They are talking about tearing it down. Yup, that will fix the mass school shooting problem.
don’t be a tit - you’ll have no doubt read that part of the motivation is because the school has become a sort of shrine for weirdos, and the problem is getting worse.
it raises some interesting questions, though, about the best way to commemorate a massacre. one thought it to raze the thing to the ground and forget it. another is to try to turn it to something positive - create a community park or something. another is a solemn memorial.
i visited this place when i was a kid, and it was remarkably powerful:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Oradour-sur-Glane_massacre
the idea there being that history will speak for itself - just step back and leave it untouched.
Wow. I’d never heard of that.
Honestly, are there any good Adolphs anywhere in human history?
Wow. I’d never heard of that.
Honestly, are there any good Adolphs anywhere in human history?
Adolph Coors? Ahh, nevermind.
I’m sure if these weirdos don’t have assault weapons we may view it differently… but the country has been conditioned to ignore the giant elephant in the room. But tearing down the school? Sure, let’s argue over that - surely it’s just another distraction so we don’t have to talk about the real issue.
I’m sure if these weirdos don’t have assault weapons we may view it differently… but the country has been conditioned to ignore the giant elephant in the room. But tearing down the school? Sure, let’s argue over that - surely it’s just another distraction so we don’t have to talk about the real issue.
What do you believe to be the real issue?
In case you are being serious, Assault weapons in particular, and guns in general.
In case you are being serious, Assault weapons in particular, and guns in general.
I was serious. I asked because I think the bigger problem is a lack of mental heath care. Take away guns and the mentally ill will just find other methods to kill…
“The Bath School disaster is the name given to three bombings in Bath Township, Michigan, on May 18, 1927, †Wikipedia reports, “which killed 38 elementary school children, two teachers, and four other adults; at least 58 people were injured . . . Most of the victims were children in the second to sixth grades (7–14 years of age) attending the Bath Consolidated School. Their deaths constitute the deadliest mass murder in a school in United States history.†Before the attack on the school, bomber Andrew Kehoe killed his wife with a blow to the head”
So mental health is the elephant in the room to all these mass school shootings? I ask this in earnest because I want to understand how you actually rationalize these events.
So mental health is the elephant in the room to all these mass school shootings? I ask this in earnest because I want to understand how you actually rationalize these events.
My current perspective is not so much “mental health” but the cultural phenomena of the fetishized mass shooting among young men is a root cause to consider. (Vegas and some other exceptions notwithstanding).
Guns have been around a long time with high availability. Poor mental health has been around as long as humans have. But the fetishized mass shooting not very long. Columbine was among have been the first, hence it’s treatment among fetishists as a sort of cult monument. (Mass shootings have been around for a very long time, but my argument is that most of these recent ones are “different” and increasing in frequency since Columbine)
I agree it is a factor that guns, particularly those with the some of the characteristics of the AR-15, can turn people into extraordinarily efficient killing machines, and that’s part of the story.
But what I’d like to do, if I knew how, is to stamp out this fucking fetishized counter-cultural mythology these young men seem to adopt. I don’t know how. The problem is that any attempt to stamp it out from the “mainstream” only sort of bolsters the mythology. Sort of like Nancy Reagan and drugs.
So mental health is the elephant in the room to all these mass school shootings? I ask this in earnest because I want to understand how you actually rationalize these events.
I can’t rationalize murder and I didn’t think you were trying to do so either. I can point to the fact that a proper medical diagnosis that could be useful in getting dangerous people into treatment and away from weapons. And just so I am perfectly clear there is no way I am saying that all mentally ill people are dangerous. I have suffered from depression in my life. I was never a danger to anyone but myself during that period.
The Parkland shooting is a perfect example where the individual had a long history of mental health issues that were basically ignored until he became irrational;
"Nicolas Cruz, the accused shooter was in fact diagnosed with autism, depression, and ADHD. There is a significant link between ADHD and criminal activity. There is also a link between autism and violent crime. "
Psychologically there is a connection between mass murder and untreated mental illness…
"There is a strong connection between acts of mass public violence—including mass public shootings—and untreated serious mental illness.
The majority of all mass public killers (some studies estimate as many as two-thirds) (bold mine) likely suffered from a serious mental illness prior to their attacks, and often displayed clear signs of delusional thinking, paranoia, or irrational feelings of oppression associated with conditions such as schizophrenia and bipolar-related psychosis.
This includes many individuals who committed atrocious attacks on students, including the Parkland shooter, the Virginia Tech shooter, and the Sandy Hook shooter—all of whom had long histories of untreated mental health problems."
https://www.heritage.org/public-health/commentary/the-role-mental-illness-mass-shootings-suicides
In case you are being serious, Assault weapons in particular, and guns in general.
And what do you propose to do?
Wow. I’d never heard of that.
Honestly, are there any good Adolphs anywhere in human history?
My mother is Polish. There was a time when my uncle was the president of our local polish cultural society. When he stepped down, the guy who replaced him was named Adolph. That always made me snicker.
I’m sure if these weirdos don’t have assault weapons we may view it differently… but the country has been conditioned to ignore the giant elephant in the room. But tearing down the school? Sure, let’s argue over that - surely it’s just another distraction so we don’t have to talk about the real issue.
mate, i’m about as critical as most of the gun culture in the US, but i’m not sure what you’re on about here.
from the sounds of things, the people in the area - including in the school itself - are thinking about doing something with the building because it’s causing them pain and hassle working and studying and living there. surely they’ve got that right - or at least the right to have the conversation - after what they’ve been through.
and surely america - god’s favourite country - is able to both decide what to do with that building and look at ‘the real issue.’
lastly: if there was a single really meaningful debate or piece of legislation that was being drowned out or held up by this columbine debate you might be closer to having a point here, but honestly - the gun debate in the states is so fucked up that there’s not much sense in worrying about the elephant in the corner.
oversimplify much?
Wow. I’d never heard of that.
Honestly, are there any good Adolphs anywhere in human history?
The first entry in Wikipedia is Adolph Evil Child… I kid you not
(I was looking to see if the founder of Bud was Adolph, for some reason I thought it was)
In case you are being serious, Assault weapons in particular, and guns in general.
I was serious. I asked because I think the bigger problem is a lack of mental heath care. Take away guns and the mentally ill will just find other methods to kill…
All countries have a mental health problem, it is not unique to the US. Mental health is not the elephant.
In case you are being serious, Assault weapons in particular, and guns in general.
I was serious. I asked because I think the bigger problem is a lack of mental heath care. Take away guns and the mentally ill will just find other methods to kill…
All countries have a mental health problem, it is not unique to the US. Mental health is not the elephant.
So what do you propose we do?
In case you are being serious, Assault weapons in particular, and guns in general.
By assault rife you really mean semiautomatic rifles. They have been around since 1885 and were popular before WW2, and yet we did not have school shooting until 1999. I don’ t think semiautomatic rifles are the problem.
Perhaps we have abandoned our cultural norms which have created a society where a minority are open to these horrific acts. Nobody wants to go there. Why are so many mentally ill now? 18% of the population take mental health drugs. How has society changed to make this happen?
I don’t know what we can do in the current political atmosphere. However, we all know the facts and statistics: if we believe there nothing intrinsically different about Americans than people of other nations, then the unregulated ownership of guns - including assault weapons - is the ONLY logical conclusion you can come to as to why there are more mass shootings/murders in America than any other place on earth. On the other hand, we do have the 2nd Amendment - notwithstanding all the different interpretations as to what it actually entails - which is accepted as fact that owning arms is protected under the US constitution. Furthermore, the political fight about guns an gun control have been so polarized and exhausting over the last a few decades to the point of that most of Americans don’t see a solution. So this is where we are today. Do you agree?