And ANOTHER big thank you to my friends at Cervelo

Triathlon Forum
1

It’s like this- and this is not an ass-kissing contest.

Basically, Cervelo rules in my book. Here’s why:

  1. For the past two years we politely (and sometimes not so politely) mentioned we were disappointed with the supply of Cervelo bikes. People had to wait for them and it was, well, a hassle. They are great bikes worth the wait, but people didn’t wait. Cervelo promised us better delivery.

  2. They delivered on their promise. Almost every Cervelo Dual, P2K, Soloist Team and Soloist 105 we ordered for 2004 will be in our store on Tuesday. For the first time ever we have Cervelos- theiir hottest bikes, P2Ks, Dual and Soloists- available for open sale.

  3. Cervelo has not messed up good designs. Their proven designs feature a few minor refinements (forks, seatposts, component kits) for 2004 and the rest, which already worked, they left alone. Realistically, that is a big part of the reason they can deliver on promise #1.

  4. They have been flexible. Cervelo has consistently looked for solutions to problems and a way to help us get and sell more bikes. Sharon, Heather and Christy at Cervelo have done an amazing job looking for creative ways to get bikes in our doors so customers can get on their bikes in time for the season.

Cervelo, as a bike, has a few distinct features and benefits that make many of them a little better than a lot of what is out there, or, in the case of the P2K and P3 and Soloist- a lot better in many ways.

However, as a company, they have been very good to us. I appreciate that very much. It seems appropriate to say thank you.

Also, If you choose to buy a Cervelo becasue you find it fits your measurements and needs well, I believe- based on my experience, you’ll get good service from them after the sale.

My .02 cents and a shameless plug for Cervelo because I believe in them: I can sell any bike I want to, but first I have to buy it.

2

I’m bumping this up to put it above the thread underneath it (right now) to illustrate why I am saying thank you to Cervelo.

3

every time trek or specialized or other flagship bike company (or wheel company, or handlebar company) decides to “take on” triathlon and move the smaller, tri-specific companies out, i get a rash of people asking me whether “that’s it” for QR, cervelo, hed, zipp, syntace, profile or whomever. that’s a big laugh.

trek, specialized, mavic, campy, 3T, cinelli, deda, o’neil, bodyglove or anyone whoever tries to get triathlon market share always fails, except if they get market share only because triathletes choose their road race stuff. the good companies who come up in triathlon know what they’re doing, and history proves they have a better chance of moving out the big players than the reverse.

4

“history proves they have a better chance of moving out the big players than the reverse.”

It always amazes how the big bike companies just don’t seem to get it. Surely Giant, just as an example, has the resources to produce a cheaper Cervelo and thus put the small guy out of business. Must have something to do with the big beauracracy of the big corporation not understanding the niche market that the small company thrives in.

I don’t see a lot of difference between big corps and big government. Obviously a lot of ineffeciency in both.

5

For a lot of bike companies and retailers, triathlon is the latest “big thing”. Dan is banking the long cash bringing the new guard of “tri shops” out to FIST, and it is a step in the right direction for them.

But he (Dan) is right and so are you cerveloguy. The guys who are really into triathlon were into it 10 years ago (or longer). The ones that are jumping on board now with their “tri shops” and “bike fitters” are here today, but where will they be tomorrow? Recumbents? Adventure racing? It’s just another trend for them. And trends come and go.

6

It’s time for a new ride and I’ve been considering a p3. Does anyone know a good fitter in the northern california area that sells Cervelos?

7

trek, specialized, mavic, campy, 3T, cinelli, deda, o’neil, bodyglove or anyone whoever tries to get triathlon market share always fails, …

Uhmm, well, Mavic cxp33 with 36 spokes and DA hubs is the best training wheel on this planet - IMHO.
And, when I was into windsurfing in the 80ies, bodyglove made the best neopren suits - I still have two of them in my cellar - sadly Bavaria has no ocean nearby so I have to concentrate on triathlon which is only secondbest to windsurfing … ;-((

regards,
Frank

9

Cervelo is a good company and they make great products at a fair price. Gerard responds to almost everyone personally who has questions or problems. My P3 is a great bike.

Now if I could only get that carbon seatpost it was supposed to have. (I know their working on it.)

Mark Roberts

10

“Uhmm, well, Mavic cxp33 with 36 spokes… And, when I was into windsurfing in the 80ies, bodyglove”

i don’t have my post in front of me, but didn’t i say that these companies obviously do fine when triathletes’ needs are for the stuff they make for their road markets already?

got a bodyglove tri suit? using mavic for your aero wheels? mavic sponsored the posties, had mechanics and tech support in france, was a french company, supplied the posties their other wheels, and the posties STILL used hed’s aero wheels in timed races.

OTOH, sram, oakley and giro started primarily as companies selling to triathletes, and if you’re riding a trek OCLV today it’s thanks to the fear of god that kestrel put into them. i’d have to think hard to come up with one product a large road company produced specifically for the triathlon market that has “made it,” but i can think of a ton of stuff that started in triathlon that crossed over to road (not to mention the craze in black, smoothskin surfsuits not long after tri suits first came out).

11

Frank, wasn’t there enough wind on the Rothsee yesterday ?! ;-).

I was on my Cervelo: On way with 25kmh, back with 40kmh. On the return I liked the wind/storm.

Felix

I ran around the Rothsee yesterday. It was about 5 beaufort constant and gusts up to 7 beaufort. Despite wearing a windstopper shirt it was VERY COLD. It reminded me a little of Lanzarote where I did some riding in such windy conditions. There were days where I rode uphill faster than downhill. And it was really dangerous when having wind from the side.

regards,
Frank

12

I can think of one product - San Marco Azoto / aspide triathlon saddle. Beyond that, it’s hard to say.

Specialized trispoke, perhaps (although the concept was first tested by a couple of smaller companies, Trispoke and Aerospoke. Also, I’m not sure if that would be classed as a product aimed specifically at triathletes or not, certainly triathletes were the early adopters.

Velcro shoe closures?? My memory is too fuzzy to remember if the first velcro shoes were aimed a triathletes or not. I remember owning a pair of Sidi Triathlons circa 1986.

To be fair to the road companies, in recent years they have been bullied by the UCI into a lack of real innovation, as anytime that they think of something unique it gets banned. The traditional road co’s feel that if they develop something for the tri market, it also needs to cross over to the road market.

J

13

I disagree with you. I think the big companies do get it, which is why they are big companies. In the world of bicycle manufacturing, Triathlon is a very small niche. I would speculate that for every 1000 road bikes sold in the US, maybe 1 is a steep geometry tri-specific bike - and that number is probably high. Why would Giant bother producing a P3 replica and sell a few thousand copies when they could invest the design and marketing $$ in a road bike that will sell a gazillion copies? For a few $$ more, Giant pays a Triathlete to ride the road frame and all of a sudden, the TCR is a “viable” Triathlon frame. Truth is, Luke Bell, like most pros, could ride just about anything and still compete.

Ironically, Triathletes buy in to this notion that the TCR is suddenly a tri bike and start raving about it on this site. How many times have you read “just put on a thomson seat post and slide it all the way forward…”. That’s success. Giant met their goal.

Maybe the reason that the tri-specific efforts on the part of big bike manufacturers always fail is because the big bike manufacturers are allready succesful enough in the Tri market, and the niche bikes don’t add anything to the bottom line. Perhaps the only mistake they made was green-lighting the tri-specific product line in the first place.

Who can tell me what the #1 bike brand at Kona was? Here’s a hint, they don’t make a tri-specific bike…

CREDIBILITY DISCLAIMER: I know nothing about the bike industry, the numbers were pulled directly from my butt. Could be that 1 in 5 road bikes sold has a tri geometry, in which case my “niche market” argument is crap. You have better numbers? Post em.

14

“I disagree with you. I think the big companies do get it, which is why they are big companies.”

you’re right. that’s why they ought to stay out of the tri milieu, because they get their ass kicked when the try to compete. of course, as an alternative, they might ought to just do tri correctly.

think about it. trek, c’dale, whomever, they all started out by biting off a niche (touring, racing, apparel, accessories, trailers, tires). the only reason kestrel didn’t turn into a big company was because of 5 successive owners (scwhinn, nippon steel, etc.) who were unequipped, stupid, obtuse, arrogant, or whatever. save for a zig where they should’ve zagged, it would be kestrel owning the monocoque carbon road bike market, not trek. even today, were specialized to buy kestrel (which it should’ve done several years ago) that would be another triathlon-to-riches success story. instead specialized is farting around with its half carbon stuff instead of just buying kestrel/calfee/whomever and doing this thing right.

the only road companies to really make a dent in triathlon are those who have no tri-specific companies to compete against. someone mentioned the example of selle san marco. yes. three things going on here. first, there’s no such thing as a tri saddle company to compete against. second, for the most part SSM listened to what triathletes wanted and made the saddle. third, this IS a big success for SSM. you CAN make good money in tri, if you do it right. trek, specialized, etc., could be more successful in the tri market, and keep the cervelos, kestrels of the world from getting a leg up. but they just… don’t… listen…

and why should they listen? there is an easier way for a large company to keep the small company down. just push your weight around. make a retailer take a tall order of stuff he can barely pay for, so has little money left over to invest in second and third brands. i can name a few companies who, over the last 15 years, relied on that tactic instead of just making products companies wanted to buy. but IBDs are notoriously resistent to that, and that’s why the cervelos of the world will always be nipping at the heels of the larger companies.

15

Transition Sports - San Leandro

www.transitionsports.com.

16

No, the big companies do not get it. And as a result, there is only one place for them to go. Trek is at a crossroads. The Lance phenomenon has 1-2 years mileage on it at most. Then what? Even in a vacuum Trek has nothing beyond the next two years to maintain brand equity. Their product doesn;t do it in the tri market. Their road product is as good as anything, but no better. It is solid, but unspectacular. Since they aren’t in a vacuum there will be another success story. An emerging, snowballing one is Cervelo. The CSC team association went a long to establishing the brand equity and visibility that Cervelo deserves. It also helped them refine and improve their products.

Another, and more troubling phenomenon is when small companies try to get big. But that may be another thread altogether…

17

Try Transition Sports in San Leandro.

They carry Cervelo, and are FIST certified. Last time I was up there, I didn’t see any P3’s though. Kraig is great, fit me on my softride, the bike fits like a glove now.

18

Tom,

I think that the big companies can, “get it” and that from time to time they can come up with th right product. However, due to both their own bureacracy and consumer behaviour it can be a huge challenge for them to make any headway.

Witness the running shoe market right now. New Balance, Asics and Saucony own the “serious runner” market right now. I think Runner’s World magazine calls anyone who runs more than 2X a week a “serious runner”!! Nike, who ironically invented this category 25 years ago, and Reebok are trying to get back into the market. It’ proven to be a huge challenge for them. Amongst dedicated runners, it’s hard to give away a Reebok or Nike running shoe. Yet both companies have great product out there. Despite spending huge amounts of resources, time and money both Nike and Reebok have made little headway and I think that this is due mainly to consumer behaviour - the dedicated runner believes, the NB, Asics and Saucony are making their shoes.

19

has anyone heard about the 70mm film that was done on the tour de france and specifically team CSC who were riding CERVELO…when is it coming out…with the drama of the last tour and tyler’s heroic tale…biking and cervelo will get great publicity!!! seems like cervelo is in the right place at the right time…

20

"The Lance phenomenon has 1-2 years mileage on it at most. Then what? Even in a vacuum Trek has nothing beyond the next two years to maintain brand equity. "

How about TrekTravel? How many other big bike manufacturers out are have a diversified portfolio of products like Trek? Calapsable/portable bikes, comfort bikes, cyclocross bikes, mountain bikes…seems like a lot of areas to maintain their brand equity to me.

They might not have the depth in the tri market you think is so critically important - but they do have product breadth and when Trek, WHO ONLY SELLS TO IBDs, has to compete against the Pacific Cycles of the world who are selling the Schwinn, Mongoose and GT lines to Wal-Mart now, sees an opportunity to supply their dealers with an Equinox series of bikes b/c the IBD wants to carry a few bikes for people who can actually afford two bikes - then we should applaud them.

Trek is not perfect, but they are competing on a global scale with entire shops to outfit - IBD’s depend on their financial support and ability to deliver bikes ON TIME and with appropriate quality guarantees.

Trek was big before Lance, huge with him, and like all solid companies - they have a succession plan to thrive without him…

Trek was started in a barn by a couple of friends…a lot like Cervelo, nix the barn.

21

As I only recently got into triathlons this year, I did a lot of research when I decided to buy a bike (after doing a season to ensure I’d want to continue in the sport). As a consumer, several things really appealed to me about Cervelo:

  1. Their devotion to customer satisfaction and manufacturing standards is the stuff of legends. How many other manufacturing companies would scrap their entire first production run because it wasn’t up to standard, and thus ensure that many stores would be short '03 product line (at least as I understand it)? Clearly, that wasn’t a decision made by profit motive, or at least short term profit motive. Kids, that’s what we call building brand equity.

  2. The fact that their entry and mid-level tri bikes are not just cheap road bikes with aero’s slapped on, and a seat pushed waaaay forward. Obviously, they listened to consumers, and really built some killer bikes that give you a hell of a lot of bang for the buck. With adjustable geometry to boot on the Dual.

  3. The classy way they handled Tyler’s departure at the end of the season.

  4. Months after I bought the bike, they continue to impress me. I met Gerard Vrooman and a member of the Cervelo staff at the Endurosport open house in Toronto a few weeks back. They were down to earth, laid back, and Gerard REALLY listened to my questions (despite the fact they bordered on nonsensical). Very cool to be able to meet the guy who designed your bike.

  5. Hey, it’s always nice to buy Canadian, as well. Though on second thought, I had to travel 5 hours to Bikesport in Detroit to do it. :wink: That’s what happens when you make a popular bike, and end up scrapping the first run.

I was fortunate, in that a Dual fit me well, and fit my budget. It helped that I got a killer deal at Bikesport, and I haven’t had buyer’s remorse for even a second.