So, what is the collective definition of front of pack, middle of pack, or back of pack for an activity or overall race?
FOP: top 5%, 10%, 15% (more)?
MOP: 5%-50%? Something else
BOP: Last 50%; Last 25%
Whatever the break points, I am curious where people consider the spectrum.
For me, FOP feels like top 15%, MOP seems like 15%-75%, and BOP seems like last 25%.
FOP are the guys who have a chance to win. MOP is an undefined segment that was created by guys who are not FOP, but want to feel better about themselves when they tell their coworkers, friends, and family about how their race went last weekend. BOP are the guys that the MOP people are distinguishing themselves as better/faster than.
/pink…sort of…
So, what is the collective definition of front of pack, middle of pack, or back of pack for an activity or overall race?
FOP: top 5%, 10%, 15% (more)?
MOP: 5%-50%? Something else
BOP: Last 50%; Last 25%
Whatever the break points, I am curious where people consider the spectrum.
For me, FOP feels like top 15%, MOP seems like 15%-75%, and BOP seems like last 25%.
FOP: top 5%
MOP: 5-30%
BOP: everyone else
Don’t make the assumption that the “pack” is spread evenly. At a race like Kona, these percentages would be much different.
I tend to consider top 10-15% as FOP. (10% in smaller races where there are lot of rookies and one n doners, 15% in more competitive bigger races like WTC HIM/IM events where there aren’t as many clueless triathletes in their first rodeo.)
BOP I’d say last 25%.
Interestingly enough, I posted about being a FOP swimmer but a horrible runner. 2 people here wanted my swim times. I sighted several examples ranging from 27-35 minutes where I was top 5-12% of people coming out of the water. (I am a 47 year old AG) They told me that regardless of where I came out of the water, that the time is what constituted FOP/MOP/BOP. Made zero sense to me…but I guess to each their own.
FOP might win something
MOP might PR
BOP WILL finish
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FOP= people who win or have a chance to win
MOP= everyone else that beats me
BOP= me and the four or so people I might beat 
.
FOP might win something
MOP might PR
BOP WILL finish
I think that’s too stringent. You might as well just not say FOP in that case and just say ‘podium’, assuming that even if you’re not on it, you’re close enough to sniff it.
In a WTC like Vineman, a podium slot in M40-44 is a pretty solid performance. If you’re within sniffing distance of the podium, I def would say you’re a FOP AGer, not a MOPer. Big difference.
For a small local race where the field isn’t as big/competitive, sure, a true FOP triathlete will have a good chance of being on the podium.
FOP might win something
MOP might PR
BOP WILL finish
I think that’s too stringent. You might as well just not say FOP in that case and just say ‘podium’, assuming that even if you’re not on it, you’re close enough to sniff it.
In a WTC like Vineman, a podium slot in M40-44 is a pretty solid performance. If you’re within sniffing distance of the podium, I def would say you’re a FOP AGer, not a MOPer. Big difference.
For a small local race where the field isn’t as big/competitive, sure, a true FOP triathlete will have a good chance of being on the podium.
I guess it depends if we include elites/pro’s in the discussion.
I’m FOP for my age group but way off the elite’s, even the junior elites are next level. I would class going for the overall win as FOP, top age groupers are a step behind, technically not MOP as they are still top 10% athletes, so its hard to classify.
FOP might win something
MOP might PR
BOP WILL finish
I think that’s too stringent. You might as well just not say FOP in that case and just say ‘podium’, assuming that even if you’re not on it, you’re close enough to sniff it.
In a WTC like Vineman, a podium slot in M40-44 is a pretty solid performance. If you’re within sniffing distance of the podium, I def would say you’re a FOP AGer, not a MOPer. Big difference.
For a small local race where the field isn’t as big/competitive, sure, a true FOP triathlete will have a good chance of being on the podium.
I guess it depends if we include elites/pro’s in the discussion.
I’m FOP for my age group but way off the elite’s, even the junior elites are next level. I would class going for the overall win as FOP, top age groupers are a step behind, technically not MOP as they are still top 10% athletes, so its hard to classify.
I’m excluding pro/elites. Those guys are FOP+ by default compared to AGers.
Again, in big national class races like big WTC events, I think you’re lowballing AGers who are just off the podium by calling them MOPers.
Here are the results for HIM Oceanside M40-45.
488 guys in that AG.
Podium AG1-3 (pro-elites)are 4:26-4:30
Not sure where the non-pro AG podium is, but it’ll be between 4:38 and 4:45
19th AG place is just sub-5 at 4:57.
48th place (top 10%) is going 5:12:46 (39 / 2:38 / 1:42).
I’d say it’s too stringent to say you gotta be sub 4:45 to consider yourself a FOP AGer in this division.
I think it’s actually quite fair to say that in this race, the 5:12 (barely top 10%) is probably a reasonable rough guesstimate to pin down a division between a FOP/MOP athlete, with a 5:12 athlete straddling that divide.
I think “Front of Pack” means that, at some point, you have to be “A Person to Beat”- maybe “THE Person to Beat.”
I can’t see how you can be the Front without actually having a chance to be at the front of something.
I think “Front of Pack” means that, at some point, you have to be “A Person to Beat”- maybe “THE Person to Beat.”
I can’t see how you can be the Front without actually having a chance to be at the front of something.
Agree. Front is the 1st person. If you are looking at someone’s backside you are not (by Definition) front. Mop and bop are really the same. Loser of the race.
But then we like to give everyone awards so we could also say the front is anyone who is not last.
I think “Front of Pack” means that, at some point, you have to be “A Person to Beat”- maybe “THE Person to Beat.”
I can’t see how you can be the Front without actually having a chance to be at the front of something.I agree with this… the difference between top 5% and top 15% is huge and if you’re just inside the top 15% you’re usually nowhere near the front of the race. I’ve been top 5% in IM and an hour behind the winner - so even there calling myself front of the pack would be quite the exaggeration. I think FOP are the group of people contending for the podium (in a race with many participants).
For me, FOP are folks who are able to get on the podium. Now depending on the race distance they do, size of race, etc. the times clearly move around.
I would also say a person that is FOP is an All American in the USAT rankings. And yep, they are the folks others are trying to beat.
BOP are just folks there socially just to finish. No more, no less.
Everyone else, IMO, is MOP.
I think “Front of Pack” means that, at some point, you have to be “A Person to Beat”- maybe “THE Person to Beat.”
I can’t see how you can be the Front without actually having a chance to be at the front of something.
A top 10% AGer in a WTC event would be nowhere near the podium.
That same AGer in a small local non-big-city race might win or podium their AG pretty consistently in these small local races. They go from being a no-name WTC competitor, to being ‘a guy to beat’, if not ‘THE guy to beat’ in the local race.
That’s why I’d say it’s fair to say even if you’re not podiuming at a WTC event, if you’re still beating like 90% of your AG field, it might make more sense to call you a FOPer rather than a true Mr. Joe-average 50% AGer.
I think “Front of Pack” means that, at some point, you have to be “A Person to Beat”- maybe “THE Person to Beat.”
I can’t see how you can be the Front without actually having a chance to be at the front of something.
A top 10% AGer in a WTC event would be nowhere near the podium.
That same AGer in a small local non-big-city race might win or podium their AG pretty consistently in these small local races. They go from being a no-name WTC competitor, to being ‘a guy to beat’, if not ‘THE guy to beat’ in the local race.
That’s why I’d say it’s fair to say even if you’re not podiuming at a WTC event, if you’re still beating like 90% of your AG field, it might make more sense to call you a FOPer rather than a true Mr. Joe-average 50% AGer.
hot on the heels of a BOFOP RR the other day, I realized while swimming that MOFOP>BOFOP>FOMOP>MOMOP>BOMOP and it forced me to do an open turn and almost lose the lap count
For me, FOP feels like top 15%, MOP seems like 15%-75%, and BOP seems like last 25%.
I agree with this
.
I think “Front of Pack” means that, at some point, you have to be “A Person to Beat”- maybe “THE Person to Beat.”
I can’t see how you can be the Front without actually having a chance to be at the front of something.
this…
this makes good sense and is good logic as well.
a person may be MOP in one race and FOP in another depending on the competition.
keep it simple:
genetically gifted a-holes
me
bunch of losers
FOP-MOP-BOP
see?
I think “Front of Pack” means that, at some point, you have to be “A Person to Beat”- maybe “THE Person to Beat.”
I can’t see how you can be the Front without actually having a chance to be at the front of something.
A top 10% AGer in a WTC event would be nowhere near the podium.
That same AGer in a small local non-big-city race might win or podium their AG pretty consistently in these small local races. They go from being a no-name WTC competitor, to being ‘a guy to beat’, if not ‘THE guy to beat’ in the local race.
That’s why I’d say it’s fair to say even if you’re not podiuming at a WTC event, if you’re still beating like 90% of your AG field, it might make more sense to call you a FOPer rather than a true Mr. Joe-average 50% AGer.
10% of an average sized IM of 2000+ athletes is 200+. Majority of these people have zero chance of ever coming even close the podium (first hand experience here), hence can not be considered FOP, even by their best efforts.
Shall we call ourselves FOMOP or at least BOFOP?