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Re: Marathon Squared Challenge [damon.lebeouf] [ In reply to ]
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I was out there! Very cool event yesterday!

I've got some photos in an album here:

https://www.scottflathousephoto.com/events
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Re: Marathon Squared Challenge [Flathouse] [ In reply to ]
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Flathouse wrote:
I was out there! Very cool event yesterday!

I've got some photos in an album here:

https://www.scottflathousephoto.com/events

your work is awesome. your area is lucky to have your talent around to capture us racing!

80/20 Endurance Ambassador
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Re: Marathon Squared Challenge [Dr. Tigerchik] [ In reply to ]
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Race went great. Everyone finished the swim. The water and conditions for the first 3.5 hours in the swim were good. We had a little delay in the morning with some fog that hid the first turn buoy. But we figured out a solution. At about 3.5 hours into the swim the wind picked up considerably and it got a little rough. The grouping of the top three men(Tyler, Matt and Justin) was fairly tight on the 10k. They all finished within 5 minutes of one another. The temperature on the run course heated up quickly. By Lisa’s final loop on the run it was 95 degrees.

Tyler Blackburn, a local age grouper, led out the swim and made it through about 4 miles on the run He called it a day when his heart rate spiked and his pace slowed dramatically. Matt was running a few hundred yards back and passed him and held pace for the remainder of day. He looked solid and ran a 2:46 on a course that end up being about .2 long.

Justin started his second loop with Lisa on her first loop. They ran together for the majority of the race. Scott Flathouse, great local photographer, got some cool photos of them running together.

We had volunteers in two cars going around on the course supporting the athletes with mobile aid stations. We were able to get them what they needed every mile or so. The biggest concern was the heat on the day. In Texas at this time of year it can either be perfect or not so perfect.

After a long day and an event that many of us had talked about for a bunch of years, Matt Hanson officially became the first athlete to swim a 10k Marathon swim in under 3 hours and run a Marathon in under 3 hours. He also completed the entire single day event in less than 6 hours with transition. And Justin and Lisa became the second and third finishers of a first time event.

We couldn’t have put this race on without all the support from the local community. Aaron Thomas sponsored the majority of the pro prize purse, Scott Flathouse came out to document the event, Kim Bowden is a tireless volunteer at many local running, swimming and triathlon events and thanks to Slowtwitch and Lars for spreading the word about what we were doing.

Thanks for checking in and if you have any other questions, please let me know.

Tim

http://www.magnoliamasters.com
http://www.snappingtortuga.com
http://www.swimeasyspeed.com
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Re: Marathon Squared Challenge [SnappingT] [ In reply to ]
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Cool stuff. I'm potentially game for next year.

maybe she's born with it, maybe it's chlorine
If you're injured and need some sympathy, PM me and I'm very happy to write back.
disclaimer: PhD not MD
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Re: Marathon Squared Challenge [Dr. Tigerchik] [ In reply to ]
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Great. Like I said I’ll keep you in the loop. We are planning on late September/early October next year.

http://www.magnoliamasters.com
http://www.snappingtortuga.com
http://www.swimeasyspeed.com
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Re: Marathon Squared Challenge [SnappingT] [ In reply to ]
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SnappingT wrote:
Race went great. Everyone finished the swim. The water and conditions for the first 3.5 hours in the swim were good. We had a little delay in the morning with some fog that hid the first turn buoy. But we figured out a solution. At about 3.5 hours into the swim the wind picked up considerably and it got a little rough. The grouping of the top three men(Tyler, Matt and Justin) was fairly tight on the 10k. They all finished within 5 minutes of one another. The temperature on the run course heated up quickly. By Lisa’s final loop on the run it was 95 degrees.

Tyler Blackburn, a local age grouper, led out the swim and made it through about 4 miles on the run He called it a day when his heart rate spiked and his pace slowed dramatically. Matt was running a few hundred yards back and passed him and held pace for the remainder of day. He looked solid and ran a 2:46 on a course that end up being about .2 long.

Justin started his second loop with Lisa on her first loop. They ran together for the majority of the race. Scott Flathouse, great local photographer, got some cool photos of them running together.

We had volunteers in two cars going around on the course supporting the athletes with mobile aid stations. We were able to get them what they needed every mile or so. The biggest concern was the heat on the day. In Texas at this time of year it can either be perfect or not so perfect.

After a long day and an event that many of us had talked about for a bunch of years, Matt Hanson officially became the first athlete to swim a 10k Marathon swim in under 3 hours and run a Marathon in under 3 hours. He also completed the entire single day event in less than 6 hours with transition. And Justin and Lisa became the second and third finishers of a first time event.

We couldn’t have put this race on without all the support from the local community. Aaron Thomas sponsored the majority of the pro prize purse, Scott Flathouse came out to document the event, Kim Bowden is a tireless volunteer at many local running, swimming and triathlon events and thanks to Slowtwitch and Lars for spreading the word about what we were doing.

Thanks for checking in and if you have any other questions, please let me know.

Tim

Tim - Can you give us swim and run times for 5 starters??? Thanks, Eric.


"Anyone can be who they want to be IF they have the HUNGER and the DRIVE."
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Re: Marathon Squared Challenge [SnappingT] [ In reply to ]
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SnappingT wrote:
Great. Like I said I’ll keep you in the loop. We are planning on late September/early October next year.

Tim, what about a virtual one that could be achieveable for many age groupers. Over 48 hrs you total up 10km swimming and 42.2 km of running. Add up times for all your runs and all your swims. Get it done in two days. As we're limited by pool times, literally you need to try to get into four swim slots to get 10km done since swims are typically 45-60 min in most places!!!

I know it is not the same as continuous back to back, but it gives many people a challenge to shoot for during the pandemic. I think with pool limitations, if we give people 2 days its totally doable for many....then add up your times....rest and eat as much in between but the clock starts when you start each workout (so you have an incentive to spread out and use the entire time)

Dev

PS. (I did this 6 weeks ago during a training camp in Mont Tremblant that was really a bike climbing focused camp 230km of riding with 3800m of climbing, plus 10km swimming, plus 43km running spread over 10 workouts in 55 hrs).
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Re: Marathon Squared Challenge [ericmulk] [ In reply to ]
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Re: Marathon Squared Challenge [devashish_paul] [ In reply to ]
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Over the next couple weeks I’m going to roll out the Marathon Squared website to track everyone who is able to complete sub 3/ sub 3 /sub 6 in a single day, sub 3/sub 3 in a single day and sub 3 / sub 3 as stand alone events over their lifetime. If people can submit proof of time, I’ll post them into the records. I might consider a Covid virtual model. The biggest focus is going to be to get an event together for fall next year. We are already scouting locations to do it and we’ll see what the response looks like. It was a pretty cool event to watch and the athletes racing seemed to like it too. I’ll try to put together a couple podcasts with them so they can share their experiences.

Tim

http://www.magnoliamasters.com
http://www.snappingtortuga.com
http://www.swimeasyspeed.com
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Re: Marathon Squared Challenge [SnappingT] [ In reply to ]
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SnappingT wrote:
You can find the results here: http://snappingtortuga.com/...hon-squared-october/[/url]
If you have any questions, let me know.
Tim

Thanks Tim. I like the format of your event more than the swimrun events, since swimming sans wetsuit, paddles, and pull buoy is much more "pure", although now even FINA allows wetsuits if the water is cold enough. In any case, I like the idea of simply one long swim followed by one long run. You could have shorter events on the same day, e.g. 5K/13.1, 2.5K/6.55, and even a "sprint" 1.25K/3.28. You could just call the overall event "The Snapping T Swim/Run Series" or similar. Having AG awards would be nice also.


"Anyone can be who they want to be IF they have the HUNGER and the DRIVE."
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Re: Marathon Squared Challenge [ericmulk] [ In reply to ]
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Great. You are thinking exactly like we are about the event(s). For the next iteration, we'll open it up for a general registration and see how it goes. If you're interested, I'll keep you in the loop.

Tim

http://www.magnoliamasters.com
http://www.snappingtortuga.com
http://www.swimeasyspeed.com
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Re: Marathon Squared Challenge [ericmulk] [ In reply to ]
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here is a photo gallery on the homepage from Sunday

i didn't successfully complete the marathon run and only just barely made the 10km swim (2hrs, 56mins). i dropped out after ~ 4 miles of the run once my pace went below 6:52 min/mile needed for a 3-hour marathon. temps in the mid-90's certainly made it a scorcher out there!

it's a pretty unique skill set and mindset required to be able to successfully dip under that 3-hour mark in BOTH events, on the same day. i don't think it's a challenge that anyone but pros and/or the fastest elite age-groupers could complete in the same day format.

so your idea of breaking down the distance offerings is a good one to make it more doable and accessible because it's a cool challenge!

the sport of swimrun and this challenge are two very different beasts. swimrun interchanges swimming and running depending on what nature provides you and anything you start the race with (paddles, pull buoy, shoes, etc) you must carry to the finish.

this challenge was essentially an oversized/ultra aquathon. the marathon squared challenge in it's current format is far less accessible/doable than swimrun so it will be interesting to see where Tim decides to take this. but, i'm excited to toe the line the next time he offers one up!

Lars Finanger
Odyssey SwimRun
Last edited by: VALHALLA: Oct 13, 20 10:27
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Re: Marathon Squared Challenge [SnappingT] [ In reply to ]
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SnappingT wrote:
Great. You are thinking exactly like we are about the event(s). For the next iteration, we'll open it up for a general registration and see how it goes. If you're interested, I'll keep you in the loop.
Tim

Oh I am definitely interested as this type of event is my ideal, since I just never have really liked cycling all that much. BTW, the diff distances are very similar to the IsoMan series in England, minus the bike. The Iso guys use the shorter distances to get a bigger turnout such that they at least don't lose money putting on their events.


"Anyone can be who they want to be IF they have the HUNGER and the DRIVE."
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Re: Marathon Squared Challenge [VALHALLA] [ In reply to ]
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VALHALLA wrote:
here is a photo gallery on the homepage from Sunday
i didn't successfully complete the marathon run and only just barely made the 10km swim (2hrs, 56mins). i dropped out after ~ 4 miles of the run once my pace went below 6:52 min/mile needed for a 3-hour marathon. temps in the mid-90's certainly made it a scorcher out there!
it's a pretty unique skill set and mindset required to be able to successfully dip under that 3-hour mark in BOTH events, on the same day. i don't think it's a challenge that anyone but pros and/or the fastest elite age-groupers could complete in the same day format.
so your idea of breaking down the distance offerings is a good one to make it more doable and accessible because it's a cool challenge!
the sport of swimrun and this challenge are two very different beasts. swimrun interchanges swimming and running depending on what nature provides you and anything you start the race with (paddles, pull buoy, shoes, etc) you must carry to the finish.
this challenge was essentially an oversized/ultra aquathon. the marathon squared challenge in it's current format is far less accessible/doable than swimrun so it will be interesting to see where Tim decides to take this. but, i'm excited to toe the line the next time he offers one up!

Ya, I fully understand the differences betw swimrun and aquathlon. With respect, I just prefer the traditional aquathlon format b/c you don't need a partner, and b/c aquathlons usually give AG awards. The older I get, the more I appreciate AG awards. If I were still in my 30s and had a good fast girl for a partner, I'd be all over swimrun. :)


"Anyone can be who they want to be IF they have the HUNGER and the DRIVE."
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Re: Marathon Squared Challenge [VALHALLA] [ In reply to ]
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VALHALLA wrote:
here is a photo gallery on the homepage from Sunday

i didn't successfully complete the marathon run and only just barely made the 10km swim (2hrs, 56mins). i dropped out after ~ 4 miles of the run once my pace went below 6:52 min/mile needed for a 3-hour marathon. temps in the mid-90's certainly made it a scorcher out there!

it's a pretty unique skill set and mindset required to be able to successfully dip under that 3-hour mark in BOTH events, on the same day. i don't think it's a challenge that anyone but pros and/or the fastest elite age-groupers could complete in the same day format.

so your idea of breaking down the distance offerings is a good one to make it more doable and accessible because it's a cool challenge!

the sport of swimrun and this challenge are two very different beasts. swimrun interchanges swimming and running depending on what nature provides you and anything you start the race with (paddles, pull buoy, shoes, etc) you must carry to the finish.

this challenge was essentially an oversized/ultra aquathon. the marathon squared challenge in it's current format is far less accessible/doable than swimrun so it will be interesting to see where Tim decides to take this. but, i'm excited to toe the line the next time he offers one up!

Hey first of all, congrats on your day, but I think the race should not only be about going sub 3 in both....just do both distances and get a time.

I think you pretty well have to be a 2:40 marathoner and be a 55-60 min IM swimmer to achieve this. You have to be able to do 10km pretty easily and not be depleted starting the marathon. Unlike running a marathon off the bike, really in swimming, you can't consume that much along the way with spending a lot of time not moving. I have done a few 10km-12km swim races, but for those I was planning to be empty at the end, not topped up to do a full marathon. But when you are swimming moderately hard, you can't chew and swim, so its just drinking your liquid nutrition, or you literally stop, eat and restart. But if you're at the limit of making it at 3 hrs (3.3 km per hour pace of 1:48 per 100m), you don't have a lot of buffer to hang off the side of the kayak and spend 5-10 minutes refueling. So most of us would finish 10km swim kind of on empty and have to start the marathon topping up....but if you're trying to break 3 hrs on the run, topping up a lot of nutrition at 6:52 per mile pace is tough!!!

The half distance event would be fun. You could just do the swim full gas for 5000m and then get out and bang out a half marathon on coke and gels.
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Re: Marathon Squared Challenge [ericmulk] [ In reply to ]
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Many swimruns have had a Solo/Individual category for a few years now....can't help you with the AG awards. Like Tim's challenge over the weekend, sometimes hitting that finish line is reward enough!

Lars Finanger
Odyssey SwimRun
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Re: Marathon Squared Challenge [devashish_paul] [ In reply to ]
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you're pretty bang on with your assessment -- the handful of us who attempted the challenge had the strategy of conserving as much as possible during the swim leg in order to start the run as fresh as possible. it was very tough to feed during the swim (while treading water, not holding onto a kayak per OWS rules). weather played a huge role in Justin Daerr not making the marathon under 3 hrs imo. it was in the mid 90's during the run on a course without shade, so i'd have to imagine he'd be able to complete it otherwise. Justin still completed both distances. As did Lisa Roberts. Tyler Blackburn (the fastest swimmer on the the day) and I were the dnf's, pulling out 4-ish miles into the run, once we fell outside of 6:52 min/mile pace.

this was a first pass at this challenge so i think Tim is looking to make it more inviting to a wider pool of athletes. whether that means offering more distance options, i'm not exactly sure, but Matt Hanson certainly achieved the "gold standard" by nailing this full distance in the time originally conceived by the fools who conjured up this challenge!

Lars Finanger
Odyssey SwimRun
Last edited by: VALHALLA: Oct 14, 20 4:38
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Re: Marathon Squared Challenge [devashish_paul] [ In reply to ]
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This was a trial run and to see if anyone could complete the challenge that has been out there for a decade. Matt was the first male to complete it and I’m certain Lisa would have been able to do it under different conditions. But we are still waiting for the first female to go Sub 3 / Sub 3.

Right now, we’ve been talking about the 10k/26.2, a 5k/13.1 and a relay division for the next one. The date is looking like October 3, 2021. But we are still in the early planning stages.

Justin could have gone Sub 3 / Sub 3, but none of us were expecting the weather on that day. That’s Texas for you. I think Lisa is capable of sub 3 on the swim, but Arizona with Covid has been difficult to train the swim and she’s run Sub 3 in plenty of IMs. My feel for the swim in relation to IM swim times is you could probably go sub 3 if you go a 1:05-1:10 Ironman swim depending on the conditions of the day. For the run, I’m guessing 2:50-ish would be sufficient. I’ve got all of the, lines up to do podcast interviews and if there are any specific questions you’d like asked, please let me know.

Tim

http://www.magnoliamasters.com
http://www.snappingtortuga.com
http://www.swimeasyspeed.com
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Re: Marathon Squared Challenge [SnappingT] [ In reply to ]
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It seems this challenge defines no time period between events. Can an athlete do this in under 6 hours including transition time?
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Re: Marathon Squared Challenge [synthetic] [ In reply to ]
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We did it back to back, so Matt went sub 3 on the swim, sub 3 on the run and then sub 6 for the whole thing including transition. I’m going to launch a records database in a couple of weeks that will list Sub 3 / Sub 3 / Sub 6 in a single day, Sub 3 / Sub 3 in a single day (with transition more than sub 6) and finally Sub 3 / Sub 3 if you can prove you did it over your lifetime in stand alone events.

http://www.magnoliamasters.com
http://www.snappingtortuga.com
http://www.swimeasyspeed.com
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Re: Marathon Squared Challenge [SnappingT] [ In reply to ]
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I was thinking, for no particular reason, you could also track sub 6 for the event. IE for some loser swimmer who swims 2:30 and runs 3:25.

We talked about this but Tim I am glad you did this. We cannot keep the world moving by ourselves, but we can do our little part.
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Re: Marathon Squared Challenge [ajthomas] [ In reply to ]
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ajthomas wrote:
I was thinking, for no particular reason, you could also track sub 6 for the event. IE for some loser swimmer who swims 2:30 and runs 3:25.

We talked about this but Tim I am glad you did this. We cannot keep the world moving by ourselves, but we can do our little part.

I think I could have been close to that "loser swimmer" in my 20s or 30s, as I swam 2:40 for the USMS 10K in the pool several times, and ran 1:32 for the half mary at the end of a couple of 70.3s. We need "age-adjusted" goals for those of us who are, ahem, a few years over 40. Maybe say sub-3:30/sub-7 for 50-something men and sub-4/sub-8 for 60 something males. I'll leave it to the women to chime in on their standards for over 50/60. OTOH, in a sense "goal times" don't have that much meaning IMO as I've always simply tried to go the best time I could on the given day.


"Anyone can be who they want to be IF they have the HUNGER and the DRIVE."
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Re: Marathon Squared Challenge [ericmulk] [ In reply to ]
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ericmulk wrote:
ajthomas wrote:
I was thinking, for no particular reason, you could also track sub 6 for the event. IE for some loser swimmer who swims 2:30 and runs 3:25.

We talked about this but Tim I am glad you did this. We cannot keep the world moving by ourselves, but we can do our little part.


I think I could have been close to that "loser swimmer" in my 20s or 30s, as I swam 2:40 for the USMS 10K in the pool several times, and ran 1:32 for the half mary at the end of a couple of 70.3s. We need "age-adjusted" goals for those of us who are, ahem, a few years over 40. Maybe say sub-3:30/sub-7 for 50-something men and sub-4/sub-8 for 60 something males. I'll leave it to the women to chime in on their standards for over 50/60. OTOH, in a sense "goal times" don't have that much meaning IMO as I've always simply tried to go the best time I could on the given day.

Hey Ericmulk, I will be 55 in a few days and was thinking that sub 7 could be in the range. I think I would be more like 3 hrs swim + 4 hrs run. But I am not sure how badly the swim depletes me and maybe it ends up being a 5 hrs run-walk.
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Re: Marathon Squared Challenge [ericmulk] [ In reply to ]
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The event going forward will be less about the sub 3 / sub 3 and just more about the race. I'm thinking the cut off time for completion will be somewhere in the 9-10 hour range. It'll be challenging and let people know they need to respect the distance. Athletes will need to train for the 10k swim. But always open to input from athletes.

http://www.magnoliamasters.com
http://www.snappingtortuga.com
http://www.swimeasyspeed.com
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Re: Marathon Squared Challenge [ajthomas] [ In reply to ]
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So you're saying track the "almosts" I think you could do something like that at an awards ceremony kind of like how Ironman will highlight the athlete with the longest transition time. You could highlight the athlete who came the closest to sub 3 / sub 3.

It was a fun weekend and thanks for the kick in the ass to get it going.

Tim

http://www.magnoliamasters.com
http://www.snappingtortuga.com
http://www.swimeasyspeed.com
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