In which Kristin and Beth talk about her second elite athletic career, her anti-doping violation ban (and ongoing lawsuit against the supplement manufacturer), the apparel brand, and more.
Would have liked to hear more about the lawsuit but I understand she may not want to share many details while it’s still active. Did the salt supplement (can’t remember the mfg) lot# ever get tested after the fact?
If I remember it all correctly:
Beth could prove her supplement was contaminated;I think there was another product within that batch that also had contamination, but;I recall there being an issue of cost when it came to having to test more of that production run that made it non-feasible for her defense;
As mentioned in the article, she’s not the only party on the athlete side of this one.
Can you do an interview with Beca Keat? Almost identical circumstances and was able to clear her name by proving contaminated supplement (along with about 3 others using same brand). Last we heard she was going to sue as well and then never heard anything.
Know it is a long time ago but the similarities are strong. I know Beca rebuilt her life/reputation and went on to build a huge professional environment.
Can you do an interview with Beca Keat? Almost identical circumstances and was able to clear her name by proving contaminated supplement (along with about 3 others using same brand). Last we heard she was going to sue as well and then never heard anything.
Know it is a long time ago but the similarities are strong. I know Beca rebuilt her life/reputation and went on to build a huge professional environment.An update to this one?
https://www.slowtwitch.com/Interview/Meet_Rebekah_Keat_415.html
Assume the claim against Hammer Nutrition (still in business) was proved/settled.
I thought the elephant in the room was going to be this Slowtwitch interview.
.
Can you do an interview with Beca Keat? Almost identical circumstances and was able to clear her name by proving contaminated supplement (along with about 3 others using same brand). Last we heard she was going to sue as well and then never heard anything.
Know it is a long time ago but the similarities are strong. I know Beca rebuilt her life/reputation and went on to build a huge professional environment.
Not so sure Keat cleared her name. In 2004 she failed her drug test after winning IMWA, testing positive for the steroid narandrostenedione. The Court of Arbitration for Sport stated that Keat could not show how the prohibited substance had entered her system. However in 2006, 2 years after she was popped, Keat produces an open bottle of Hammer Endurolyte, which is sent to WADA for testing. Lo and behold it tests positive for narandrostenedione. And it’s been the same situation for a bunch of other athletes that have claimed their samples were contaminated with prohibited substances and this includes Beth McKenzie. She claimed her salt tablets were contaminated with Ostarine and she sent WADA the salt tablets which then tested positive for Ostarine. You can’t have an athlete accused of doping sending WADA the samples?? It’s like a murder suspect providing police with the murder weapon which then turns out to have no traces of his fingerprints or DNA… You’re good to go bro, the knife was clean.
Shayna Jack (Oz swimmer) had her ban reduced because it was determined that it would be out of character for someone like her to dope. I think that means pretty white, straight girls don’t dope… she got popped and was unable to show how Lingandrol got in her system. I think she kissed a bodybuilder who had taken it or some shit… An athlete gets popped for PEDs, the burden of proof is on them to show that they did not dope. If they cannot do that, then they should be banned, period.
And Re Keat in 2011 the court ordered the entire action dismissed “without prejudice.”
The Shayna Jack deal was a crock from the beginning and the rationale behind lessening her suspension is suspect. I’ve always wanted a little PED action in my kisses, but so far my wife has failed to deliver.
Can you do an interview with Beca Keat? Almost identical circumstances and was able to clear her name by proving contaminated supplement (along with about 3 others using same brand). Last we heard she was going to sue as well and then never heard anything.
Know it is a long time ago but the similarities are strong. I know Beca rebuilt her life/reputation and went on to build a huge professional environment.An update to this one?
https://www.slowtwitch.com/...ebekah_Keat_415.html
Assume the claim against Hammer Nutrition (still in business) was proved/settled.
What Keat did was kind of clever. She spent 2 years and $60k trying to find a WADA approved lab to test her sample. The sample of Hammer Endurolyte SHE provided then tested positive for narandrostenedione which allowed her to take legal action against Hammer. She knew she had zero chance of proving that Hammer had provided her with contaminated products. The sample she had sent to the WADA lab had been opened. The legal action was not about winning, just the fact she was attempting to sue a company would show she was innocent…and Hammer could not counter with a defamation suit because a WADA approved lab had determined a Hammer product contained a banned substance. Kind of a win/win situation for Keat. So she can now say a WADA approved lab said her Hammer product was contaminated with a banned substance…
So if people are going to quaff all these potions/supplements, is the lesson (besides doing one’s level best to ensure they have certification of non-contamination) to keep an unopened sample of each ?batch, in case it comes back to bite you, months later?
True story:
Tester arrives at silly o’clock (designated hour on Whereabouts).
da da da “What supplements are you taking?”
Answer: “None.”
Tester 2: “Oh! That’s very unusual.”
Hi! Although I’ve never been able to previously comment, due to reasons pointed out by earlier posters, I spoke to my attorney and can now say the following.
After the drawn-out saga (COVID delays, and finger pointing by the manufacturer up the supply chain), Carbo Pro did not defend themselves in the lawsuit, and they now appear to be out of business, which should be good news for all competitive athletes. If our lawsuit was part of the reason for Carbo Pro going out of business, then I am happy about that.
I’ve always sympathized with athletes wanting to know the name of the supplement to protect themselves, but have not been able to comment due to the course of legal action.
I won’t comment much more on the particulars of the case, but an internet sleuth did some pretty good digging back in 2016 to warn about this product; https://triman.livejournal.com/284783.html
I’m sure that this will come to a shock to many who believe that the only contaminated supplements are ones with big red flags like ‘Testo Boost 5000’.
I will do a separate post on what I’ve personally done since 2018 to avoid anything like this happening in the future to myself or anyone else.
I respect the slowtwitch community for always opening the narrative on difficult topics. However, I will only engage with positive comments that support the goal of clean athletes avoiding situations like this (i also think/hope, in 2024, it is now easier for us to avoid).
Off for a run!
Beth
Off for a run!
BethCongrats on your run in the Blue Mountains.
So if people are going to quaff all these potions/supplements, is the lesson (besides doing one’s level best to ensure they have certification of non-contamination) to keep an unopened sample of each ?batch, in case it comes back to bite you, months later?
True story:
Tester arrives at silly o’clock (designated hour on Whereabouts).
da da da “What supplements are you taking?”
Answer: “None.”
Tester 2: “Oh! That’s very unusual.”
I think the cases of athletes ingesting supplements contaminated with banned substances are extremely rare. There is no logical reason how norandrosteneidione ended up in Keat’s Hammer Endurolyte. And after 27 years of conducting business in Australia, there had only ever been one Hammer sample that had been reported as being contaminated, that being Keats. And the sample she provided was 2 years after the fact and the sample had been opened. So I don’t think athletes have to be especially cautious, other than ensuring they purchase supplements from a reputable supplier.
I don’t believe in witch hunts, sometimes people make mistakes, but re this issue, there shouldn’t be any controversy, it should be black and white. If an athlete gets popped, the onus is on them to prove that their positive result stemmed from some kind of accidental ingestion or contaminated supplement. If they can’t do that then the ban stands. A pilot was recently charged as he was trying to fly a commercial airliner with coke in his system. He tried to claim his drink was spiked, but he had no proof. Onus was on him to provide an independent witness who saw the drink spiking or CCTV. Can you imagine if he rocked up at police station with an open bottle of beer with coke in it, trying to have that submitted as exculpatory evidence? He’d be laughed out of the station. So I don’t know why we treat athletes any differently. There seems to be this tendency to give them the benefit of the doubt. Why? If they get popped, they are a doper until they can prove otherwise. Perhaps that means some innocent athletes get banned, but I would imagine those occurrences would be very, very rare.
This would’ve Ben a great podcast, but maybe she’d want to hear and edit before it was released, same as she might’ve wanted to see a draft before it was posted
Or not - I have no idea how podcasts work … although I recently found a fancy mic in my daughter’s stuff that she left around before she moved, so she may have some insight?
I’ve been doing a bit of reading on Ostarine and it does seem that there have been a few companies that have sold supplements contaminated with Ostarine. So it is feasible that Beth and others have genuinely unknowingly ingested a banned substance. However Rebekah Keat’s situation seems entirely different. It doesn’t seem possible that a banned steroid can end up in nutrition bottle. And similarly with Shayna Jack, her defence is laughable and her ban reduction is also laughable. The problem is athletes that potentially have a genuine defence get bundled together with athletes with a laughable defence, so it becomes hard to seperate them.
The problem is athletes that potentially have a genuine defence get bundled together with athletes with a laughable defence, so it becomes hard to seperate them. //
You are the one that bundled her in with the others here on this thread, perhaps you owe her an apology for that??
Glad you did some reading up though on the subject, helps when having such a strong opinion of something you know nothing about…
The problem is athletes that potentially have a genuine defence get bundled together with athletes with a laughable defence, so it becomes hard to seperate them. //
You are the one that bundled her in with the others here on this thread, perhaps you owe her an apology for that??
Glad you did some reading up though on the subject, helps when having such a strong opinion of something you know nothing about…
I was not the one that mentioned Rebekah Keat, someone else did.I don’t have a strong opinion. My opinion is reflective of the legal system. If an athlete tests positive for a banned substance, the onus is on the athlete to prove that they did not knowingly ingest that banned substance. If they can’t do that, they are banned. Most/all of the banned athletes that I know about were not able to do that. Their guilt/innocence is irrelevant. So, I won’t be apologising to anyone. Note - an athlete providing WADA with an opened bottle of contaminated supplements is not proof. Are you trying to suggest it is proof?
The problem is athletes that potentially have a genuine defence get bundled together with athletes with a laughable defence, so it becomes hard to seperate them. //
You are the one that bundled her in with the others here on this thread, perhaps you owe her an apology for that??
Glad you did some reading up though on the subject, helps when having such a strong opinion of something you know nothing about…
And don’t confuse my post as some attempt to backpedal. There is evidence to suggest some companies sold supplements that potentially had traces of Ostarine. That is not proof that banned athletes accidently ingested contaminated supplements. I am simply adding context to the topic. There is no evidence to show companies sold products contaminated with norandrosteneidione, there is for Ostarine. That’s it. It does not absolve anyone of blame.