Nothing about this suggests the sponsorship is in any danger. Doesn't even mention it. It's a car review by a car reviewer who sounds like he's never been to Asia or been in a factory ("lunch at 10am?!").

And if the trainwreck that was Tesla during its early days can become successful in the US, so can VinFast. I would never bet against the deep pockets of an Asian conglomerate even if their first models aren't perfect. They only started selling cars in 2019. But that's a topic for car forums, anyway.

I don't feel like I got a true review towards the car as much as he talked about hating the trip and the vehicles. He also doesn't seem to understand electric vehicles so I wonder what he's directly comparing his actual driving experience too? For instance, it might not be the engineers limiting peak horse power. That might be limited by battery efficiency loss due to them heating up during operation. The engineer could've explained that as well and perhaps discussed other battery manufacturers they are testing or program updates being written? I'm not giving Vinfast a valid excuse as they need to figure it out, but he doesn't seem to understand what questions to ask (doesn't understand electric vehicles).

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http://www.sfuelsgolonger.com

I know bashing Ironman has become a popular pastime around this forum, but this is a serious reach. You’re grasping for straws.

The Car and Driver article on the pre-production models was a bit more muted by comparison. Still issues, but more on the fit/finish side (e.g., seat controls were reversed) versus ride, handling, and power delivery.

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Editor-in-Chief, Slowtwitch.com | Twitter

I haven't read Jalopnik or any of the other Deadspin-family sites in years. Thanks for the link. I very much enjoyed the article and the writer -- he seems to be a recent grad and comfortable mixing reviews of the automotive world, narrative, reporting, and cultural criticism. It looks like we get a healthy dose of all of these in the Jalopnik article. (If it seems odd that I poked around about this writer: I teach writing at The University of Illinois, and when I looked at his brief bio I saw that he's an OSU grad. I got a little curious about him because he is on a path I hope many of my students will follow and read a couple of stories. I thought they were pretty cool. Were they by-the-numbers reviews? No. But I liked the writing).

Lots of other reviews of this product are positive, or at least optimistic, by the way, and echo this article's main observations about the ambition and unfinished nature of the car, if in another mood.

Andrew Moss

If Coca-Cola were having PR / financial problems, would you be criticising the FIFA World Cup? I guess not, you'd be focusing on the corruption.

Same for IM - focus on the bad event management, lack of respect to athletes and pure money-driven decision making. Leave the sponsor's issues for the sponsor itself.

If you have been around a while, IM has a history of being bad for sponsorships. They don’t last. It’s a kiss of death.

I just think that this savior of a company (or at least that’s how it’s was presented in Kona) is a well funded train wreck so far.

Triathletes are early adopters, but I believe it’s quality over quantity. Who here would choose a VinFast over a Tesla. Not me

I mean it sounds like Vingroup is loaded and really want to get cars into the US, so no matter if the car sucks or not I think they'll continue dumping money to try and get success here. Doesn't sound like a problem to me, but maybe they'll bail at the first sign of failure.

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My Strava | My Instagram | Summerville, SC | 35-39 AG | 4:41 (70.3), 10:05 (140.6) | 3x70.3, 1x140.6 | Cat 2 Cyclist

To be fair, it's slightly amusing to watch the FTX fallout, like with the Golden State Warriors.

I'd choose one over a Tesla. But that's because I refuse to give dollars to Elon. And those cars *still* have fit/finish/quality issues.

But we'd probably look at a VW iD.4 or a Mustang Mach-E first.

I'm reserving judgment on a VinFast until they get a fully vetted production model out to the U.S.

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Editor-in-Chief, Slowtwitch.com | Twitter

If you have been around a while, IM has a history of being bad for sponsorships. They don’t last. It’s a kiss of death.//

Most sports title sponsors are not meant to be forever, so getting a few good years out of the companies is not that uncommon. As for kiss of death, I think Budweiser, Ford, Gatorade, and a few others would say they are doing just fine. But you are right in that some of the endemic sponsors have overreached and never gotten their monies worth. Got too caught up in the we won mentality, and never really penciled out the numbers of what success would or should look like. This latest sponsor seems to have come on board very early in their lifecycle, so will have to wait it out and see if it was a good or bad decision for them..

My take away was, "We flew 6000 miles for hookers and fine wine but instead were expected to test cars. Then we tried to go into town for hookers and fine wine but they stared at us and told us to return to the compound. This company is horrible."

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http://www.sfuelsgolonger.com

I never even knew Vinfast were electric cars up until this article! A big miss on the marketing side, but now that we are in the market for one a they will be considered

I came across Vinfast a while and was really unimpressed.

Aesthetics were meh, pricing was wierd and I was deeply suspicious of an EV maker coming out with full size SUV's when none of the other major automakers had done that yet.

We're you sleeping during Kona coverage? Lol

No, saw all the advertising but just don't recall them saying anything about being electric?

My mistake. I read your post with emphasis on "cars" instead of "electric." I knew they were electric but not sure how much that was emphasized. To your point, seems they didn't emphasize it enough then.

My wife refuses to give money to Elon, so I just got in the queue for an ID4, but really I want the ID3 which won't be sold in North America (bummer)

We're driving the Mrs. Sportwagen 4Motion (nickname: Angela, after the PM) until we get done paying off ST Tundra Division's truck -- we're not doing two car payments again, and considering the truck is currently no interest, there's zero reason for me to get in advance of that.

But something with about 300-350 miles of range and roughly the same size would be perfect.

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Editor-in-Chief, Slowtwitch.com | Twitter

The e-tron has been a pretty good success for Audi since 2019. The Rivian R1T and Hummer look pretty good too 😀.

I watched the coverage last night on YouTube. The VinFast advertisements do not specifically mention that they are electric cars.

Here another article that pretty much echoes the impressions in the OP - https://www.motortrend.com/...w-coming-to-america/

A $55k EV without the battery being included for the price? Clearly going after the market segment with the luxury beliefs.

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Next races on the schedule: none at the moment

This is true...

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E-DUB
Chief Janitor @Slowtwitch
Life is short. Dont be mad all the time.

We have had our Tesla since 2018. Zero problems with 35k miles. Upkeep has been replacing a cabin filter. Like most things, you hear about problems (like Ironman lately) but don’t hear about the thousands of very happy customers! But the best thing about Tesla is the number and placement or Supercharging stations.
We did buy ours before Elon was Elon. So you have a great point there!
I hope VinFast does well. I think many companies will step up. Charging infrastructure must be addressed for non Teslas.

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Team Zoot So Cal

Hopefully Tesla will just open up theirs, as they keep saying they'll do.

I hope not. They are busy enough with just Teslas. Competition would be good too. Elon doesn’t need a monopoly.

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Team Zoot So Cal

https://www.sportingnews.com/...obzqhm3jfhydzdrvfoam

Sponsorships aren’t like they used to be ?

Companies want money not a good product or partnership. Money or any money willing .

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Technique will always last longer then energy production. Improve biomechanics, improve performance.
http://Www.anthonytoth.ca, triathletetoth@twitter

"Who here would choose a VinFast over a Tesla."
-------------------------------------
Is that really the right question? I have a Tesla X and am very happy. My wife and I did enjoy looking at the Vinfast in Hawaii and were impressed. Of course we did not drive it. We look forward to them being available where we are so we can try one.


Your title to this thread, in my opinion, really pretty misleading. Coming out of Covid it appears IM is doing a fairly nice job with sponsors. Of course sponsors rotate off and evolve over time, but that is sort of the nature of the game.

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David
* Ironman for Life! (Blog) * IM Everyday Hero Video * Daggett Shuler Law *
Disclaimer: I have personal and professional relationships with many athletes, vendors, and organizations in the triathlon world.

David, go back and tell me the history of Ironman sponsors from title to swim, bike , and run. Then ask ur question

That really doesn’t make much sense either. Roka, Ventum, and Hoka have a pretty good stretch going. Their presence at the races is impressive also. Then, they have Wahoo, Hyperice, TBT, and many more some of them have been around a decade or more. I don’t think you understand this business.

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David
* Ironman for Life! (Blog) * IM Everyday Hero Video * Daggett Shuler Law *
Disclaimer: I have personal and professional relationships with many athletes, vendors, and organizations in the triathlon world.

That’s not history. But ok.

Ironman sponsorship deals have been awful and have never benefited the companies. Only IM.

Of the products u names. What do you use and is it a result or IM?

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http://www.TriScottsdale.org

You're incorrect. In every sense the sponsorship deals have actually not benefitted Ironman as the partners seem to self-combust. I'm gonna guess that the SuperSapiens deal was actually multi-year agreement that had FDA approval for US sales written in as a requirement. If anything it is more that the sponsorships haven't really benefited Ironman because the partnerships don't last multiple years. If you think VinFast didn't get more in return than what they paid for you have no idea how sports partnerships work.

It also shows where Ironman is as a sports property that they're stuck with challenger brands and not with endemic brands. But I think WTC makes plenty of cash hand over fist with endemic brands through Rock n Roll Marathon.

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Washed up footy player turned Triathlete.

You continue to either be obstinate or have no clue how sports sponsorships (or marketing in general) works.

To answer you question, I think I have everything but a Ventum covered.

By the way, do you ever do business with Datev? If not, how in the world does Roth continue to exist?

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David
* Ironman for Life! (Blog) * IM Everyday Hero Video * Daggett Shuler Law *
Disclaimer: I have personal and professional relationships with many athletes, vendors, and organizations in the triathlon world.

In Canada Subaru has sponsered the Ironman events for something like 20 years going back to Ironman Canada Penticton. It has lasted forever. Athletes have been getting discounts on Subarus through that time too. Subaru just got pushed out of Canadian race rights because of the Vinfast global deal. It was a massive "loss" over here because Subaru has been synonymous with the Canadian races.

I am interested in seeing what Vinfast brings to the market in Canada. So far we can't get anything, but that is par for the course with all brands. It is unlikely I will buy one though as I don't find any of the models particularly compelling for my needs.

I went with BYD. But I understand that's not an option in the US (yet).

Anybody notice that Adidas’s World Cup sponsorship tagline is “Impossible is Nothing”, a double negative version of the familiar “Anything is Possible”

In Adidas’s case, it relates to footballers worth hundreds of millions of dollars. Not the 30 lbs overweight dentist with $10,000 to spend on a bike

Vinfast making up for the coming sin of destroying the bike riding in the area of NC they are building. That is my take. They stand to ruin that area for a ton of people.

Me too - my Model Y has been perfect - and I also gave "old Elon" my money not the "new Elon".

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____________________________________

Are you ready to do an Ultraman? | How I calculate Ironman race fueling | Strength Training for Athletes |

Just read on my business feed today that Vinfast got the approval to sell cars now in the US, first ones coming next month it looks like. Anyone going to take a flier, or watch and see how they go first??

First review from a real EV specialist who also turned down the free holiday. Seeing as VinFast has the resources to send journos and influencers on costly and environmentally-wasteful junkets, I would guess they are good for standing behind they’re Ironman sponsorship. However, not looking promising for their actual product. Meanwhile, people can hate on Musk all they like, but between the fresh Tesla price cuts and the new tax credits, people in the US can now get a great price for an MYLR having good practicality and performance, class-leading efficiency and crash safety, excellent charging network, low running costs, and that is the most American-made vehicle on the market…

Making production cars at a profit is hard. This far into production Tesla's poor build quality and shoddy dangerous self driving experiment show that. Vinfast is just suffering the same pangs as 10 other EV start-ups before them.

Even Tesla is entirely propped up by governmental subsidies (e.g. carbon credits) for any profit at all. Their newest models are still old, and in many ways falling behind new models from Hyundai, Ford, Mercedes, VW et al. Their CEO is cosplaying as a TechBro Brewster's Millions reenactment, and the stock price has absolutely tanked.

If you can get past supporting Elon Musk with your money, buying a Tesla is based on two things logically- the battery pack/motor combination (still one of the best, only behind Lucid now) and the Supercharger network in the US (still unmatched).

I'm no Tesla fan, but while this may have been true years ago, I don't think it is any longer. In 2021 (haven't seen 2022 #'s yet), Tesla sold about $1.5B in carbon credits. In 2021 Tesla had ~$5.5B in profit off ~$53.8B in revenue. (source). So in 2021 the credits were about 3% of all revenue and about 28% of profit. Significant for sure, but it sure seems like the bulk of their revenue and profit comes from selling cars.

Also, I wouldn't call carbon credits a direct subsidy. Tesla (or any company) gets them from the government for free. And then sells them to other companies. Outside of government administrative costs, the "taxpayer" does not pay for the credits. The consumers of the companies who buy credits ultimately pay the cost. There are other direct subsidies for EVs, e.g. the direct consumer tax credits.

I know Vinfast is mostly marketing their EVs. But I would say they're not an EV Startup. They're a startup for sure. But they produce "luxury" internal combustion vehicles as well.

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Washed up footy player turned Triathlete.

VinFast planned to stop manufacturing ICE vehicles at the end of 2022.

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Janyne

I was just reading that Vinfast has gone public and are now "valued" at more than Ford.
VinFast: Vietnam EV maker valued at more than Ford or GM - BBC News

Reading the article it seems a back door, dodgy way to go public.

Good on them for continuing to sponsor IM.

The stock is super thinly traded (due to the founder owning almost all the outstanding shares) and will probably be extremely volatile.

The biggest issue Vinfast has is that its offerings pale against the competition. They are opening a showroom here in Stanford mall, right by the Tesla one. Right now the choice is ridiculously easy.

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ECMGN Therapy Silicon Valley:
Depression, Neurocognitive problems, Dementias (Testing and Evaluation), Trauma and PTSD, Traumatic Brain Injury (TBI)

A SPAC is - or was, until recently - a fairly standard way of going public for growing tech companies. It has a number of advantages, such as the fact that you're allowed to release forecasts (whereas in a standard IPO, at least in the U.S., it's forbidden and you can only show historical financials).

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"FTP is a bit 2015, don't you think?" - Gustav Iden

I was more surprised that company that wants to sell a mainstream item appears to be using IM as it's introductory marketing campaign in one of the most important markets - the US. I would think their are better ways to reach middle america that they hope to sell to. Unless they are planning a future tie in of the brand by comparing it to the IM itself as a form of car reliability, etc.

Just saw this article about Vinfast. Time will tell if the company succeeds or not.

Tycoon’s Fortune Soars $39 Billion on Eyebrow-Raising SPAC (msn.com)

yup, huge jump, worth more than F or VW, insanity

https://www.cnn.com/2023/08/16/investing/vietnam-vinfast-stock-nasdaq-listing-intl-hnk/index.html


Hong KongCNN —
One of Vietnam’s biggest automakers has made a big splash on its entry to Wall Street, pushing its market capitalization above that of industry giants such as Volkswagen and Ford.
VinFast, an electric vehicle maker, enjoyed a red-hot debut in New York on Tuesday after merging with a special purpose acquisition company (SPAC), Black Spade Acquisition Co.
Shares of the newly combined company skyrocketed 270% on the Nasdaq on their first day of trade. They opened at $22, more than double the initial price of $10, and closed at $37 apiece.
ADVERTISING
The surge propelled VinFast’s market cap above $85 billion. That’s more than Volkswagen (VLKAF) or Ford (F), which are valued at 63.9 billion euros ($69.7 billion) and $48 billion, respectively, according to Refinitiv.
The eye-popping rally, however, was based on thin trade. VinFast is still 99% owned by Vietnam’s richest man, Pham Nhat Vuong, through shares held by his other company Vingroup and other business entities, according to a regulatory filing.

VinFast began trading on the Nasdaq Tuesday.
VinFast/Handout
Vuong, the chairman of both Vingroup and VinFast, saw his own wealth soar by approximately $39 billion on Tuesday as shares of the carmaker shot up, according to the Bloomberg Billionaires index. He is now estimated to be worth about $44.3 billion.
VinFast was founded in 2017 as a subsidiary of Vingroup, one of Vietnam’s largest conglomerates. The firm makes electric SUVs, scooters and buses, which are sold in Vietnam and North America.
Its performance Tuesday makes VinFast the largest US-listed Vietnamese company by market cap, it said.
In a statement, CEO Thuy Le said: “It is our hope that VinFast’s listing will inspire and unleash greater opportunities for Vietnamese brands to participate in the global market.”
Chilly US reception
So far, the company has released four electric vehicle models and delivered roughly 19,000 vehicles, according to its prospectus. For comparison, Volkswagen sold 4.4 million vehicles just in the first six months of 2023, more than 321,000 of which were electric.
VinFast is a household name in Vietnam, where its cars have become bestsellers and have access to an extensive charging network across more than 60 cities and provinces.
But the Vietnamese newcomer has had less success in the United States, where it started delivering to customers earlier this year.
In recent months, VinFast has been hit by poor reviews about its electric SUV, the VF 8, after letting US reporters test drive the vehicle.
Several headlines have been particularly blunt, with one by industry outlet Road & Track calling the vehicle “simply unacceptable.” Another by MotorTrend read: “Return to sender.”
Other reviews were more forgiving. One reminded readers that it was the company’s first effort at a car for the US market. Another praised the power delivery from the SUV’s electric motors.
In a blog post earlier this week, VinFast said it has made software improvements based on feedback “from vehicle owners and the automotive reviewer community.”
VinFast has made no secret of its global ambitions. In July, it broke ground on a new factory in North Carolina, which it hopes to use as a base for US sales. The company says the facility may eventually reach capacity of 150,000 vehicles a year.
The company has also teased a Europe launch, telling shareholders it will enter the region “soon.”
In her statement Tuesday, Le suggested the company will use the new proceeds raised to fuel its expansion, saying its listing “unlocks access to the capital markets and important avenues for future development.”
VinFast is not profitable yet. It reported a loss of $1.4 billion for the nine months through last September. It also carried about $2.5 billion in debt as of the end of September, according to a regulatory filing.

Everyone wants in on the next Tesla. Looks like a great stock to short.

No sooner do I write that and I checked the exchange and it's already down 18%. I'm guessing it will drop more than 50% in the next days.

Many of the EV Stocks that did a surge at IPO via SPAC or otherwise have struggled....Arrival, Canoo, Rivian etc. At least Rivian got a production line up and running, and is delivering to Amazon and some consumers, Vinfast is available elsewhere in the world, so they know how to ramp a production line, which we can't really say Arrival did (or at least they failed to raise enough capital at SPAC time to build enough runway to get to early market supply capabilities. I really do hope that Vinfast can pull it off (I have a vested interest for the entire sector to be successful in my professional life, beyond IM having a solid title sponsor). But having a market higher than VW seems to be insane. The ID4 and ID3 are doing reasonably well in Europe (even though we can't get ID3 in North America and ID4 is a year backlog in places and ID-GTI seems to be three years away)

I think this VF5 looks like an interesting vehicle (spoke with a guy about smaller EV's in the Canadian market and they said it may be comeing), but mainly an urban commuter with a sub 40kWh battery from what I read.

This sure doesn't look like the new Tesla, have you guys seen the reviews?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DF7kaLTsNHQ&ab_channel=Donut


I think the very first Tesla Roadster 15 years ago was a higher quality and more capable car, that's a lot of ground to make up while everyone else in the market charges ahead.

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Professional Athlete: http://jordancheyne.wordpress.com/ http://www.strava.com/athletes/145340

Coaching Services:http://www.peakformcoaching.com/

The whole SPAC craze is wild. Hopefully that stuff ends, the SPAC bubble in sports was pretty incomprehensible.

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Washed up footy player turned Triathlete.

Oh it's garbage compared to Tesla. I'm just saying there's a lot of investors that want in on the next overvalued stock.

Marques reviews the VF8

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AJUqu8ilqO8

Not good it seems....

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Regards, Richard
3D Bits and Pieces - https://www.printables.com/@thetrickster_793480

Yes, advantage is that you can put bs that'd never fly in an S-1.

Advantage for who though? Hmm...

SPACs are a backdoor for companies with inflated valuations that would not fare well in the traditional IPO process. It's no coincidence that as a group, these companies underperform once public.

Comparing these returns to benchmark indices, the average post-merger SPAC underperformed against the Nasdaq by 44% and underperformed against the Russell 2000 by 51%. The average post-merger SPAC during this period underperformed the average traditional IPO by 26%.Feb 14, 2023 - Yale Journal on Regulation.

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ECMGN Therapy Silicon Valley:
Depression, Neurocognitive problems, Dementias (Testing and Evaluation), Trauma and PTSD, Traumatic Brain Injury (TBI)

The people who make off like bandits are the SPAC holdco shareholders. The opco that merges into the SPAC gets all blurry eyed, but its management and sharholders always take a haircut in the hope of early liquidity, but then they are stuck with a roadmap that they have to deliver on in 4-8 quarters which is almost impossible. All the recent EV SPACs just did not raise enough capital at the merger event to get to the other end of 6-8 quarters without having to raise. Arrival was probably the worst where even after the merger event, the original founder had over 85% of the company, but built up insuffcient cash reserve to actually build electric vans. It looks like Canoo (GEOV) is buying up a bunch of their manufacturing assets originally planned for their "innvative" microfactory. Proterra is dead (Electric buses) and Chargepoint is quarters from running out of cash.

In terms of building brand awareness, for Vinfast, Ironman sees like a good global property to ride with for relatively cheap to get awareness up. They could try and replace Abbot with the world marathon majors to get their name our globally, or do like Emirates and Qatar airways and sponsor a British Football club to get the name our globally. Ironman seems like a cheap way to get the name out there keeping in mind that Ironman has presence whre Vinfast is already strong.

Vinfast sold 35,000 cars last year and only 1,000 in the US. 4th qtr loss was $650 billion. Market cap is less than $12 billion - not long before the vultures start circling.

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Andrew Inkpen

Ya, I don't get the people bashing the IM association. Like you say, probably the best marketing money they've spent is association their brand with Ironman. Not saying their actual marketing is good... but at least IM gives them some sustained brand recognition.

The real issue is they've got a mediocre product in a product category that doesn't really make a sense for most consumers.

And from the sales numbers quoted here it sounds like they didn't even bother to hire a sales team?

Yeah just, too many new electric car companies to pick from. Heck if I know just seems a bit saturated.

Another Vinfast article came across my radar today:
https://hntrbrk.com/...ing-on-with-vinfast/

"Most VinFast cars sold to taxi and real estate companies owned by its parent company Vingroup or CEO"

"In the first quarter of 2024, the company reported a total of 9,689 EV deliveries — a decrease of 28% from the previous quarter. More than half those deliveries were to other Vingroup companies."

“Whereas I don’t know of anybody that would even remotely consider a VinFast.”
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Heh, with that last quote, I guess they didn't interview any Ironman athletes :)

You missed my favorite line from that article!

Out of the 3,118 EVs the company shipped to the U.S. last year, only 265 VinFast vehicle registrations — a common proxy for estimating car sales — were recorded across the U.S. in 2023, according to an S&P report.

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Janyne

I hope the mortal hydration implosion happens at a faster rate

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IG - @ryanppax
http://www.geluminati.com
Use code ST5 for $5 off your order