Interesting article on wheels…
https://www.hambini.com/blog/post/bicycle-wheel-aerodynamics-which-one-is-fastest/
No idea who did the testing but there are some interesting results…
Interesting article on wheels…
https://www.hambini.com/...hich-one-is-fastest/
No idea who did the testing but there are some interesting results…
you have no idea the can of worms you just opened. grabs popcorn
WOW! I want my old Planet X wheels back!
You are 1 year late to this party. https://forum.slowtwitch.com/forum/Slowtwitch_Forums_C1/Triathlon_Forum_F1/Updated%3A_A_Comprehensive_(But_Controversial)_Wind_Tunnel_Wheel_Shootout_P6710888/?search_string=hambini#p6710888
Replace interesting with fabricated and you’re there!
From protocols to letters this is definitely the most ‘interesting’ testing around.
End up, don’t believe it, it’s utter junk
Replace interesting with fabricated and you’re there!
From protocols to letters this is definitely the most ‘interesting’ testing around.
End up, don’t believe it, it’s utter junk
Thanks, this is good to hear! I did a bit of searching before posting but didn’t think of going back over a year… looks like it’s just been reposted…
Here lies the problem with the internet. Not saying anything about his test but rather…
Everyone is anonymous and can preach for x product and sight x study to the unknowing. It’s called marketing and alot of BS studies that of course show one product better then another one.
The bike market wants you to. Do useless upgrades, change your setups, buy what new every though it is a lateral performance move or in some causes a backwards one.
Bike frame last for live if you don’t crash. Plus most athletes bike indoors now so, parts are hardly worn out.
Things that people have bought into from the bike industry to sell more stuff you don’t need are electric shifters, more gears, disc brakes, bike storage build in. This makes people get rid of a perfectly good frame and send money for stuff that doesn’t change performance.
Amen to that!
Here lies the problem with the internet. Not saying anything about his test but rather…
Everyone is anonymous and can preach for x product and sight x study to the unknowing. It’s called marketing and alot of BS studies that of course show one product better then another one.
The bike market wants you to. Do useless upgrades, change your setups, buy what new every though it is a lateral performance move or in some causes a backwards one.
Bike frame last for live if you don’t crash. Plus most athletes bike indoors now so, parts are hardly worn out.
Things that people have bought into from the bike industry to sell more stuff you don’t need are electric shifters, more gears, disc brakes, bike storage build in. This makes people get rid of a perfectly good frame and send money for stuff that doesn’t change performance.
Who pissed in your cheerios this morning? You could say the same thing about pretty much any consumer goods category. Nobody is forcing you to buy new stuff. But personally, I like nice bike shit. So sue me!
As for this Hambini character, it’s a shame people keep getting roped in by him and his crap keeps coming to the surface.
Here lies the problem with the internet. Not saying anything about his test but rather…
Everyone is anonymous and can preach for x product and sight x study to the unknowing. It’s called marketing and alot of BS studies that of course show one product better then another one.
The bike market wants you to. Do useless upgrades, change your setups, buy what new every though it is a lateral performance move or in some causes a backwards one.
Bike frame last for live if you don’t crash. Plus most athletes bike indoors now so, parts are hardly worn out.
Things that people have bought into from the bike industry to sell more stuff you don’t** need are electric shifters**, more gears, disc brakes, bike storage build in. This makes people get rid of a perfectly good frame and send money for stuff that doesn’t change performance.
Agree with you on everything except electric shifters. My hands and a shaky nerve condition has me really appreciating my Ultegra Di2. For me, there’s a big difference in performance because of my hand weakness. Whenever I ride my bike with the mech Ultegra, I rue the ride.
Did notice in the final day of the TdeF, the pro set up was pretty much mech Dura Ace.
You are quite right about everything else. There are so many distractions with daily life that a watt here or an ounce there doesn’t make as much difference as good news does.
Here lies the problem with the internet. Not saying anything about his test but rather…
Everyone is anonymous and can preach for x product and sight x study to the unknowing. It’s called marketing and alot of BS studies that of course show one product better then another one.
The bike market wants you to. Do useless upgrades, change your setups, buy what new every though it is a lateral performance move or in some causes a backwards one.
Bike frame last for live if you don’t crash. Plus most athletes bike indoors now so, parts are hardly worn out.
Things that people have bought into from the bike industry to sell more stuff you don’t need are electric shifters, more gears, disc brakes, bike storage build in. This makes people get rid of a perfectly good frame and send money for stuff that doesn’t change performance.
Who pissed in your cheerios this morning? You could say the same thing about pretty much any consumer goods category. Nobody is forcing you to buy new stuff. But personally, I like nice bike shit. So sue me!
As for this Hambini character, it’s a shame people keep getting roped in by him and his crap keeps coming to the surface.
Or alternatively, he’s the little kid pointing out that the king is not in new fine clothing, he’s actually butt naked and they remainder of the populous have been had.
But still, some folks don’t like being told they’ve been had.
…Things that people have bought into from the bike industry to sell more stuff you don’t need are electric shifters, more gears, disc brakes, bike storage build in. This makes people get rid of a perfectly good frame and send money for stuff that doesn’t change performance.
Nope. I agree with much of your post, but this bit is way off. Some people may have been conned into thinking they need these things, but that’s a handful of people just looking to spend money. The vast majority think about what they want or need and make educated decisions about the value of different features for them. I have no problem with any of the developments you’ve used as examples. My current road bike is 5 years old and won’t be replaced for a while yet. My current tri bike is over 3 years old and it’ll be many years before I replace it (unless damaged). Neither has electric shifting, or disc brakes, both have 11 speed RD and the tri bike has some storage built in. Disc brakes weren’t quite here when I purchased these but the other options were, and were a factor (among many) when choosing each bike. These are typically not features that are needed, but they are often beneficial. Deciding you want them does not make you a sucker unless you made the decision based on spurious marketing nonsense. Each feature has different relevance to different potential customers. For example, my previous road bike had a 9 speed groupset. Due to the terrain I ride I wanted a wide spread of gears so I had a triple on the front. That worked perfectly well. When I replaced that bike I went for an 11 speed groupset with a wider range derailleur. This allowed me use a similar gear range with a double up front while retaining moderate steps between gear ratios. It’s a tidier arrangement in my opinion although both work fine. This approach simplifies product ranges for manufaturers who have now pretty much dumped triples from their ranges as they are no longer required. This is not a marketing gimmick, it’s a sensible development.
I would seriously contemplate electronic shifting for my tri bike in future because it to provides real advantages for me. Specifically, the ability to locate shifters on the pursuit bars to allow me more safely select gears on technical sections of courses where I’m not on the extensions. I’m not being conned by the industry, I wanted that functionality before anyone was talking about it. Now it’s available.
Yes, the bike industry tells people they need stuff they may not need (this is certainly not unique to the bike industry). However, many of those products do have a real place and offer actual benefits. Consumers are not all idiots (though some undoubtedly are) and most do not give up their existing equipment for the latest stuff unless there’s a real reason to do so. Most simply evaluate the current options when a purchase is necessary and buy what suits their needs the best. Prestige buyers who buy the stuff they think will impress others or to fuel their own ego are a different matter…
agreed to that. Its interesting that hambini slaughtered Flo and other wheels based on this testing and from what I see in terms of all the shit storm that entailed had perfectly good data to back it up.
nobody. I am granola kind of guy.
Yes you can.
Yes I know that.
yes nice shit is nice try some on your cheerios.
Your last statement made my point any study can be marketing or used with just the statements they want released to make them seem.
I have no idea what this means!!!
your shifters situation is unique.
I have multiple clients and friends that have wasted Ironman and half races not being able to shift there Di systems. For them they spend $2000 to create a problem. When the old setup had no problems.
DO NOT WATCH THE TDF to look for gear that is best. They ride x gear money. they would ride a tricycle if told for the right price. Same with most Pro triathletes.
I agree in general with your anti-bike industry rant, but I do think electronic shifting is a big improvement for TT bikes. Being able to shift from the base bars is something I really appreciate on rolling courses (which is all I ride). For road bikes, I prefer the “feel” of mechanical Campagnolo.
Or alternatively, he’s the little kid pointing out that the king is not in new fine clothing, he’s actually butt naked and they remainder of the populous have been had.
But still, some folks don’t like being told they’ve been had.
Like he said… roped in. People are roped in because they don’t understand testing or science in general and so can’t judge the technical merits of what is presented. It’s all “he said, she said” BS in your mind and you just pick a side, based on… whatever.
I was very sympathetic with Hambini’s original premise that wind tunnels do not adequately model the wind we experience outdoors. Unfortunately it quickly became apparent that his “testing” was seriously lacking, and the numbers were probably fabricated. Even if they weren’t fabricated the error bars (by his own admission!) are so large as to make any conclusions moot.
Or alternatively, he’s the little kid pointing out that the king is not in new fine clothing, he’s actually butt naked and they remainder of the populous have been had.
But still, some folks don’t like being told they’ve been had.
Like he said… roped in. People are roped in because they don’t understand testing or science in general and so can’t judge the technical merits of what is presented. It’s all “he said, she said” BS in your mind and you just pick a side, based on… whatever.
I was very sympathetic with Hambini’s original premise that wind tunnels do not adequately model the wind we experience outdoors. Unfortunately it quickly became apparent that his “testing” was seriously lacking, and the numbers were probably fabricated. Even if they weren’t fabricated the error bars (by his own admission!) are so large as to make any conclusions moot.
Nothing is fabricated. Neither myself nor my colleagues have a need to.
I deal with unsteady aerodynamics multiple times a day. I find it staggering that (the vast majority) in the bike industry don’t understand this concept and the overwhelming majority on slowtwitch can’t rise to the technical challenge of going away and learning about it and would rather belittle and discredit.
I stand by my comments.
- Anyone who designs a wheelset by ignoring the spokes is an amateur.
- If you put massive clearances around the spoke holes, they need to be larger than the pulse pressure diameter or (ideally) smaller than it. Tuning it to the exact size is beyond stupid.