Good day folks,
Writing for a buddy of mine. Experienced Inside Ride rollers user. Just tried their new smart resistance unit for the first time and it is a bit of a disaster with big time calibration problems. There is no app and the only way he could attempt to calibrate the unit was using the TrainerRoad app and it didn’t work very well. Any suggestions before he returns it?
did he try the Elite app?
http://www.elite-it.com/en/products/us/trainers/app/app-my-e-training
.
Without going into too much detail if it were me I would consider returning it quickly.
I purchased their Beta wireless unit and had some similar issues and other issues as well. I let too much time pass by trying to get it to work like I wanted. I had trouble with the Wahoo Kickr being off as well and was not pleased with Wahoo’s claim to be accurate, but at least they continued to work on firmware updates and TrainerRoad and PerfPro came up with a solution that a person’s power meter could control the effort and calibration.
Inside Ride was very open to discussing with me both in email and phone, but with no positive results. They gave me an opportunity to return for a full refund and it was my mistake not to take that opportunity. I let too much time go by with attempting to get it to work and was not able to return it for a refund. Hindsight, I absolutely wished I had returned mine while I had the chance.
I plan on putting the mechanical resistance controller back on the rollers. IMO, It is a great trainer in that form and use the Kickr with power meter control for ERG mode or programmed workouts.
This is my thinking as well. It turns out they really don’t have a documented procedure to calibrate the unit. Pretty unbelievable. I agree with you in that mechanically, the rollers are awesome but the smart resistance unit is a nightmare.
I wonder if they feel compelled to compete with gadgetry animated fluffy entertainment side of the new smart trainers coming to market and did not really understand training principles using a power meter as a guide. In other words when I tried to explain why it was important to me to try to match my training intensities to fitness as tested by a fairly accurate power meter I would just get dead air (no response) as if what I said made no sense.* I could be totally wrong about this and what they understand when it comes to training using a power meter as a guide.*
I follow Inside Ride on Twitter and Facebook and they really don’t market the wireless trainer that much.
This is Larry from Inside Ride.
There absolutely is a calibration procedure for the smart resistance control. It is available for anyone who emails info@insideride.com requesting the information, and we are also happy to step through the process by phone if required.
Felt_Rider
We do understand training with a power meter, but there is always going to be a conflict between estimated wattage and power meter wattage.You will find that in the smart trainer world, all the accuracy complaints are from people with power meters expecting too much accuracy from systems not capable of providing it. Meanwhile, those without power meters are getting reliable and productive workouts without all the wattage drama. Not trying to excuse obvious limitations of systems like ours, just saying it does the job it was intended to do.
Inside Ride does have an app (unfortunately windows only, who the heck has a windows machine lying around these days? Lucky for me, I did).
That does calibrate it, but to be honest I never use it in “smart trainer mode” because the levels of resistance are not granular enough. For example, when my Trainer Road workout goes from 55% FTP to 80% FTP, the jump in resistance is so huge that it’s like I’ve hit a 30% grade. The same change on a kickr is a smooth transition.
So the way I use it is with an app to control the resistance (I use the Wahoo iPad app) - and I use it mainly for long indoor rides where I’m not changing resistance that much. For a very structured workout with a lot of power changes I just ride my KICKR.
This is Larry from Inside Ride.
There absolutely is a calibration procedure for the smart resistance control. It is available for anyone who emails info@insideride.com requesting the information, and we are also happy to step through the process by phone if required.
Felt_Rider
We do understand training with a power meter, but there is always going to be a conflict between estimated wattage and power meter wattage.You will find that in the smart trainer world, all the accuracy complaints are from people with power meters expecting too much accuracy from systems not capable of providing it. Meanwhile, those without power meters are getting reliable and productive workouts without all the wattage drama. Not trying to excuse obvious limitations of systems like ours, just saying it does the job it was intended to do.
Larry, I have logged a lot of hours on the E-Motion rollers have given them pretty good review on my blog. I do hope things go well with this wireless controller. I will admit being quite disappointed to have purchased the Beta wireless controller and then you guys abandoned it right after. Now it sits useless in a box and the magnetic controller back in use. No doubt those feeling show through my sentiment in the previous post. Best wishes with this new controller and I hope you will have many happy users.
On another note I understand the OP’s concerns and I went through this as well. Yes, it falls in with wattage drama, but for some of us that buy particular training gear we hope to use the equipment in a more refined sense. Yes, I have had a lot of fitness progress first with dumb trainers using perceived effort. I used perceived effort with the E-Motion rollers and then started using a power meter to refine that effort. When I purchased the Wahoo Kickr I had hope that it would be similar in consistency that many users have experienced with the Computrainer. The unit I bought unfortunately was more than 20 watts different than the power meters that I use.
So what was the wattage drama and does it matter? Probably not to many, but from my point of view when I am targeting something like those higher intensity efforts just above FTP it makes a lot of difference to me. I experienced this with the Kickr before the power meter control option came about and with the trainer being off more than 20 watts I was not in the level I was supposed to be targeting. At times the resistance was a bit too much and I would not be able to finish the interval. Had the trainer power been closer to the power meter I would be able to better dial in the effort. So the resistance could be too low or too high.
At the couple times I got the E-Motion Beta to pair with the laptop and application the resistance went too high and kept building even as I down shifted to my easiest gear and I would have to stop the session and finish on the Kickr.
A lot of wireless controlled trainers are hitting the market and I have seen a much larger crowd of Kickr owners that are completely happy that they have a trainer that follows along with whatever is on the screen animation without the slightest hint of the wattage drama. I have no doubt they will get some fitness gains out it and many have.
No doubt the crowd that does care seems to be a much smaller demographic, but kind of have hopes of getting a product that has a decent (not perfect) reputation like the Computrainer when it comes to targeting training intensities.
Regardless of my thoughts, best wishes
Inside Ride does have an app (unfortunately windows only, who the heck has a windows machine lying around these days? Lucky for me, I did).
That does calibrate it, but to be honest I never use it in “smart trainer mode” because the levels of resistance are not granular enough. For example, when my Trainer Road workout goes from 55% FTP to 80% FTP, the jump in resistance is so huge that it’s like I’ve hit a 30% grade. The same change on a kickr is a smooth transition.
So the way I use it is with an app to control the resistance (I use the Wahoo iPad app) - and I use it mainly for long indoor rides where I’m not changing resistance that much. For a very structured workout with a lot of power changes I just ride my KICKR.
That will my approach as well, but I guess I will stick with the roller’s mechanical resistance since I purchased the Beta early in 2016 and I am stuck with it now. No biggie though since the Kickr works for targeted and programmed workouts with a good power meter guiding the application and trainer.
I have had this unit since release(new elite unit) and used the elite calibration program with Larry’s help to get it dialed in. Out of the box the power readings were all over the place. It took me a good few hours/days to get it dialed in. You only have to calibrate it once as it writes to the firmware of the unit and works in all apps. They way I have it now, it is within 5 watts of my power meter from 150w - 400w+. The changes are very smooth for me and I use it for all my interval training. I also have a Tacx Neo and the resistance changes are very close.
That said there are some quirks. The trainer power reading is very sensitive to weight. For instance if I am on the bars, which is how I have it set, it is dialed. If I go aero, the wattage is actually 20 or so lower, if I sit up, the wattage goes 20 or so higher.( Off power meter). If you gain or loose weight the power reading is also affected. I don’t think this can be fixed as the wheel is floating and not fixed with a set pressure to the rollers.
With the quirks and all I am using these rollers 100% of the time now, perf pro power match completely fixes the variability issue, and Zwift works like a dream.
Felt_Rider
The beta unit was discontinued for a number of reasons, the main one being the developer pulled out and was unable or unwilling to continue supporting it. We lost our investment and two years of valuable time on the project. We turned to the Qubo as a replacement because that was the best way forward. We are much better off using something with a larger company like Elite behind it.
The Qubo does have an edge over the beta unit, but they are essentially the same thing. We still have a number of Beta units in service and they still work. Did yours actually quit working or was it just not up to your expectations? We can replace any failed units (until the spares run out), or we can get you a Qubo at cost. It’s performance may not be on par with the Wahoo, but at least it would give you more options when on the rollers. Contact us if you want to take either of these avenues.
Regards
Larry
Inside Ride
The Qubo does have an edge over the beta unit, but they are essentially the same thing. We still have a number of Beta units in service and they still work. Did yours actually quit working or was it just not up to your expectations? We can replace any failed units (until the spares run out), or we can get you a Qubo at cost. It’s performance may not be on par with the Wahoo, but at least it would give you more options when on the rollers. Contact us if you want to take either of these avenues.
Regards
Larry
Inside Ride
The best way I can put this is the Beta unit works in the sense that it powers up, but it does not work well with the training applications. At some point last year the training applications (TrainerRoad and PerfPro to be specific) were trying to keep up with the variety of smart trainers coming to market so quickly. About the time when the two application were putting out new updates for FE-C the Beta unit became extremely difficult to pair with the applications or very inconsistent. My last attempt to pair the Beta unit was just a few weeks ago and I tried to pair on two separate days. I finally got it to pair with TrainerRoad, but it did not behave as expected and the resistance never moved off of zero. The last attempt it responded to the workout, but the resistance continued to increase over a couple minutes to the point the resistance was so high I could not pedal.
This was the same difficult experience I had 07/10/2016 as noted on my blog http://thecyclingaddiction.blogspot.com/...ss-control-beta.html
Below that update you can see that I initially had success with the Beta until the applications continued putting out updates at a rapid pace. I even had fairly decent results with TrainerRoad power meter, which just about put it on par with the Wahoo Kickr using power meter control. I know speaking with you and Jason at the time that was not what you guys had expected, but to me the possibility of having my power meter control the effort was exciting. This initial successful setup with the Beta was November 2015.
With the Beta no longer being supported by Inside Ride and no doubt the applications will not cater to a discontinued Beta, I would appreciate the opportunity if you will allow me to return the Beta (since there is not much I can do with it at this point) and purchase the Qubo at cost.
Please let me know and I will contact you in private.
Thanks
Anyone else with some input on this topic?
I also purchased the Beta unit for Inside Ride. I had problems calibrating it, but got it to be close enough, and used it last winter. When the weather got nice I stopped riding on my rollers, and only recently started again. I was surprised to discover that the Beta is no longer supported and Inside Ride now uses an Elite unit. I haven’t been able to pair TrainerRoad with the Beta unit, so it’s effectively useless now.
If the offer is open to others I would like to buy a Qubo at cost. I’m very happy with the Inside Ride e-Motion rollers, but I’m serious about my training programs and need to train with power.
I also purchased the Beta unit for Inside Ride. I had problems calibrating it, but got it to be close enough, and used it last winter. When the weather got nice I stopped riding on my rollers, and only recently started again. I was surprised to discover that the Beta is no longer supported and Inside Ride now uses an Elite unit. I haven’t been able to pair TrainerRoad with the Beta unit, so it’s effectively useless now.
If the offer is open to others I would like to buy a Qubo at cost. I’m very happy with the Inside Ride e-Motion rollers, but I’m serious about my training programs and need to train with power.
That has been my experience with the Beta as well. It was sometime last year when FE-C came out and TrainerRoad and PerfPro had to respond quickly with a bunch of application updates that the IR Beta unit would no longer pair with either program.
Hopefully you will hear good news from Inside Ride.
Yes hoping to hear form InsideRide.
I understand that signing up for a Beta is always a bit of a risk, but it would be nice all the same to be given a soft landing by InsideRide with a discounted Elite power unit.
I do love the rollers themselves and would ideally like to continue using them with a smart power unit.
Yes we will extend the offer to any Beta participants. Unfortunately we are totally sold out of the new units and won’t have any more until Mid February. Contact us by email and we’ll get your name on the list.
In the meantime, any beta 2 units that have not been updated to ANT+FEC will still work with some apps once the FEC firmware is installed. Contact us for more info.
Thanks
Larry
Info@insideride.com