Long story short, it’s looking like my 2011 Shiv with nose cone will be replaced with a 2012 Shiv with NO nose cone…so does anyone have an idea on what is the aero difference (if any?) between the frames with and without the nose cone? Just curious if there’s any difference…
There is a difference. But it’ll depend on the yaw angle. The higher the yaw angle, the more the nosecone makes a difference. I don’t have a chart of the two overlayed side-by-side. There’s enough of a difference that you’d choose to race the nosecone if you could, but the no-nosecone bike is still very fast.
Thanks, kind of what i figured, the higher yaw more benefit with the nose cone. Oh well not much I can do about it it is what it is…No more nose cone option on the Shiv right? I really liked the bike with the cone.
Do you know if I can take my old fork and bars off a 2011 so I can use them on a 2012 frame and use the nose cone?
There is a difference. But it’ll depend on the yaw angle. The higher the yaw angle, the more the nosecone makes a difference. I don’t have a chart of the two overlayed side-by-side. There’s enough of a difference that you’d choose to race the nosecone if you could, but the no-nosecone bike is still very fast.
Right…but the real question then is: “Is the no-nose-cone-Shiv faster than a Transition?” (fins or no fins) 
Hmmm…good question; that would be interesting to see. It would be nice if Specialized would at least have a retro-fit kit to install the nose cone for those of us that do not care about UCI compliance.
I hate to think that my “new” replacement bike is slower than my original bike…and since I took 4th place in my AG at IMCDA by 16 seconds (and only 2 mins over 6th), I do know that every second counts, even in an IM!
I’d not heard that. Remember that the 2012 early launch is not complete yet. It was MY UNDERSTANDING (which obviously fallible) that the nosecone Shiv was going to continue to be sold. But I can find out.
My bad. The nosecone is indeed going away for '12.
I can appreciate your dilemma. And I wish I had a better answer for you. I will say that the base frame is the same. So if you find someone with a nosecone and fork that wants to sell it, you could use it. Maybe some TTer with a Shiv has that laying around? Wish I knew…
Thanks. I have a 2011 Shiv with a nose cone. The frame cracked and is being replaced…which is why I wonder if I can use my '11 fork, nose and base bar and install it on the 2012 frame.
Do you think the aero benefits of the nose cone are worth it to keep the '11 fork/base bar and install on a new frame?
Or can I simply install my existing nose cone on the new frame/fork?
Yes, keep your existing parts and throw them on the '12 frame. You cannot use the '12 fork. Here’s how the setup works:
Nosecone:
- brake is inside nosecone
- fork is “clean,” except for cutouts for brake shoe carriers
No-Nosecone:
- brake is on front fork
- fork has two bosses for special center pull brake
So they are totally incompatible front ends. You need the whole front end (minus base bar / risers / extensions / pads) that is designed for one or the other.
Thanks…great to hear!
I thought I heard the base bars were also not compatible, or are they? From what you wrote, it looks like I can use the new base bar (with the straight bull horns) on the old nosecone, right?
Also, do you think the aero benefits worth it? At this point it sounds petty, but the paint schemes between the 2 might look a little ‘funky’ so I just want to make sure there is a noticeable benefit. FWIW, I avg 22mph in an IM and 24-26 for HIM and shorter, so on the higher yaw end.
sounds like it is time to strip off ALL the paint.
and go fully gold!
Thanks…great to hear!
I thought I heard the base bars were also not compatible, or are they? From what you wrote, it looks like I can use the new base bar (with the straight bull horns) on the old nosecone, right?
I think so. I know it was compatible on the '11 setup, and I don’t think that’s changed at all.
Also, do you think the aero benefits worth it?
Yes I do.
At this point it sounds petty, but the paint schemes between the 2 might look a little ‘funky’ so I just want to make sure there is a noticeable benefit. FWIW, I avg 22mph in an IM and 24-26 for HIM and shorter, so on the higher yaw end.
That’s why there are places like HotTubes.
The bars can be switched. The first Shiv I had came with 4:1 bars and I swapped out with 3:1.
Aren’t the production frames and forks specific to each model i.e. not interchangable at all?
The original nosecone frame had the aero gussets behind the fork, but the new UCI frame has those moved to the fork?
Original - http://img.tredz.co.uk/prodimg/37634_1_Zoom.jpg
UCI - http://www.primera-sports.com/system/cache/specialized-2012-s-works-shiv-tt-module_productImages_9618-1-15949_800_800_False.png
Aren’t the production frames and forks specific to each model i.e. not interchangable at all?
The original nosecone frame had the aero gussets behind the fork, but the new UCI frame has those moved to the fork?
Original - http://img.tredz.co.uk/...img/37634_1_Zoom.jpg
UCI - http://www.primera-sports.com/...49_800_800_False.png
I think that means you can use the old fork in the new frame, but not vice-versa…
I suggested this to Mark Cote a LONG time ago, but it sounds as if Specialized should simply come out with a “Triathlon” module that consists of a nose-cone fork that fits on the latest Shiv. That way, whoever wants to run the nosecone (i.e. triathletes) still can.
Yeah, I thougth afterwards that it might be possible to “assemble” the new frame and old fork combo.
Of course the aero fit behind the bottom of the headtube is then not going to be quite as smooth as it would have been.
You’re right that would be ideal. A triathlon module or version would be perfect…maybe they’ll come out with a retro-fit/upgrade package. Kind of like the P4 Evo.
From this I guess it’s time to compromise: nose cone, plus gap in fork, or better fit on the fork but no nose cone…just not sure which is better (although I know neither is really a bad option).
This is kind of off-topic, but as a sponsored Specialized athlete; will you hang onto your faster UCI illegal 2011 Shiv with nosecone, or ride a slightly slower 2012 UCI legal Shiv with no nosecone next year? Or do the fork/nosecone swap with your 2011?
I can’t imagine Jordan gives a rat’s a$$ about UCI legality. Faster bikes trump slower bikes, period.
Tom, why don’t you shoot Mark a PM? I’d bet he is able to answer your query, or at least provide some insight as to the best solution.
Also, I don’t know what shop you have handling your warranty, but you might want them to speak w/ the warranty rep & see what’s in stock in the warehouse. They tend to have a decent supply of warrantied items sitting around that are not typically available to the general public. Somebody might have had a small and inconsequential issue with an '11 Shiv, so they warrantied it for a new one, and now it’s just sitting around. I know Shiv stock was typically paltry, but it might be worth a shot to see if you can get a NOS '11, instead of dealing with your current situation.