, have step-back weeks (especially in running), be prepared to alter (I would have runs on my schedule that were basically called “pace of the day”). When I felt like I was gassed in training I would tend to push through it more so on the bike versus the run. I find that I can often turn around a bad bike session with some patience and nutrition. When a run session goes south I will push but it usually stays there more often than biking and I will cut it short.
The key for me for the run was of course adequate training and just as important spending the time and effort to learn my bike pace and nutrition. I am relatively new to biking. I never felt I was pushing on the bike and really had to focus on pulling on the reigns as the urge and capacity to go faster was certainly there. I started to run out of steam in last 6 miles of the Mary but kept the feet moving and never walked. The HIM was a great learning event for me in terms of developing pacing/nutrition strategies. I actually bike the same pace for my IM as I did my HIM as I learned I had plenty left in the tank for the run.
Good Luck!
Depends what racers consider walking. Plenty of people walk 2-3 minutes every mile and finish in 4 hours. Others “run” the whole marathon and it takes 5+.
My wife recently did her first IM (also her first marathon). She used Huddle/Frey’s book exclusively for her training plan and it seemed to work for her. She held back on the bike and then did a four hour marathon. She walked only at the water stations. She was given that advice from a local triathlete who had won his AG at IM Florida a few years ago. He always walks at the the aid stations and runs the rest.
matsull
I am jealous of a negtive run splitI M . I seek moderation in my life but at 46 I haven’t found any yet.
Go hard or go home.
At IMWI 08 I pretty much blew it on the bike in the first loop. Coming into the second loop I had an accident and lost A LOT of time. Pushing it too hard blew me up completely for the run. I had to walk most of the marathon. At that point finishing was my first priority, not proud of walking but it was better than a DNF. Go out there make the most of the day and have fun! Listen to your body in training. You do not want to start injured at all!