I’m not accusing anybody of motor doping, but just curious if anybody here owns and regularly rides an e-bike, or at least has had an opportunity to spend some time with one. If so, what kind do you have and how often/why do you ride it? How do you like it?
As an extension of that question, has anybody ridden an off-road e-bike?
I’m just curious. I see a lot of buzz about e-bikes from the different media sources I read, but haven’t seen many in the wild.
My father-in-law got one for his commute. It’s a sondors I think? Anyway, not an expensive version. The whole front diamond is a battery compartment, so it’s got pretty good range. 30-50 miles I think. It’ll go 20mph without any pedaling. He seems to love it.
I tried a Specialized Turbo at a dealer. Damn thing was a rocket. Heavy but fun to ride.
I have a Specialized Turbo that I commute and run errands on.
The first time you ride it, you can’t help but giggle. The acceleration is effortless…
My opinion is that over all it is no faster than a road bike, but much more convenient / less effort.
Faster on the uphills, similar on the flats, slower on the downs. Differing abilities may have differing outcomes.
If I kit up and ride to work on my road bike it takes me the same amount of time as the E-bike, except on the E-bike I’m wearing a t-shirt, shorts and have my panniers full of lunch, work clothes etc.
Pulling my 2 kids in the chariot with their striders, lunch etc. to the bike park? Turbo, No question. Quick trip to get something from the store? Hop on the turbo. It’s actually as fast if not faster than driving over. One pannier has a lock, extra clothes etc etc. So I never need to remember that. Motor pacing a group ride? Not going to happen. Motor cuts off at 24mph and its hard work to go much faster.
When I commute and I’m looking for a bit more aerobic work, I turn the assist down to ~50% which I feel mimics the workload of riding a road bike. Remember, these things are heavy, have tires with crazy rolling resistance and are aerodynamic bricks.
With the assist turned off it is like riding in sand.
In terms of off-road e-bikes. I’ve never ridden one.
I don’t think they will tear up trails any more than a rider with strong legs does more than one with weak legs. You have to pedal smoothly. The higher the cadence the better. Standing is really awkward as the assist kicks in later in the pedal stroke (at least on my Turbo, maybe no Levo or other motors). Going up smooth climbs with steady pedaling, they will be faster. Going up technical climbs with a lot of bike handling they will be harderI’m not sure less-skilled riders will get over their head. The places where the assist helps, smooth climbs, skill isn’t a limiter. The places where it doesn’t, technical climbs, it will not help and may actually dissuade riders as the bike is heavy to push. On flat terrain speed is typically dictated by how fast you choose to go rather than your fitness level / ability to push the pedals.
Would I buy one an off-road Ebike? No.
Thanks for the thoughts - lots of good stuff here. Just how heavy is heavy?
My thoughts on trail riding with these is more about where these can be ridden legally - many trails (both paved or off-road) in my area have “no motorized vehicles” signs. I’m not sure where these stand - they’re motorized, so doesn’t that mean you can’t legally ride them on many trails?
On my fil’s bike, he said that it can’t go over 20 mph on it’s own and still be considered a bicycle (his is governed to where the motor shuts off above 20mph). Anything over that and you have to register it as a vehicle. Maybe that applies here too. If it’s still classified as a bicycle then probably good to go.
On my fil’s bike, he said that it can’t go over 20 mph on it’s own and still be considered a bicycle (his is governed to where the motor shuts off above 20mph). Anything over that and you have to register it as a vehicle. Maybe that applies here too. If it’s still classified as a bicycle then probably good to go.
Very interesting point. Considering the aforementioned Specialized Turbo cuts off at 24mph, it’s practically a motorcycle! 
I have a Specialized Turbo that I commute and run errands on.
The first time you ride it, you can’t help but giggle. The acceleration is effortless…
My opinion is that over all it is no faster than a road bike, but much more convenient / less effort.
Faster on the uphills, similar on the flats, slower on the downs. Differing abilities may have differing outcomes.
If I kit up and ride to work on my road bike it takes me the same amount of time as the E-bike, except on the E-bike I’m wearing a t-shirt, shorts and have my panniers full of lunch, work clothes etc.
Pulling my 2 kids in the chariot with their striders, lunch etc. to the bike park? Turbo, No question. Quick trip to get something from the store? Hop on the turbo. It’s actually as fast if not faster than driving over. One pannier has a lock, extra clothes etc etc. So I never need to remember that. Motor pacing a group ride? Not going to happen. Motor cuts off at 24mph and its hard work to go much faster.
When I commute and I’m looking for a bit more aerobic work, I turn the assist down to ~50% which I feel mimics the workload of riding a road bike. Remember, these things are heavy, have tires with crazy rolling resistance and are aerodynamic bricks.
With the assist turned off it is like riding in sand.
In terms of off-road e-bikes. I’ve never ridden one.
I don’t think they will tear up trails any more than a rider with strong legs does more than one with weak legs. You have to pedal smoothly. The higher the cadence the better. Standing is really awkward as the assist kicks in later in the pedal stroke (at least on my Turbo, maybe no Levo or other motors). Going up smooth climbs with steady pedaling, they will be faster. Going up technical climbs with a lot of bike handling they will be harderI’m not sure less-skilled riders will get over their head. The places where the assist helps, smooth climbs, skill isn’t a limiter. The places where it doesn’t, technical climbs, it will not help and may actually dissuade riders as the bike is heavy to push. On flat terrain speed is typically dictated by how fast you choose to go rather than your fitness level / ability to push the pedals.
Would I buy one an off-road Ebike? No.
I rode a handful of e-mtbs at Interbike Outdoor Demo last fall and I can fill you in on some of the off-road stuff.
On gravel roads, my first thought with the e-assist was “Dang…I need to react/bike-handle more like this is a motorcycle”.On rolling single track, they can be significantly faster for a given effort (depending on what power level you choose)…which can sometimes get you in trouble (on multiple levels) :-/On downhills, you REALLY notice the extra weight…they handle like pigs.
Now then, I also rode an e-Fat Bike (right after riding a Surly Ice Cream Trucker)…and I have to say I could see a purpose for them there. Fat Bikes are fairly heavy to begin with, and the e-assist basically made that feeling of “heft” go away on climbs and rolling trails. Didn’t seem to be as much of a difference for descents as I noticed for a regular MTB, but probably because the added weight is less of a percentage difference.
So…I came to the conclusion that their best application off-road is fat bikes…with the most perfect application probably being on a fat bike tandem 
Just my 2 centavos…
I played around on a few here in the UK where they are limited to 15.5 mph. In terms of their off-road uses I see the advantages, but it is a pretty restricted market. If e-bikes are going to really take off they need to move onto road/commuter bikes. I can see the appeal but can’t see them really taking off until the price drops significantly or they change the rules.
The cheap ones here (and across most of Europe) are driven by the front hub while the more expensive versions are crank driven. Putting the motor in the front hub significantly effects handling and is downright sketchy in slippery conditions. (Bikes and motor bikes are rear wheel drive for a reason). My mother-in-laws hub driven bike also weighs in a tad over 22kg and you REALLY notice that when you go over 15.5 mph and the motor kicks off. And this is a bike that cost her more than I built my CX racing bike including HED Ardennes+ wheels.
Crank motors are lighter and better in every aspect except price. For use on the road I just can’t see people spending that kind of cash for a bike if the motor only works below 15mph. Personally an e-bike would slow my commute to work and I’m only a folding 3-speed Brompton. If I still lived in Indiana, where as I understand it there is no restriction on the speed to assistance motors, I might be more tempted.
I think the major manufactures have a similar opinion and are trying whip up a media storm to build public opinion to the point where laws won’t restrict the viability of the technology. If many of the US states were to adopt UK-like controls on e-bikes it kills the potential market. I think the current marketing for off-road use is just the initial push of larger effort to transfer the tech onto the roads.
On my fil’s bike, he said that it can’t go over 20 mph on it’s own and still be considered a bicycle (his is governed to where the motor shuts off above 20mph). Anything over that and you have to register it as a vehicle. Maybe that applies here too. If it’s still classified as a bicycle then probably good to go.
Very interesting point. Considering the aforementioned Specialized Turbo cuts off at 24mph, it’s practically a motorcycle!
If it’s classified as a road bike, it’s limited to 20mph in the US. That’s why e-bikes like the Turbo and Stromer are actually sold as “off-road” bikes, which have different limitations (25mph, I think…don’t quote me on that one).
I use a Stromer for riding with clients out in the field. It allows me to pay attention to them without much effort and carry tools for adjusting their bikes. An e-bike vs. a scooter keeps me on bike trails legally, too. Pretty darn fun, and I’ve “re-programmed” it a bit, so I get 30mph out of it if needed.
My thoughts on trail riding with these is more about where these can be ridden legally - many trails (both paved or off-road) in my area have “no motorized vehicles” signs. I’m not sure where these stand - they’re motorized, so doesn’t that mean you can’t legally ride them on many trails?
This debate is already heating up in my area. I personally feel that they have no place on a non-motorized trail because, well, they have a motor. I don’t think they should even be called bicycles, rather scooters or mopeds. I think eventually anti offroad bicycling advocacy groups will be able to use their existance to remove access to trails. But there is no doubt the bicycling industry is pushing them.
It’s going to turn into a big battle very soon I think.
I have had a Specialized Turbo S for several years. It rocks. I have no car so it makes commute fun
My thoughts on trail riding with these is more about where these can be ridden legally - many trails (both paved or off-road) in my area have “no motorized vehicles” signs. I’m not sure where these stand - they’re motorized, so doesn’t that mean you can’t legally ride them on many trails?
This debate is already heating up in my area. I personally feel that they have no place on a non-motorized trail because, well, they have a motor. I don’t think they should even be called bicycles, rather scooters or mopeds.
Yup…I agree. Unfortunately, the legislators in CA apparently do not :-/
I think eventually anti offroad bicycling advocacy groups will be able to use their existance to remove access to trails.
'Tis my fear as well.
But there is no doubt the bicycling industry is pushing them.
It’s going to turn into a big battle very soon I think.
The e-bike presence at Interbike last fall was dominant. Many times I heard the refrain that if it weren’t for e-bike sales, many entities would have been closing doors due to the generally soft bicycle market at present.
Selling to baby boomers who do not like to ride uphill like my cousin. I am 63 and going uphill is not as fun as it once was. But I will keep trying even as I slow down.
My wife has an eBike. She is not a cyclist, and is dealing with her second total knee replacement. For her to go riding with me on a regular bike is not going to happen … yet. The ebike lets her get exercise, while riding with me.
Her first one is made by Ferber, it is a city or comfort bike. The bike weighs about 60lbs, and the motor is in the rear hub.the reaer hub design makes it a pain to change a flat! We just replaced the Ferber with a Cannondale. This is also a city or comfort style bike. However the motor is a Bosch ‘mid drive’ so the motor is on the bottom bracket. The bike weighs 48 lbs, and the rest of the bike is very much like any other bike.
The motor on either bike cuts off at 20mph, but you can pedal past that. She has made rides up to 35 miles, and yes she was assisted, but still did the miles, had a great time, and got more exercise than she would have otherwise.
It is a kick to get on the thing and turn up to max assist, and buzz the neighborhood
My E is my main bike for day-day travel in the city. Chipped so no restriction but lack of an aero position = 40-45 km/h is kind of the max. It’s great for zooming around with traffic, & it’s safer actually because you can merge into city flow, pull into a left turn lane etc . Follow the pack nicely with some drafting.
Also hills are no obstacle for average speed but you burn battery watts. I have a good saddle, grips, fantastic Shimano flat pedals (top ones). I have to check my K’s travelled as it’s a lot. Been through 3 sets of brake pads in a couple of years with this one. It’s v/rare I use a car in the city because of it.
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My mom has one and absolutely loves it. Her health isn’t what it once was and her e-bike allows her to get out and about with her grandkids, riding to restaurants, etc. What really cracks me up is that A.) she looks like the Wicked Witch from Oz in the tornado while riding it and B.) she will talk about how she’s keeping up with us and must be getting in shape… in her mind, b/c she’s “pedaling” the bike isn’t really doing anything!
I have one made by Ride Scoozy, the Scoozy 350. I am very happy with it, exactly what I was hoping for. Since I work from home I don’t need to commute to work but like to use the bike to run quick errands to the store, post office, coffee shop etc. Since a lot of what I travel to for those things is within a 3 mile radius the bike is perfect. Maybe the owner of Scoozy will chime in, I know he is a regular poster on here.https://www.ridescoozy.com/collections/all
I have a secret electric motor hidden in my tri bike. Does that count?
I got into the e-bike business after renting some Pedego’s and realizing their potential for the commuting market. Most e-bike companies are marketing towards baby boomers and mountain bikers, but to me the real benefit is commuting around town. I would say it is similar to the joy you get riding a fixed gear/single speed bike over a geared bike, you don’t have to worry about shifting, derailleur adjustments etc. With an e-bike you don’t have to worry about traffic, parking, etc.
One example… if I am relaxing in my apartment on the weekend, I would probably not drive or ride my regular bike over to the park 1 mile away because it’s a hassle to drive and I don’t want to work that hard on my regular bike. With an e-bike you just hop on and go and are there in no time while getting some fresh air. As others have mentioned if you get into the commuting world and start adding the lights, bags, racks, fenders, etc they are a great replacement for a vehicle. A lot of our customers have stopped using their cars completely after purchasing one of our bikes. It really depends on your location and how bike friendly it is.
Regarding the off road e-bikes, I personally am not a fan at all. I have ridden most of them and never found one I like and don’t really see the purpose. I understand for certain people the assistance makes mountain biking accessible but I doubt we will sell electric mountain bikes.
Regarding the speed, 20mph is the federal ‘legal limit’, California bumped theirs up to 27 I think probably because of Specialized et al have their expensive bikes that can go that fast. If you read the law it says state law can only supersede the federal law if it is more stringent so technically 20mph is still the limit but like I said nobody cares about laws. People are building selling e-bikes that can go 30+mph that don’t meet CPSC standards and marketing them as ‘off-road’. Reminds me of the illegal exhaust systems people would put on their mustangs/camaros that were marketed for off road use only