Hi everyone! Am working on specifications for a new TT/tri bike and have concluded that I want to go with disc brakes and ENVE SES 7.8 wheels.
ENVE wheels come with centerlock hubs which is fine if I want a centerlock rotor, but the industry standard is 6 bolt and would therefore require an adapter and bolts. It seems to me from an engineering and design perspective that centerlock is a better choice. If this is the case, then why has 6 bolt become the industry standard? I believe that 6 bolt rotors are lighter (for example Ti-Carbon), but by the time you add the adapter and bolts, most of the weight savings would be negated.
Is there a compelling reason to be considering 6 bolt rotors or is the SRAM Centerline XR rotor (Centerlock) the way to go?
I was in a similar circumstance and opted for centerlock simply because it was the only option for the DTswiss hub I got. Generally, the system is foolproof and the rotors ‘look’ cooler/aero (depending on pricepoint). I was also pleased to see that there is a range of pricepoints.
I also got the 7.8 Disc, love them… but they are terrifying going downhill with strong cross wing (it happen often in my part of the world, i’m 160lbs), so if i had to do it again, i will get a 5.6 front / 7.8 back. And on most days i end up using my 35mm front from my road bike.
Centerlock is quick and easy, and would be my preference if i were buying new wheels.
I remember reading that 6 bolt hubs allow the bearings to be spaced out slightly wider, so that could be a marginal advantage. Pricing is slightly cheaper for 6 bolt.
With 6 bolt, if you bend a rotor on the trail, you can remove it with a multi tool and keep riding. With centerlock, you’d have to unbolt your caliper and try to tie it out of the way. On a TT bike, that’s not going to be an issue.
6 bolts means 24 bolts to unbolt/bolt when you change discs on a wheelset. This is soooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooo boring (I would add some oooooos if I could).
Go centerlock.
Ben…this is a little bit off topic, but I agree with you that having an ENVE 5.6 up front and 7.8 in the rear would be great. I wish that ENVE would offer mixed wheel depth purchases to accomplish this (like some other wheel manufacturers do).
It seems to me from an engineering and design perspective that centerlock is a better choice. If this is the case, then why has 6 bolt become the industry standard?
6 bolt was the standard because it existed long before centerlock…
Though I’d point out that Hope had a splined disc attachment standard way before 6 bolt OR shimano deciding it wanted its own splined design.
(Hope moved away from splined to ISO 6 bolt 20+ years ago, as 6 bolt was the adopted ISO by the rest of the industry (the industry being mountain bikes as road was still stuck in the dark ages)).
I have 8 or 9 sets of disc wheels and I hate the 3 or four that are six bolt anytime I have to replace or swap a rotor. It doesn’t sound like a big deal if you have one bike with 1 or 2 wheel sets, but centerlock is so much easier. I’ll never buy another six bolt wheelset. Never.
Ben…this is a little bit off topic, but I agree with you that having an ENVE 5.6 up front and 7.8 in the rear would be great. I wish that ENVE would offer mixed wheel depth purchases to accomplish this (like some other wheel manufacturers do).
As far a i understand, enve doesn’t pre produce wheels until we order… so pretty sure if you as nicely, that could be done.
(Last year they told me i could get a front 5.6 by itself)
The industry standard is becoming Centerlock, mainly because Shimano want it to. As stated elsewhere on the thread, 6-bolt was the original standard, however Shimano then launched their own standard - Centerlock. They own the patent: https://patents.google.com/...t/US20070240945A1/en
As a result, Shimano are incentivised to ensure that the industry moves across to CL, something they’ve actively encouraged by only offering their high-end (Ultegra / Dura Ace) level rotors in CL, not 6-bolt. Given they’re by far & away the leading OE supplier of road groupsets, hub manufacturers have been forced to switch to CL.
Interestingly, the graphic below shows why 6-bolt is arguably the superior design from a hub designers perspective - you can increase the bearing spacing on the axle as shown. However, it undeniable that CL is far superior from a user perspective when fitting, aligning & changing rotors.
Thanks everyone. This is very interesting. Just judging from the responses, it seems like centerlock is the preferred solution. And to this point, the ENVE SES wheels are only offered with centerlock hubs. Yes, you can use an adapter if you want 6 bolt with a centerlock hub, but that seems less than ideal. Interestingly though, some rotor manufacturers still only offer 6 bolt design (eg Carbon-Ti); I guess they are not closely following industry developments and trends very closely.
Out of curiosity, what is happening in the MTB world? Is it also transitioning from 6 bolt to centerlock?
The industry standard is becoming Centerlock, mainly because Shimano want it to. As stated elsewhere on the thread, 6-bolt was the original standard, however Shimano then launched their own standard - Centerlock. They own the patent: https://patents.google.com/...t/US20070240945A1/en
As a result, Shimano are incentivised to ensure that the industry moves across to CL, something they’ve actively encouraged by only offering their high-end (Ultegra / Dura Ace) level rotors in CL, not 6-bolt. Given they’re by far & away the leading OE supplier of road groupsets, hub manufacturers have been forced to switch to CL.
Interestingly, the graphic below shows why 6-bolt is arguably the superior design from a hub designers perspective - you can increase the bearing spacing on the axle as shown. However, it undeniable that CL is far superior from a user perspective when fitting, aligning & changing rotors.
yes, shimano wants their product to become the industry standard. zipp wants their driver body to become industry standard. i want the slowtwitch forum to become the industry standard. i’m not arguing whether it should be, i’m just arguing that centerlock is now the industry standard. as for which one is the better design, i don’t feel a difference in the braking, and i’ve never had a centerlock hub fail, so the utility of the design (for me) now flows down to other things. if you’ve stripped a bolt head from a 6-bolt system while taking your rotors off (i have) when packing your bike for airline travel, you’re somewhere between inconvenienced and screwed. hence centerlock (for me). i think your post recognizes the utility of centerlock for things like this (e.g., changing rotors).
