I am going to upgrade my stock 105 group to SRAM Force in the coming month. Money is tight but I have enough to get a ceramic bottom bracket if it is worth it. My LBS says its not worth it and I tend to trust their judgment. That said, what is your experience with ceramic BB’s and was it worth the extra $100+ to you? I’ve read people save a watt or three, tops.
In a word…NO
The only major new drivetrain technology affecting friction in recent years is the new trend of outboard-mounted oversized bottom bracket bearings. Perversely, these fancy new bottom brackets have significantly higher drag than the simple ones they replaced! Basically, the main thing you can do to minimize drivetrain friction is to keep your wheel hubs properly maintained and your chain oiled. Then, forget about it and move on to more important things.
no
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And a third: Nope. They do not return a commensurate time savings/performance benefit for their cost as compared to other performance upgrades of a similar cost (i.e. an aero helmet, more streamlined race apparel, better/more aero drink system, etc.)
I’m going to go against the grain here, usually I would defer to the experience and knowledge of some of the previous posters but I have specific experience in this case.
My road bike is equipped with Rival and the standard SRAM GXP bottom bracket. After riding this for several hundred miles I have to say, the bottom bracket sucks.
When I ordered the Force group for my tri bike, I did not get the standard bracket and instead opted to pay the extra $100 and get the ceramic BB. It’s definitely better than the standard bearing version but not worlds better than some other manufacturers standard BB (FSA for example).
This is the one and only gripe I have with SRAM. They use the GXP bottom brackets from TruVativ and the bearings in them are GARBAGE!
I’m 100% completely and utterly impressed, stoked, and happy with my decisions to purchase SRAM equipment though (I just need to upgrade the Rival BB to ceramic now).
Note: SRAM, Zipp, Campagnolo and or Shimano DO NOT produce bearings.
Note: SRAM, Zipp, Campagnolo and or Shimano DO NOT produce bearings.
I didn’t say that they manufacture bearings. I’m confused as to what this post means.
They didn’t buy me any speed. Dang.
It’s hard to beat the old Shimano Ultegra bottom bracket (pre-outboard bearings).
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They didn’t buy me any speed. Dang.
It’s hard to beat the old Shimano Ultegra bottom bracket (pre-outboard bearings).
.
+1. My wife’s bike has the 6500 BB. It beats the snot out of the 7700, 7800 DA BB, as well as a few Campy’s that I have spun. It is smoother than any other 6500 BB that I have tested it against. It is freakish, but when I ride it, I cannot tell the difference between it and my 7800 BB. I can definitely tell the difference between training vs racing wheels, or aero position vs road position.
In the December 4, 2006 issue of *Velo-News *there is a very nice article on page 40 by their technical editor Lennard Zinn. In the article Zinn compiles a chart of test data that compares the rotational resistance of, among others, an FSA Mega EXO steel ball bearing bottom bracket as compared to the same bottom bracket equipped with ceramic bearings.
His test results reveal an end result of **.09 **(nine one-hundredths) of a watt difference in rotational resistance. For the remaining results see the chart and test protocols on pages 41 and 42 of that issue.
Now, those test results being cited, I will tell you that I anecdotally *feel *some kind of difference between a standard FSA SLK Mega Exo configuration with steel balls and the K-Force Lite crankset I raced on this season (including Ironman Wisconsin and two 1/2 IM’s, Superfrog and Steelhead) equipped with ceramic balls. It *felt *like the bottom bracket was stiffer and pedalling somehow “easier”. I can say with a straight face it felt that way, and I’ve written that here on this forum before.
Now, as for whether this emotional response (this “feeling”) was a placebo effective of simply having the very nicest equipment on my bike for some important races, well, I would suggest that is a contributing factor and one that can’t be measured.
I read the test results of rotational resistance comparing ceramic to steel bearings and know that they will never get me that Kona spot or bump me up in my age category even a single spot. Only more and better training will do that given the equipment I am fortunate enough to have.
That doesn;t stop me from using it though simply because I like to have it. It makes me feel good and I like the idea of having a no compromise race machine even if I can;t find test results that overwhelmingly “prove” the stuff is better. It is just nice to have cool stuff. It also works pretty darn good too.
Finally, FSA made a good move in anodizing their ceramic equipped bottom brackets red. When I look down at my crank on a tough climb I actually think, “Hey, it ain’t the bike- I got the best stuff, I better pedal harder.” I know that makes me faster…
Good reply Tom - falls squarely into my experience as well.
I DO feel the “smoothness” (even before the install) of the new red-cupped FSA ceramic BB vs. 1) Old Ultegra and 2) Old FSA Mega Exo BB. Like the red too 
My roadie buddies ask: “how many watts you save with that?” I usually reply (with my best guess) about 1 watt. They say, well, if you need a new BB at least that is something. I say, “no, 1 watt with ALL my Ceramic stuff - including derailler pulleys!”
Are they worth the money - probably not. But, like Tom, I also wanted a no compromise machine under me. Tis’ my hobby and cost wasn’t really an issue. Now that I can keep up with all of my roadie buddies, I don’t ragged on as much with my stupid bling upgrades
Do the ceramics count on my zipps about a “no compromise machine under me”?
Dave
Ah, sure! But for you, they would likely need to be dimpled …
Unless you have improved everything on and off of the bike, I would say absolutely not. While I never used them on a bike, I tried a set for my old RC race car. I spent as much on the bearings as I did on the rolling chassis, and my lap times went down 00:00:0.005!!! The only benefit for the bearings was that I recouped the entire price of the bearings when I sold the car because everybody was hot on the ceramic bearings…
Found one old-school solution for silky bearings: get an older Campy hub, run it with no shields, and rebuild the hub after the race. Old-school BBs would be almost the same: rebuild before every event.
Some folks were talking about their bearings wearing out (brinelling I would presume). Just hit reply on your name maybe.
They sure feel cool in the store, and should make you go faster by how trick they are.
I have worked on some pro and top amateurs bikes that the cranks would hardly spin without a bunch of help, and wheel bearings that I would have trashed long before, and brakes rubbing on rims. But you ride the bike on a road test, and it feels like any other bike. A few watts lost here and there on bearings don’t seem to lose many races, that I have seen.
Unless you experienced it, you would not believe how many pros and top agegroupers that don’t travel with their own wrench, ride terribly adjusted equipment. Ask any mechanic at the events, they all have their work horror stories just like you do at your job. Cracked frames, wheels, steerers, stems, square bearings you name it.
My vote is yes, if you have the disposible income to afford them they are worth it, just to have.
Until yesterday I would have said no…but, yesterday I received my first two sets of Sram Red Cranks and ceramic bb. I was amazed at how smooth and effortlessly they spin. Even with a chain on, spinning the cranks feels like glass. The cranks spin about 15-20 revolutions w/o the chain on… which is at least 5 times longer than stand bb.
So, I would say yes.
If money is tight no–much beer things to spend the $ on.
That said, I would never buy another bike without ceramics everywhere. I’m 50 and I’ve made (and continue to make) a lot of compromises in my life to raise my four kids. The one area I’ve decided to NOT compromise is triathlon. My attitude towards my Tri equipment is to get the best I can get. I have no idea if they make me faster but I sure love how they feel and I love knowing I’ve got a killer machine under me…
rc
In the December 4, 2006 issue of *Velo-News *there is a very nice article on page 40 by their technical editor Lennard Zinn. In the article Zinn compiles a chart of test data that compares the rotational resistance of, among others, an FSA Mega EXO steel ball bearing bottom bracket as compared to the same bottom bracket equipped with ceramic bearings.
His test results reveal an end result of **.09 **(nine one-hundredths) of a watt difference in rotational resistance. For the remaining results see the chart and test protocols on pages 41 and 42 of that issue.
I believe that article also showed that the square taper bottom brackets took less power to spin than the external cup BBs. But again, we are talking 1/10ths of watts here. At most.
Another way of looking at it: if total drivetrain losses are something like 10 watts, and assuming generously that the BB accounts for half of that, the 4% saved with ceramic bearings is 0.2 watts.
Rik
It’s hard to beat the old Shimano Ultegra bottom bracket (pre-outboard bearings).
Yeah…too bad they don’t make them anymore. 