Hello and thanks for helping someone who can’t wrap his mind around the available data:
As best I can tell from reading various “geometry tables”, the P1, the P2sl, and the P3 all share the same frame sizing/geometry.
Right or wrong?
While I’m sure training has helped me become faster,
C’mon. Really? If you had ridden the exact same bike (any of your bikes listed), you would have had similar results. The bike just does not make that much difference.
You’re probably right.
I still want to know if the P1 = P2sl = P3 in terms of fit geometry.
In your size, no…the frame geometry between the P2SL/P1 (same bike) and P3 is not the same.
You’re getting faster 'cos you’re getting fitter…the improvement curve is pretty steep when you’re just starting out.
As above, the P2SL and newer P1 are essentially the same bike. P3 has different geometry.
Slowtwitch has a page listing stack and reach (plus some other measurements) of the different models for most of the popular tri bike manufacturers here:
http://www.slowtwitch.com/stackreach.html#Anchor-CERVELO
Good luck.
I apologize in advance for my whiney attitude and beating a dead horse approach about this.
Cervelo lists on their site the geometry for the P1 and the P3* and *the P4 being the exact same.
Why would Cervelo be in error about their own frames?
The slowtwitch database (albeit for size 54 P1/P3) shows a 14mm difference in stack and a 1mm difference in reach between the two, which given human measurement error, isn’t that far off from equal.
So I’m still left thinking that they share the same geometry.
What am I missing?
What am I missing?
Apparently you’re missing 14mm?
I have made the transition and move from P2SL (now P1) to P2 to P3 and have kept the P2SL as my everyday trainer. You can easily get the exact same postion between models. I think the head tube is shorter on the P3 so here would be a limit, but not coming off a P1 to P3. Another subtle difference is saddle position on the P1 can go a little further forward than P2/P3 secondary to seat post differences. This is very small difference and would not impact you unless you are jammed to very end of P1 (measures with plumb bob from nose to BB) I ran same stem on P2 and match my P1 position no problem. You could always go 10mm shorter stem if needed. Ended up going with more drop eventually which went beyond limits on P1 as standard stem and aerobars are right on top head tube (no spacers). So you have more drop potential on P3.
Cheers!
Just for reference
P2 geometry
http://cervelo.com/en_us/bikes/2011/P2/geometry/
P3 geometry
http://cervelo.com/en_us/bikes/2011/P3/geometry/
matt
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Interesting the stack is lower on the larger models of the P1 than the P2
http://cervelo.com/en_us/bikes/2011/P1/geometry/
jaretj
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But why are cervelo’s listed measurements different than ST’s database? According to them, there isn’t a 14mm difference.
Sure, but I’m comparing the P1 (same geometry as the P2sl according to this site’s members) and the P3.
If you get a moment, I’d love to have you measure your P3 and P2sl (assuming both are the same frame size) to compare:
Head Tube Length
Stack (BB to top of the Top Tube would be great)
Reach (Head Tube back to BB along the Top Tube where you measured the stack would work)
I appreciate your input and thoughts about this, sounds like I’m fine getting a P3 frameset.
Thanks,
steve
But why are cervelo’s listed measurements different than ST’s database? According to them, there isn’t a 14mm difference.
Ask Cervelo.
I might be able to offer a slight bit of insight as i had a similar question. I have ridden a P1 for the last two years, but after a retul fit was recommended towards the p3 (i am upgrading next year–waiting to see the new px) because of the lower stack. On my P1 i am as low as possible but could go lower. My understanding is that the p3 is a lower bike than the p1/p2, please correct me if i am wrong.
Ok, but here’s what I’m all pissy about-
The P2 has a totally different geometry than the P3.
But the P1 (and supposedly it’s twin, the P2sl) and the P3 have identical geometry, according to Cervelo.
Thanks,
steve
Ok, but here’s what I’m all pissy about-
The P2 has a totally different geometry than the P3.
But the P1 (and supposedly it’s twin, the P2sl) and the P3 have identical geometry, according to Cervelo.
Thanks,
steve
On a P2, are you riding in a slammed position with no spacers under the stem?
I suspect that Cervelo actually do have it wrong on their website at the moment.
A couple of years ago when I was shopping, I swear they listed the P1’s geometry as being the same as the P2, while the P3 and 4 were different (but identical to each other).
It wouldn’t surprise me if someone pasted the wrong geometry chart on the P1’s page when it was updated some time in the recent past.
I apologize in advance for my whiney attitude and beating a dead horse approach about this.
Cervelo lists on their site the geometry for the P1 and the P3* and *the P4 being the exact same.
Why would Cervelo be in error about their own frames?
The slowtwitch database (albeit for size 54 P1/P3) shows a 14mm difference in stack and a 1mm difference in reach between the two, which given human measurement error, isn’t that far off from equal.
So I’m still left thinking that they share the same geometry.
What am I missing?
Cervelo Does not say that the geometry is the ‘exact’ same. In fact, they point out a key difference. (perhaps their is an error, but I just haven’t found it)
“Cervélo geometry offers two large benefits:…
It offers a very wide range of positioning option thanks to the seatpost design and the different headtube lengths between the P1/P2 and the P3/P4.”
(http://www.cervelo.com/en_us/bikes/2011/P1/geometry/)
Based on the description, I would interpret the P1 and P2 to have similar headtube lenghts, and these would be different from the P3/P4.
I would imagine that the slowtwitch data based is updated by someone other than Cervelo. It’s very likely that the data entered into the Slowtwitch database was either wrong, or true a few years ago (but no longer current). When in doubt, I would trust Cervelo’s site over the Slowtwitch data base
Also, try to think of the P1 as the evolution of the P2SL and Dual. The P1 takes elements from both bikes, but does not copy them exactly.
I’m riding a P2sl without spacers, and could go a little lower.
While I’ve been under the impression the P1=P2sl, could that be wrong?