Comments on Newton Shoes after trying them (now w/ Video)

Triathlon Forum
1

I’m interested to hear other people’s comments. I have been looking at bringing these into our store so I tried some out and will do more analysis in the near future. Here’s what I noticed:

The lugs create a sharp transition to the sides of the forefoot to the point that I could see the acceleration caused by this sharp transition causing a sprained ankle if running on root trails. I ran on a treadmill and did not experience any problems with this while running, but it did stand out to me while walking in the shoes.

If this a shoe meant for forefoot running, why is the heel so substantial? Yes, there is a drop from the forefoot to the heel, but in reviews it says that if your are a heel striker this shoe is not for you, yet the trainer I am trying has substantial heel cushioning and posting to aid a transition from heel to toe.

I am a pretty efficient runner. I land under my hips with a relaxed foot, not forcing a forefoot strike. I did not find the shoe to aid me in running with good mechanics. I run in a pair of Adizero Manas which have a positive heel, but are pretty close to having a forefoot and heel of equal height. I wish they were equal - I see that as being natural. I do not find a negative heel to be any more natural than a positive heel. That said, I do see how a positive heel encourages heel striking. I also compared the Newtons to running in a pair of Brooks Adrenalines and I saw again, my running gait was not improved by the Newton shoes vs the large heeled Adrenalines.

I found the lugs to increase pressure on my forefoot more than when I run in flats to the point of irritating nerves.

My conclusion is that I like the look of the Netwons and I like the way they fit, but I did not find them to aid already good mechanics and, as stated on Newton’s website, they do not correct poor mechanics.

I’m going to do some frame by frame video analysis taken from the side to see if my timing while running is improved by running in the Newtons. If the Newtons are effective, it should be visible that I land under my hips sooner and my rear foot comes off the ground sooner.

OK, take a look for yourself and be the judge.

Without Newtons: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JL87NaU42tw

With Newtons: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dMxHIVNRxTw

(tried to do slo-mo split screen, but iVideo is not so great with this, not like windows movie maker)

2

I just bought my first pair earlier this month and have put 56 miles on them so far. I bought them on the recommendation of my coach, and thought I’d at least give them a try. For background, I come from doing all my running on Brooks racers for the past year and before that I used the Brooks Adrenaline.

My impressions:

  • They didn’t require much adjustment to get used to. I didn’t slowly work them into my running, transitioning into them for 100% of my runs from day one. I didn’t notice any real unusual soreness or a shift in my running.
  • Coming from pretty light shoes, the Newton feels like a lot of shoe, especially in the thickness of the sole. It’s not heavy, but I don’t feel the road quite as much.
  • I haven’t noticed any instability as you mentioned, but the lugs up front definitely do increase the pressure on my forefoot.
  • They fit very well and are comfortable.

I did a short run this morning in a brand new pair of Brooks Adrenaline shoes that I’d had sitting in the back of my closet for about a year. I hated it. However, compared to the racers I had been wearing, I’m not conviced the Newtons compare favorably. I think they’re great shoes, and I’ll continue with them and reevaluate when it’s time to buy new shoes. However, I can’t justify paying double the cost of the racers for a shoe that doesn’t seem to provide any advantage.

3

I’m with both of you in the opinion that it doesn’t offer an advantage if you’re already a mid/forefoot striker. I like the feel of the shoes and I think they are slightly faster than my other trainers (partly because of the push off from the lugs and partly because they’re lighter). I have nothing negative to say about the shoe. I’m just not seeing any advantage for me personally.

4

I think they are slightly faster than my other trainers (partly because of the push off from the lugs and partly because they’re lighter).

I don’t understant how ‘pushing off from the lugs’ can make you any faster. Unless the lugs are providing some sort of propulsion(which they don’t), it seems like the only thing affecting your speed is how hard you’re pushing off. You can do that in any shoe!

5

I think the lugs allow for a more efficient push off. That’s what I meant.

I’d like a propulsion shoe though. :wink:

6

I think the lugs allow for a more efficient push off. That’s what I meant.

I’d like a propulsion shoe though. :wink:

Sure would! I’d also like a real engine for my bike, but I guess I’ll just have to stick with the whole “training” thing.

7

but I guess I’ll just have to stick with the whole “training” thing.

What a buzzkill!

8

Was a couple of years ago when I bought a pair but…
I followed the transition instructions and eased into them over a week or two. I did not find my stride any different although they certainly felt different, especially walking in them. Once the lug wore down a bit they were super comfortable to run in. Never had any of the calf achillies issues people were complaining about at the time although I have had issues with both in the past. They “felt” light and fast and felt the best when running fast. Not sure they were any lighter than the asics speedstars I was running in at the time but they “felt” that way. I would have bought another pair but did not want to get in the habit of paying $175 plus shipping for sneakers.

I also thought they would suck for running barefoot in and would also suck for running in the snow or when it was really cold.

9

Don’t fixate on landing with feet under hips. Your feet can land in front of hips. That’s actually what fast runners do. Then they compress at the ankle and knee joint and set themselves up for the next stride like a tiger ready to pounce.

What is more important is knee over ball of foot.

It is OK to let your heel down while running. All the best marathoners and 10k runners do. They don’t run on their tippy toes. The reason for the Newton Heel cushioning is not because you are landing on your heel. You are landing on your midfoot where the lugs are, but evventually you let heel to come down (imagine jumping off a box, landing on your midfoot and eventually letting your heel down)…that’s what the cushioning is for, but the bulk of the shock is absorbed in your forefoot, plantar fascia, achilles like a spring…just like how nature intended it to work.

OK, now take a step back from your PC and try this.

Stand straight with your knees over your heels (right angle at the transition from tibia to foot at the ankle). Now try to jump straight up.

Obviously you get nowhere.

Now do the same thing, but flex at the ankle so your knee is over ball off foot.

Now you can jump.

Watch “habitual treadmill runners” and you’ll see the weird subsegment of the running population who kick their feet out in front of their knees…the treadmill pulls their foot back underneath the knee, but on real pavement you end up with a heel strike and a transition period where you cannot apply any force to the ground and drive forward.

You don’t use Newtons to “shorten your stride”. It’s silly to shorten stride because speed = RPMxstride length. Since there is a limit to RPM, shortening stride length only slows you down. What Newtons do is put you in a power position with knee over ball of foot. Now you can drive forward with a bigger stride length taking off from the right position and spend more time per stride “in flight” because your starting position is more conducive to applying power to the pavement

I would not recommend the Newtons for running on technical trail of any kind. Save them for pavement, grass, crushed gravel/woodchips.

Dev

10

Actually they are really awesome for barefoot running out of T2…never had a blister in them.

I got the Newton All weather this week and have been pleasantly surprised. I’ve run in ~ 10-15C on snow and ice, and then have been pretty good. The upper however, needs to be MORE WINDPROOF in the next edition. If it is an all weather shoe, the toebox needs zero breathability and should keep all wind and water 100% out. The rest of the shoe can breath, but keep the toe box using 100% “sealed” material. I’ll have to stick duct tape to the toe box of the Newton All Weather as I do to my other shoes…I was hoping to avoid this procedure.

Dev

11

I just bought my first pair earlier this month and have put 56 miles on them so far. I bought them on the recommendation of my coach, and thought I’d at least give them a try.

your coach doesn’t happen to be sponsored by them is he/she?
Odd recommendation imo.

12

I just bought my first pair earlier this month and have put 56 miles on them so far. I bought them on the recommendation of my coach, and thought I’d at least give them a try.

your coach doesn’t happen to be sponsored by them is he/she?
Odd recommendation imo.

No he’s not, but he does swear by them. I’ve read the mixed responses on ST and elsewhere, but decided I could only judge them by wearing them. At this point, I won’t be buying a second pair.

Why do feel that it’s an odd recommendation?

13

I just bought my first pair earlier this month and have put 56 miles on them so far. I bought them on the recommendation of my coach, and thought I’d at least give them a try.

your coach doesn’t happen to be sponsored by them is he/she?
Odd recommendation imo.

No he’s not, but he does swear by them. I’ve read the mixed responses on ST and elsewhere, but decided I could only judge them by wearing them. At this point, I won’t be buying a second pair.

Why do feel that it’s an odd recommendation?

Dunno. I guess if I were to ask a coach “which bike should I buy?” I suppose I could expect the same type of answer. So I guess it isn’t that odd. I guess it would depend on whether you asked him or whether he just offered up the suggestion. I would think a coach would prescribe drills over a type of equipment.

14

or maybe stride length is a biproduct of speed x cadence, speed being relative to the displacement of the hips in front of the ground contact point.

On Newton’s website, the specifically say not to heel strike/brake and not to push off and to lean forward. I support them on these comments and I support them making a shoe that isn’t designed for heel striking.

15

I’m disappointed too. I jumped on the Newton bandwagon and sadly, find that I still have to train. Bummer!

Here are some observations. I own the red Gravitas Neutral Trainers (lightweight)
I’m a forefoot runner, land under my hips. Running barefoot on the treadmill closely mimics how I run in shoes. (I AM NOT A BAREFOOT OR MINIMALIST-FOOTWARE RUNNER!!!)
Do not run 10 miles as your first run in newtons. I knew better, but didn’t heed the warning. Sore calves resulted.Push off does seem better.After about 3 miles, I don’t really notice much difference wearing Newtons over my other training shoes (except what is below).Making turns is markedly more difficult in the Newtons (ankles can roll easily).I “feel” faster in the newtons. Landing on the lugs (to me) just feels solid, and I seem to get better leg turnover vs my other training shoes.With that said, I really like the Newtons, though I think they will be a much more viable option if they get in the $100 price range.And, I think you have a pretty solid conclusion. Will be interested to see your videos!

16

I just bought my first pair earlier this month and have put 56 miles on them so far. I bought them on the recommendation of my coach, and thought I’d at least give them a try.

your coach doesn’t happen to be sponsored by them is he/she?
Odd recommendation imo.

No he’s not, but he does swear by them. I’ve read the mixed responses on ST and elsewhere, but decided I could only judge them by wearing them. At this point, I won’t be buying a second pair.

Why do feel that it’s an odd recommendation?

I was actually thinking the same thing. IMO I would be wary of a coach that actually recommended the Newtons to one of their athletes, not because he may have business with them, but because I just don’t think highly of the shoe. I have had Metatarsal fractures from the lugs after I had been running injury-free for years in other shoes, a fellow training buddy did damage to one of her arches after trying them, and a fellow coach I know hurt his achilles with them. Obviously you can give examples of where they work great for some people, but to me personally I place them at the top of the triathlete gimmick category.

17

Well, I disagree with not letting your heel touch down. Leaning forward with your hips is fine, but there is always a push off phase unless you are going really slow. Running at the fastest speeds is effectively a series of bounding motions connected together when you preload each leg and transition to the next bound.

Look at the Olympic 10,000m final and even Bekele let’s his heel down and he’s going 26 minute 10K pace.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TRCB-wrPIUY&feature=related

The video is just scary. Bekele pulls off (if my observation is right) a 57 second final lap. Unreal. Makes you want to go to the track and crank off some 400’s (…a lot slower). What is amazing is that through the race, he is lapping “tourists” running 27 minute pace!!!

Anyway, in the video you’ll also see the the bulk of the stride literally happens behind the runner’s body. Just a bit of the stride is in the front for the preload phase, but there is some stride in front of the body to set up the next stride.

18

I have had both a positive and negative response to the Newtons when I tried them. These are:

It confirmed that my stride is already adapted to a mid-to-forefoot running stride. I worked with a coach a few years back after having knee soreness and muscle tightness after increasing my running mileage, which was primarily due to over-striding and heel-striking. Looking now at the wear patterns of my Nike running shoes (Pegasus and Volemos(?)), I can see very little wear on the heels (mostly from overstriding while walking after) but very concentrated across the mid-foot.

Easing into the Newtons per their recommendations, I did notice that my 5K speed did go up, and comfortably so. The shoes did make me a touch faster.

The bad part? 2x the cost of the Nikes. I’ll take the value of more shoes versus the one Newton shoe.

19

I’ve had them for almost a year. Not that they have changed my stride or my running in general, but that fit to my running. I am a midfoot striker, and these have been by far the best feel for ME. THey are comfortable, light, and cushioned. Also, I had knee surgery almost 2 years ago now and my knee has felt the best with these shoes so I won’t switch.

20

I followed the instructions, ran in them for about a month, then suffered a very bad calf strain and moderate nerve damage which effectively ended my season. After 6 months I am now about 90% recovered. The sole also started to delaminate after 50 miles. For me, Newtons have fairly low bang for the buck.